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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 10-03-2011, 06:05 PM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pocono View Post
130' with a 5 wt. will probably earn him a spot in the record books.

How competitive is he; spirit-wise? Might be worth his traveling to the Best of the West tournament this coming year; just for the distance part of it.

On a related topic, if he's still doing all of this with a Cabella's rod (I can't remember if you said that he has better rods now or not), then I would think that they'd be interested in an endorsement; which could be good for him in more ways than one. Frankly, any manufacturer would probably be interested in him from an endorsement/advertising standpoint, if he set a new record with their rod. And if the words gets out that he's capable of setting records, then he'll have more rods coming his way than he'll know what to do with.....

I hope he likes to fish!

Pocono
Yes he's still doing it with the Cabela's Three Forks rod. I'm glad you guys are saying things like "130' with a 5 wt. will probably earn him a spot in the record books." As I had mentioned I am the only other fly caster he has seen. Other than on video of course. I think he is just starting to get the fact that he is one of a very small number that can do this.

He's fairly competitive, and I have mentioned that he could actually benefit from getting his name around. I have hit him with the idea of going to the Best of the West next year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wjc View Post
Dan,

I hear you about not being able to help Bill further. His progress and dedication are way beyond "remarkable". Cheers,
Jim
Thanks from both me and from Bill for your help. When he says he will be able to toss the whole 130 foot line I believe him. He's a freak of nature.
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  #62 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2011, 07:38 AM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

Quote:
I think he is just starting to get the fact that he is one of a very small number that can do this.

He's fairly competitive, and I have mentioned that he could actually benefit from getting his name around. I have hit him with the idea of going to the Best of the West next year.
I've actually been pretty surprised at a lot of the winning distances in some of those distance competitions. They aren't nearly as far as I would have thought, especially since they are casting from a podium. The only thing I can think of is that the stress, adrenallin, nerves and the three minute time limit must make a big difference. Either that or the air inside that place is cold.

If Bill is pretty consistent, I see no reason why he can't win, and even win big. There is an enormous difference between 115 and 120 feet with a 5 wt. and it increases astronomically after that. If he got off a good cast early so he could try a "Go for Broke" cast and hit it, no question in my mind that he could set a 5 wt record.

I think they have changed the rules at the Denver Competition and now furnish the rods (choice of 3 ?) as well as the lines, (SA MED sharkskin last year I think).

I would think that if you were to get a three minute video of Bill casting, (from the end of a tape) and filmed each of his distances, that he could find a fly shop to loan him the three rods to practice with in return for wearing one of their shirts at the show and giving them a public thank you at the winners ceremony.

Cheers,
Jim
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  #63 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2011, 10:28 AM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

Before he went to such an event it would behoove him to spend time with the gear he will have to use to compete. The time limit and course is something he can work on at any time. The biggest variable will be the gear used and that can throw his game off completely, especially since it appears he has limited use so far of various gear.
Another variable will be the crowds and cameras at the event but if he is 'in the zone' when taking his turn they won't even exist.

I would love to see an unknown walk up there and blow the doors off of the hotshots. Not so much because of the hotshots getting humbled but because of the good it woud do for the many people out there who think casting well is too hard and complicated.
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  #64 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2011, 11:16 AM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

Well, forget "The Best of the West Denver Shootout" . It has been taken over by liberals who don't want to hurt anyone's feelings.

There is no longer a distance competition at all. The same is happening all over this country. First they eliminated separate distance competitions by making them a part of the "casting tournament", now they have eliminated distance altogether from the "accuracy" tournament.

They have also eliminated from the "accuracy" tournament all the curve casts, through the hoops casts, S casts, tuck casts, and anything else other than straight casts at hoola hoops on the ground at distances between 20 and 50 feet, but with a "bonus" ring at 60-80' and one "obstacle' cast. The obstacle is another flat hoop in front of the first at 20'. Points are deducted if you cross the front one with the line or leader.

Compared to the European casting tournaments (all of which have separate distance events, and you may enter whichever events you like), it is like the "Special Olympics.". Sounds like our public education system, "no one left behind" and no hurt feelings because some kids are smarter or study harder than others. Rather than counting the concentric ring targets as 2 points for the center and 1 point for the field, they count them 400 and 200 points respectively. Everybody gets a high score!

On another board, from one of the promoters/organizers:
Quote:
We achieved a goal of getting new casters into the game, as not many of the top distance casters went for the accuracy game. A lot of casters were new to the competition and there were more recreational casters in the contest. I do miss some of the drama of 120 ft casts, but was very pleased to spend less time untangling line from the pipe & drape in the backcast area.
Glad he didn't have to strain himself so much.

Well, I have no idea, Dan, about where in this country Bill could even compete anymore except at local fly shop or local club events. By eliminating distance, they have removed much of the reason for salt water fly guys to bother going too.

Cheers,
Jim
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  #65 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2011, 07:21 PM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wjc View Post
Well, forget "The Best of the West Denver Shootout" . It has been taken over by liberals who don't want to hurt anyone's feelings.

There is no longer a distance competition at all. The same is happening all over this country. First they eliminated separate distance competitions by making them a part of the "casting tournament", now they have eliminated distance altogether from the "accuracy" tournament.

They have also eliminated from the "accuracy" tournament all the curve casts, through the hoops casts, S casts, tuck casts, and anything else other than straight casts at hoola hoops on the ground at distances between 20 and 50 feet, but with a "bonus" ring at 60-80' and one "obstacle' cast. The obstacle is another flat hoop in front of the first at 20'. Points are deducted if you cross the front one with the line or leader.

Compared to the European casting tournaments (all of which have separate distance events, and you may enter whichever events you like), it is like the "Special Olympics.". Sounds like our public education system, "no one left behind" and no hurt feelings because some kids are smarter or study harder than others. Rather than counting the concentric ring targets as 2 points for the center and 1 point for the field, they count them 400 and 200 points respectively. Everybody gets a high score!

On another board, from one of the promoters/organizers:

Glad he didn't have to strain himself so much.

Well, I have no idea, Dan, about where in this country Bill could even compete anymore except at local fly shop or local club events. By eliminating distance, they have removed much of the reason for salt water fly guys to bother going too.

Cheers,
Jim
Jim, this is good news! Now I can send my fourth grade niece to compete.
Tell the truth though... did they really move the competition to California?
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  #66 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2011, 02:32 AM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

Well that fully sucks. I was trying to talk him into going to the next one with me. Can't we just round up all the PC crowd and stick them all in one place a rename it Woosylvania? The land of uniform mediocrity. Great.
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Old 10-05-2011, 10:01 AM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

Dan,

I just went to the american casting club website. Although I did see rules for "Special Event 5wt Distance" I could not find a single 5 wt distance event on their schedule in this country. It appears that of their "fly distance" and "angler fly distance" scheduled events one for sure is shooting heads, and I don't know what the other is, but it's definitely not a 5 wt.

All the European events include 5wt distance, as it is the most popular and draws the most competitors. Norway and Croatia both hosted "world championships" in 2011 and included 5 wt distance with regular fly lines. They call it "Trout Distance" over there.

There was a huge debate (with judges/promotors included) on sexyloops about how they were to inspect the fly lines, which they could choose from, whether to limit the rods only by length, or by what was written on the blank, whether to only accept rods available to the general public, what about custom builds etc. etc.

It was a real big deal. There was very little talk at all about any other of the events that I can remember - only 5 wt distance.

The only thing that makes sense is that tackle manufacturers here think that the freshwater trout market is stable and are trying to expand interest in surf and bass fishing - so they are doing like our goverment and ignoring the majority. They do have a "bass bug distance" class in all the events I saw listed.

Jackster, I misread and thought your post was from, Dan. There is no question in my mind that your niece would do very well if she entered.

Cheers,
Jim

Last edited by wjc; 10-05-2011 at 10:11 AM. Reason: Edit in blue
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Old 10-08-2011, 09:04 PM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

We are going to try and do another video. I shot one where he carries the entire 3 wt. Barrio line but the lighting was bad and the line is really hard to see. It's a 90 ft. line and he can get 5 or 6 repititions with the whole line in the air. We have not been able to reshoot it because we have had several days with pretty windy conditions. Gusts of 40 mph and stuff. We should have it fairly soon though.
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Old 10-25-2011, 12:45 AM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

I had mentioned that we were going to try and get some more video. Between schedules, wind and trying not to overly cut into our available fishing time, we did shoot a couple more. We wanted to get him carry a whole 90' 3 wt Barrio line, and 100' with the 5 wt. We had a late start with the 3 wt and he had issues with his mono backing slipping in his hand. He carried it repeatedly with the backing knot in his hand. When we went to shoot the 5 wt, it was dead calm when we left our homes to meet at Willie Walleye park, unfortunately the wind started blowing and was fairly brisk before we were done. The best he could do was get the 100' mark into his hand. We figured he was repeatedly able to carry 90 ft. We did not count the leader. Then Bill found this little tidbit on line;
Mike Heritage line carry link
This means he carried 90' over and over with a 3 wt line, and better yet 100' with a 5 wt in a wind which did not help. The 3 wt video could have had better lighting. We got a real late start on it. The 5 wt video has pretty good lighting though. I am going to edit something together and post it. Bill is his own worst critic and wants to see it before I post it, so it will be acouple of days. I think when it is posted though, it will be about the only video around of a 100' carry. To bad the leader doesn't count, it knocks 9 ft off what I would count.
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  #70 (permalink)  
Old 10-25-2011, 10:56 AM
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Default Re: Amazing natural caster...the update.

What a refreshing thread. It's nice to see someone getting encouragement rather than what sometimes happens on some of the UK forums where if you can cast over 75' you are regarded as a bit of a freak.

My name is Mike Heritage FFF MCI and member of British Fly Casting Club BFCC - Home Of Uk Fly Casting.

That cast by Fredrik Hedman in an earier post was taken during a knockout competition in May at the annual Sexyloops gathering in Scotland. It was a knockout competition and we cast in pairs, the winner going on the the next round. Guess who I was paired against? I managed over 107' which would have got me through to the next round in nearly any other pairing.

Your guy has a lot of talent but he could do a couple of things that might help. He creeps before the forward stroke, he must stay back while the loop unrolls. He also might try dropping the rod tip below horizontal before the forward stroke.

He seems to be wearing a brace, this wouldn't be allowed in competition, none I have ever competed it anyway.

By the way, carry just for it's own sake is cool but for best results you have to be in full control of it. It's better to have an 80/85' carry that is nicely tensioned than a 90' carry that has a lot sag in it.

Keep it up, it took me three or four years to get those sort of distances.

Mike
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