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-   -   DEEP and FAST nymph rigs? (http://www.theflyfishingforum.com/forums/coldwater-fly-fishing/2430-deep-fast-nymph-rigs.html)

Fishplease 08-31-2007 08:31 PM

DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
Well sunday I took my annual trip to gunpowder falls where the water was somewhat high and incredibly fast. Fast as in, almost impossible to walk upstream in 1 foot of water. I saw a lot of deep deep pools, like 5+ feet deep where I kept seeing movement.
I tried a size 14 copper john with a small steel shot, and it only made it 2 feet under before the current carried it past the pool.
I only got 30 minutes of fishing in otherwise, cause people in canoes, kayaks, and float tubes kept coming bye every few minutes.

So my question is, whats a good nymph rig for deep and fast water?
I used a size 14 weighted hares ear on a 9 foot leader.
My set up is:
8'6 5wt redington crosswater
Cabelas prestige wf floating line
Hobbs creek large arbor

hardhat 09-01-2007 12:16 AM

Re: DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
Try a tungsten bead head or add some tungsten weight like "mojo mudd". Also, and I am sure you do this, make sure to properly mend the line. Lastly try casting up stream.

hardhat 09-01-2007 01:12 AM

Re: DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
I forgot to add try using a longer tippet.

tie one on 09-01-2007 11:30 AM

Re: DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
Have you considered using a weighted fly line ?
There are several ways this can be accomplished, if it maybe
of interest.

1. Buy a weighted line at your local fly shop. Only drawback
is that you better off having a second spool for your reel
so you can have a weighted on one floating on the other.

2. Buy a simple add-on weighted line. They come in a packet &
attach via a loop to the end of your floating line. Easy on,
easy off. The also come in various sink rates.

I also have had that problem of fast current & not enough
weight to get the fly down to the fish. I opted for the two
spools. Much easier to take both out on the water & than a
simple switch gives me more options.

Tie One On

Frank Whiton 09-01-2007 03:22 PM

Re: DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
Hi Fishplease,

That sounds like a bad situation. Sometimes it is best to just come back another day. Here is what I would do. You need some heavy weight to sink quickly and a good indicator. I would start with a couple of BB or even 3/0 split shot. Your fly should also be weighted. When using a lot of shot on a nymph setup I loop the tippet onto the end of the leader. I put the shot on the loop just above the knot. This keeps the shot from sliding down toward the fly. If you are using a leader with no knot on the tippet you can wrap the leader around the shot before you crimp it. That is: you lay the leader into the open slot and then wrap the leader around the shot once before you crimp it. The wrap-around will keep the shot from sliding down the leader. You need to cast up and across the currant using a reach cast. The further up stream you cast the quicker and deeper it will sink. If you cast too far up stream the fly and shot will be washed onto the bottom and you will get hung up. After you have figured out how far up stream to cast you adjust your position so the fly is sinking and covering the water you want to fish. You will have to mend the line as it passes your position. The reach cast will give you a good mend to start with.

The other approach is with a sink tip line but it will have to be a rocket line to get it down quickly. I have found that I prefer slower water to fish a sink tip line. One problem with a sink tip line in fast water is you have a lot of fly line in the water and it is hard to tell what your fly is doing.

Fishplease 09-01-2007 07:26 PM

Re: DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
K thanks for all the help so far.
I heard its better to go there when the it starts getting colder so people arent boating and swimming there.
I'll do some research online tonight on weights and edit my findings into here.
But Frank, I make a knot in the leader ANY time I use a shot. I can't stand when the shot slides down the line. Be it fly or spin.

Frank Whiton 09-02-2007 03:25 PM

Re: DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
Hi Fishplease,

What knot do you use in the tippet to stop the split shot?

Fishplease 09-02-2007 07:50 PM

Re: DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
Well typically I have about 2 feet of tippet where I attach my shot above the knot where I attached it to my leader.
I use a double surgeon's knot.

I will probably stock up on some 6x 9ft leaders and attach 2 feet of tippet for reaching deeper pools. Also the tippet can stop shots from sliding for me.

Frank Whiton 09-03-2007 10:11 AM

Re: DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
Hi Fishplease,

You might want to consider getting 5X leaders and then add the 2ft of 6X. This gives you the flexibility of having the 5X for fishing a little larger fly but you can still drop down to a liter tippet if the fishing conditions call for it. Since you stated you are adding the 24" of tippet for deeper water that tells me you are fishing subsurface. You don't need as light of a leader when fishing subsurface. You could probably get by with a 4X just as well as a 6X.

BigCliff 09-04-2007 08:22 AM

Re: DEEP and FAST nymph rigs?
 
What you found is a perfect application for one of my favorite nymphing rigs: the "bounce nymph rig". I learned of this set-up from an article Larry Tullis wrote a while back, Bounce Nymphing and I've mentioned it many times on this board. (search function will get you lots of info)

It goes like this: start out with your normal leader, add 2-3' of tippet one size weaker than your leader, and tie the knot so the tag pointing away from your fly line is left 6-7" long. (this is where your fly will go, unweighted nymphs work best.) Out at the far end of that tippet you tied on, tie a stopper knot, this will be to keep your split shot in place. You'll want to use multiple small shot. (forms a skinnier weight that will snake through stuff on the bottom where big shot would hang up.)

Fishing this rig also goes a bit different than a normal nymph, shot, and indicator rig. Your indicator will be jumping around quite a bit, as your weight is connecting with the bottom. You'll have to learn what movement of the indicator means a strike, and when its just bouncing on the bottom. Your indicator will also be moving slower than the current, as the bouncing slows it down.

For a better explanation, consult the article. Its the best source of info, I just wanted to add some tips from my own experience.


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