[ffffg]

im fishing for spawners in the 22-24 inch range. im using a float on a dry line leader with leach dropping down 4 feet and deeper according to conditions. the hook im using is a number 8 4xlong 2x strong.. im loosing about 60 percent of my sets.. they will fight for a couple seconds and be off.. i keep the drag very light and set the hook as fast as possible when the float goes down.... it seems the longer they are on, the better they are hooked... most of the fish are obviously trying to spit it out as fast as they take it.. any suggestions on how to get more of my hits in the net? im about to try a number 4 bait hook with a twisted (offset tip) .. . thanks dave..

[BigCliff]

Didn't hear any mention of sharpening your hook. If you're not, I strongly recommend that you do.

Another option is to use a "strip-set". This is done by stripping the line hard with your left hand to set the hook into the jaw of those large trout. You can put much more power into the hookset this way comaperd to if you were swinging the rod. Its standard practice when fishing for large bass and saltwater fish, and should work well on those big trout too. Another advantage of setting the hook this way is the fact that you're only moving the fly a maximum of two feet, so the fish may have another chance at your fly. If you set the hook by swinging the rod, its very possible to move the fly ten feet away from the fish.

[Fish Bones]

Hello Dave:

This is not an uncommon problem. If you're losing 60% of your hook-ups then something has to be rectified. Pay attention to the following factors that can effect a proper hook set.

1. Hook Point: Make sure those puppies are very sharp and stay sharp. Sometimes even new hooks can use some extra sharpening. Get you one of those hook hones and use it often.

2. Hook Barb: This plays a huge roll in the hook set. The larger the barb, the harder it is to set the hook well. You may be better off de-barbing your hooks.

3. Line Control: Make sure that you don't have too much slack line in the water. The tighter the line, without effecting the drift, the better. If all your hook setting motion is doing is picking up slack line then setting the hook deep can be a problem.

4. Rod Stiffness: If you rod is a medium or fast action, you shouldn't have a problem here. Some slow action rods are so limber that they make it hard to get a good hookset.

5. Technique: Its hard to judge this without actually seeing you fish. Make sure your rod is not too high during the drift. Make sure you have good line control. If you hold the rod with your right hand, hold your fly line with your left hand. When you get a strike rais the rod tip straight up and bring your left hand straight down, while still holding the line, at the same time.

6. The Fight: Make sure you hold your rod straight up at a 90 degree angle while fighting the fish. Keep the line tight. Its important that the fish can turn and run if they want to. So... don't set your drag too tight. You want a 22-24 inch fish to able to pull line off of yor reel if need be. Don't try to "Hog'em In".

I'm sure there are probably a few more factors worth considering. This is just all I can think of right now. Play with these six and see how it goes.

[Salmo Nella]

Originally Posted by ffffg

im using a float on a dry line leader with leach dropping down 4 feet and deeper according to conditions. ..

You might try getting rid of the float and using a sink tip line instead. If the leach is 6 feet below the float, you need to move 4 feet of line before you start moving the leach and set the hook because of the sharp angle between line and fly created by the float. If this explanation doesn't make sense, try watching it happen in shallow water. Put the float out about 6 feet from you and let the leach sink. try moving the float a foot or two and see how little the leech moves and note that it moves up toward the float, not toward you. You cannot get a good hook set unless the fly is in line with your line.

[BigCliff]

I think salmo may have figured out your main problem. That float is keeping you from having a direct connection to the fly. You have to pull on the line long enough for the leader and line to form a straight line to what ever you're pulling with to set the hook. Using a sinking or sink tip line would do this even better, but just getting rid of that float and letting the weight of the leech pull down the tip of the fly line will help you have a much straighter connection to the fly. This will also reduce splash down each time you cast and reduce the chances of tangling on that float too.

I was basing most of that on the assumption that you are fishing the leech downstream like a streamer rather than upstream like a nymph. If you are fishing it upstream like a nymph and find that to work best, then the list of tips Steve gave you will work best. However, if you can, I think you'll hook more fishing casting across and downstream to those fish. Position the cast so that the fly has time to sink down to the fish and then reach upstream before the line settles down to the water. Hang on to the line as the fly drifts down to the fish, and be ready to strip set that hook if need be. The point of reaching is that it should give you a straighter connection to the fish when the fly gets to that spot. Here's an explanation of it http://www.frontrangeanglers.com/new.../reachcast.htm

[Paul D]

im fishing for spawners in the 22-24 inch range.

Maybe it's karma. I hope you're at least avoiding the rivers Montana deems off limits in the spring for spawning. My suggestions, power bait with a treble hook trailer. Set hard. Don't forget to sharpen your barbs.

[BigCliff]

Paul, Can you give us a mature explanation why ALL FOUR OF YOUR POSTS on this site have been personal attacks?

You absolutely have a right to let somebody know that you think fishing for spawners is a bad idea, but you should also try to discourage that with reasons why it is a bad idea, rather than by insulting them.

[Paul D]

Here is some information about spawning trout. While they dump them by the truck load in OK and TX, in MT where this poster is from, they are exclusively wild and a resource too valuable to take for granted. That, and fishing over reds is just plain tacky, even when it is legal. Surprised no one here thought to speak up. Oh well, pats on the back and mutual admiration all around. Buy some new stuff, apple pie and all that. I suppose Curtis will ban me again.

Spawning Trout (ref:http://www.fryingpananglers.com/arch...ing-trout.html)

In the autumn the brown trout spawn while the rainbows take their turn in the spring. The areas the trout spawn are readily identifiable and are know as "redds". The redds are generally saucer-shaped nests dug by the female or hen in the clean gravel lining the bottom of streams. The redd is created by the hen while lying on its side and rapidly beating its tail up-and-down to create a current which allows the current to move the gravel slightly downstream. Up to two males then move alongside the female and the eggs and sperm are deposited simultaneously into the redd. The female then moves to the upstream edge of the redd, again beating its tail on the stream bottom to create a current releasing more gravel to bury the eggs. After this process is done, the eggs are abandoned.

In the case of the browns, the eggs incubate through the winter, hatch during late winter, and the tiny fry emerge from the gravel during the first warm days of spring. This whole process is, of course, temperature dependent. The number of eggs produced depends on fish size. An 8-inch mature brown trout may spawn 200 eggs, while a 10-pound female might spawn over 8,000 eggs. With this in mind, it is important to allow the process to take place undisturbed.

The browns will tend to spawn for a few months in some spots. It is terribly bad form to fish to the spawning trout so keep an eye out for the redds and avoid them. The fish will tend to stack up down stream from the redds waiting to move in. If you see a fisherman near them who is unfamiliar with the sensitivity of the area, a kindly warning will not go astray.

Similarly with rainbows which spawn in the spring. The same considerations apply so watch out for the redds and steer clear to ensure that the trout have the best opportunity to spawn uninterrupted. There are enough natural predators and obstacles to the process without unnecessarily introducing more.

[Fish Bones]

Paul:

You make some excellent points regarding fishing for spawning fish. I'm sure your opinion is shared by many anglers. I appreciate you logging on and sharing your opinions with us. We welcome all points of view regardless of how controversial the topic may be.

However, this forum will never tolerate rude or insulting comments to other members. You can get your point across without verbally attacking other forum members. This has nothing at all to do with "mutual admiration"... it has everything to do with common courtesy and respect.

You have never been banned from this forum. But if anyone continually insults other members of this forum... they will be permanently banned. This is clearly stated in the forum rules.

[Curtis]

And to add to this, Paul. I seriously thought we had covered the issue of addressing people on here with respect. Before, when you were confronted on that you asked that your account be removed. I told you that we would prefer that you handle it yourself and become a part of the board and enjoy yourself. I thought that either you had decided to be civil or you had decided to just not come back. Again, I am hoping that you understand we cannot allow you to attack and belittle members. You are, as Steve pointed out, welcome and encouraged to give your opinion and dissenting voices are sometimes the ones with the best information that has not been considered. But if you cannot do it with respect, you will not be allowed to post.

Paul, we have had this board going for a while now. In that time we have had to ban absolutely nobody. We have had only a couple of issues come up and two of them have been with you. Enough is enough.