[plland]

Originally Posted by Pocono

As can be seen, there are a lot of votes on this poll for "other". Personallly, I think that fishing anything below a 7' 3 wt. is more of an academic exercise than a positive angling experience.

I know that there are those who enjoy being able to fish the 0's, 1's and 2's, but I would ask those who do whether they really think that they'd be disadvantaged if they were fishing a 3 wt. instead. In terms of very light and precise presentations; even in difficult to reach spots, I think that you can do it all with a good 3 wt.

I owned a 00wt Sage TXL for a while, and liked the way the rod casted and fished on lakes, but thought that the tip was too soft for the average small stream situation. When a fly gets caught in a clump of grass, or on the leaf of a shrub, I expect to be able to jerk the rod tip back and have the fly jump out of the snag. With the 00wt, all that would happen when I jerked the rod is the rod tip would bend, and bend, and bend some more. I had to crouch down and manually remove the fly, even if it was caught in something as weak as a blade of grass. If the snag happened to be a leaf in a shrub overhanging my target fish, then say good bye to any chances of success with that particular fish. Since the rod was fast action, it also was hard to aim a cast in a situation like that. At the time I didn't live next to a lot of lakes, mostly just fished small streams, so I switched to a 3wt for my main rod (currently use a Sage SLT 3wt 8'9", which has great versatility and power, and a TFO Finesse 3wt 7'9", which is better for tight situations). Although, now that I've moved into a place that's next to a lot of lakes loaded with bluegill, I wish I still had that 00wt TXL.

[OldMan]

Originally Posted by plland

I owned a 00wt Sage TXL for a while, and liked the way the rod casted and fished on lakes, but thought that the tip was too soft for the average small stream situation. When a fly gets caught in a clump of grass, or on the leaf of a shrub, I expect to be able to jerk the rod tip back and have the fly jump out of the snag. With the 00wt, all that would happen when I jerked the rod is the rod tip would bend, and bend, and bend some more. I had to crouch down and manually remove the fly, even if it was caught in something as weak as a blade of grass. If the snag happened to be a leaf in a shrub overhanging my target fish, then say good bye to any chances of success with that particular fish. Since the rod was fast action, it also was hard to aim a cast in a situation like that. At the time I didn't live next to a lot of lakes, mostly just fished small streams, so I switched to a 3wt for my main rod (currently use a Sage SLT 3wt 8'9", which has great versatility and power, and a TFO Finesse 3wt 7'9", which is better for tight situations). Although, now that I've moved into a place that's next to a lot of lakes loaded with bluegill, I wish I still had that 00wt TXL.

Why didn't you just point the TXL at the snag and pull the line?

[Pocono]

I just returned from Japan, where I was able to capture a weekend to go fishing up in the mountains Northeast of Tokyo for some very, very small native trout, called "Yamame" (salmonid species) and "Iwana" (char species).

These fish would normally be qualified by most anglers as "troutlets" or jack fish. They are small - 4"-8" is the normal size for these mountain stream native fish. They're thin, fast and easily spooked. The water is gin clear, the gradient is very steep; mostly pools and runs; typical pocket water fishing. But they're part of the Japanese flood control system, so you can imagine how steep the gradient on these small streams actually is!

In this narrow stream fishing, going after small fish, my Sage ZXL 4 piece 7'6" 3 wt. was perfect. At distances of 10-25 feet, it was fine. I was using 7x tippet, #16-18 flies and I never had a break-off, so the rod tip was up to the task. This, more than any other fishing experience that I've had, confirms to me that you really don't need to drop below a good 3 wt. for small stream fishing.

Now, if you want to drop below that, then that's everyone's perogative and I make no judgements as to whether it is better to drop down to lighter gear or not. I simply now know that it's not necessary to do so.

[OldMan]

Originally Posted by Pocono

I just returned from Japan, where I was able to capture a weekend to go fishing up in the mountains Northeast of Tokyo for some very, very small native trout, called "Yamame" (salmonid species) and "Iwana" (char species).

These fish would normally be qualified by most anglers as "troutlets" or jack fish. They are small - 4"-8" is the normal size for these mountain stream native fish. They're thin, fast and easily spooked. The water is gin clear, the gradient is very steep; mostly pools and runs; typical pocket water fishing. But they're part of the Japanese flood control system, so you can imagine how steep the gradient on these small streams actually is!

In this narrow stream fishing, going after small fish, my Sage ZXL 4 piece 7'6" 3 wt. was perfect. At distances of 10-25 feet, it was fine. I was using 7x tippet, #16-18 flies and I never had a break-off, so the rod tip was up to the task. This, more than any other fishing experience that I've had, confirms to me that you really don't need to drop below a good 3 wt. for small stream fishing.

Now, if you want to drop below that, then that's everyone's perogative and I make no judgements as to whether it is better to drop down to lighter gear or not. I simply now know that it's not necessary to do so.

I don't go under a 3wt either, but I know what the argument would be in your example. They would say those small fish would feel better on a lighter rod. Even a 000 wt rod could put all the pressure on a 7x tippet with such small fish. The pleasure of such a small rod is how light it feels in the hand, and the bend a small fish can put in it.

The real question is, can you put enough pressure on the fish to land him without exhausting him beyond recovery when you run into those 16"-18" fish? I've been amazed at the size of some fish that live in small streams.

I've tried so many small stream rods it makes my head spin. I can't even remember them all. I've finally settled on what I think works the best for me. It's a 7' 4wt bamboo. The soft tip makes up close casts a pleasure and makes smaller fish bend the rod pretty good. The stronger butt and 4 wt line helps cast bushy flies in the wind. Something that's pretty common in my fishing. With the right leader I can present a small fly as soft as a smaller rod. It's short enough to work on brushy streams, but can still get the line out when needed on the more open sections.

Everything is a compromise in rod choice unless you bring 5 rods to the stream. Going to one end or the other of what you need on the stream will get you in more trouble that picking a rod in the middle that will do everything pretty good.

My .02

[Pocono]

I'd say it's worth more than two cents, OldMan.

What I posted is strictly limited to what is physically necessary to hook and land small fish. The broader topic of choice is something that I never meant to try to fully addesss. Frankly, it's the choices in fishing that, I think, keep most of us returning to the stream; the search for the perfect match between the fish, the gear and the angler. That formula, as we all know fom just looking around at others, is different for almost every angler.

For me, it's not phycially necessary to drop below a 7' 3 wt; particularly if the rod is glass / not graphite. Having said that, I have to tell you that I frequently fish a 5'3" glass rod (vintage Fenwick FF535) rod which, coupled with a Martin MG-3, brings in a lot of fish in some of my favorite pocket water.

But, I have never ventured below a 3 wt.; nor do I intend to.

[tgoodwater2002]

I have the TFO signature series 2wt. that is 6ft. I love it. It is perfect for the small streams and really tight places. Alot of fun!!!

[reckless]

For all out fun light tackle fishing I have a 2wt St Croix. But sill prefer my 3wt Dreamcatcher bamboo to any other lightweight I have had in my hand.

[flyflingerandy]

I have a Cabela's LST 7'6" 2wt that I have caught trout to 18" on since I bought it, and this rod is flawless. I cannot think of one thing besides the cork that I would change. The action suits me, and I would urge you to check out this rod! When you have a nice sized fish on, the rod transmits the vibration of every headshake to your rod hand!

[docbluedevil]

Originally Posted by Troutwhisperer

Hi everbody,

I'm looking to buy a light weight rod and i was wondering what kind to buy. I prefur cortland rods but i know there are probably better ones for the price. If you chose other please tell me the rod you would suggest. My price range is anything below $250.

Thanks for your suggetions.

I'd recommend that you consider a fiberglass rod for a light line application. I exclusively fish 'glass in light line weights and fine them superior to graphite alternatives: better sensitivity, better tippet protection, mellow casting action.

Strongly consider the Lamiglas Spring Creek 6.6 ft 3 wt or 7.6 ft 4 wt, 2 pc rods for $240. Or consider used or vintage glass rods from the better makers (Phillipson, Scott, Orvis, Fenwick).

[mojo]

Originally Posted by docbluedevil

I'd recommend that you consider a fiberglass rod for a light line application. I exclusively fish 'glass in light line weights and fine them superior to graphite alternatives: better sensitivity, better tippet protection, mellow casting action.

Strongly consider the Lamiglas Spring Creek 6.6 ft 3 wt or 7.6 ft 4 wt, 2 pc rods for $240. Or consider used or vintage glass rods from the better makers (Phillipson, Scott, Orvis, Fenwick).

Told 'em Doc, they just ain't believers.

Except Andy and Joni