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bass_man 06-11-2010 07:55 AM

Over Hang Question
 
Being new I'm doing a lot of reading and there for having a lot of questions. If I'm understanding it right over hang is the amount of running line that is out side the rod tip top ring. Is there a right amount of running line that should be out side the rod end say like 2ft,4ft,6ft, and so on in order to help shoot line more effectively? Or am I not understanding this concept of over hang right. Let me say with your guys help over the past few weeks my casting has improved greatly, to the point were my wife is saying I think you my need to up grade to better gear, so please keep the help coming :thumbsup:.
Thanks
Mike

randyflycaster 06-11-2010 09:26 AM

Re: Over Hang Question
 
As your casting skill improves you'll be able to carry more overhang. However, if you go to a slower rod you'll have to decrease your overhang. Also, when you change lines you might have to change your overhang.

Too much overhang and you won't be able to generate enough line speed and your loop might not turn over. Too little overhang for the amount of casting power you use, you'll probably get a tailing loop and/or the front of your fly line might land in a ball.

Randy

wjc 06-11-2010 04:04 PM

Re: Over Hang Question
 
Bass Man,

Quote:

If I'm understanding it right over hang is the amount of running line that is out side the rod tip top ring.
Yes, more or less. It seemes that the term "overhang" is used more by people using shooting heads and very skinny running line (like monofilament). Generally speaking, most people using regular WF lines refer to the amount of line they are "carrying" or "aerializing" just prior to the final shoot. That includes head and running line.

Quote:

Is there a right amount of running line that should be out side the rod end say like 2ft,4ft,6ft, and so on in order to help shoot line more effectively?
No. In addition to differences in the line and rod as Randy said, the length will vary with the caster's style and wind conditions.

When I hear conversations (or rather read them) among competitive distance casters talking about how much line they are carrying they always mention the specific line. Sometimes the rod, but most of them know what rods the others cast, and the rod makes less difference at that level than the line. Here is a link to one such conversation where the original poster has the identical question as you.

You may note that only the original poster mentions the word "overhang". For that term to mean anything, the person you are asking the question of would have to know the head length of whatever line you are asking about. And then he'd have to subtract that length from however much line he carries.

iB::Topic::Rio Tournament

I can probably make that more confusing for you if you'd like.:D

Cheers,
Jim

randyflycaster 06-12-2010 12:45 AM

Re: Over Hang Question
 
I would say don't worry about carrying even close to 89 feet of line. The ED line is designed for casters to carry a lot of overhang.

Overhang is the amount of running line - the thinner part of the line right below the thicker head - that is outside the rod tip.

Randy

wjc 06-12-2010 08:05 AM

Re: Over Hang Question
 
Bass,

I wouldn't worry about the "overhang" at all, period. Unless you are throwing a specialized shooting head with super thin running line. I don't think "overhang" is a major issue to worry about. You will find the optimal length for your line, rod, casting style, and conditions by casting.

More important is to try different lines to find one you like for your rod, casting style and casting conditions/requirements. But don't make the mistake of thinking you have to cast the entire head to get it to shoot.

I lilke the Sci Anglers MED for salt water fishing for bonefish, and often do not even cast the entire head out of the end of the rod while fishing. Yet it shoots fine at a minus 30 foot or more "overhang". The head length on that particular 7 wt line is 72.4 feet.

In fact, that line and weight is the most popular line for the FFF Certification tests even though the longest (of three) different required accuracy targets is only 45 feet away, and the required distance cast is only 75' away.

So for the distance cast, subtracting the required 7 1/2 foot leader requirement and the length of the rod and arm, the total fly line presentation for the distance cast is 60 feet give or take. If the shoot was 10 feet, then the overhang was minus 22 feet or more.

In fact, the night before last, I caught a tarpon that rolled about 40' from the boat with a cast of about a minus fifteen to 17 foot "overhang" using a Rio 12 wt. line.

For me, the longer the head is, the easier it is for me to make good short presentations. So , I use a negative overhang when fishing for bonefish or tarpon much of the time.

I personally do not like the short heads for anything, including large bass bugs or 8" long flies. Other guys use nothing but short heads. But most of the talk I hear about them are from surf casters who cast the same distance nearly every single cast all day long using shooting heads, or bass popping guys who try to do the same thing.

To me, the short heads feel like I'm trying to cast a carriage bolt on long casts and not a fly line. They are too clunky for the type of fishing I do (in my hands). They are too heavy for soft short presentations and too heavy for really long presentations. Again, to me.

Fly fishing equipment is personal preference just like baseball bats. Some choke up some don't. Some prefer Al Kaline bats, others Jackie Robinson. Now that's dating myself I guess. Shouldn't have done that. :D

Just never turn down an opportunity to try someone else's setup, or to try out their line (with or without their reel) on your rod. Only you can determine what's best for you - and even that will change as you get more time on the rod handle.

Cheers,
Jim

randyflycaster 06-12-2010 11:05 AM

Re: Over Hang Question
 
Yes, generally with shooting heads a caster will carry a much shorter overhang.

Also, IMHO, casters using the "Lefty-Kreh style" of casting - a very open stance - are able to carry more overhang.

I used to have only 55 feet of line out, then I'd shoot some line on my last back cast, then make my presentation cast.

Finally, no caster is able to false cast back and forth their maximun overhang.
Once the maximun overhang is outside the rod tip it's time to make your presntation cast.

One more thing: some of these casters are making their initial pick-up with the line behind them. That eliminates one false cast and makes it possible to carry more overhang.

Randy

cketh 06-12-2010 12:50 PM

Re: Over Hang Question
 
It seems to me that the answer to this question is "however much you need" unless it's just a theoretical question. If you're tossing short casts, you might have 4 feet of line outside the tip top. If you're throwing 75 feet, you might need more like 40 feet.


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