The North American Fly Fishing Forum


Go Back   The North American Fly Fishing Forum > General Fly Fishing Discussion > The Fly Cast

The Fly Cast Discuss fly casting with the expert, ask for help, learn to cast farther, increase your accuracy, troubleshoot your cast.

Like Tree5Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 06-22-2013, 07:52 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 7
dronedog is on a distinguished road
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

I live on a 100 acre pond now. So it is a matter of 50 feet to the bank. Mostly bass, pickerel and crappie in the pond so I am told.
I did go get a 5wt set up with a mod-fast action. It is helping a lot. Right now it is about waiting as the line gets longer. But when I do,boy the line shoots 10-15 feet nicely. So where I was max at about 30 feet with the old rod, I am pretty much starting at 30 and able to shoot to 40+ once in a while anyway.
As they say in bow shooting. Practice does not make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect. I will keep looking for an instructor.
Iam sure he could help with me working out of the kayak as well. Really have to get the arm up to keep the back cast out of the water.

How do you guys set your drag on the reel? The leader on this 5 wt breaks so easily. I broke it twice just snugging the knots. Can I use a leader for my 7wt rod? Or do I just have cheap leader?
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 06-22-2013, 10:38 PM
random user's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: S. E. Taxachusetts
Posts: 581
Blog Entries: 9
random user is a jewel in the roughrandom user is a jewel in the roughrandom user is a jewel in the rough
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

Look into "steeple cast" if you are really concerned about keeping the line off teh water behind you. Never fished out of a kayak, so I have no ides if it is needed.

Tippet breaking. Nylon is fairly unstable as we use it. It has a short shelf life, is UV sensitive and doesn't like repeated exposure to hot days. If you are breaking your tippet that easily, the spool is probably dead nylon, so long as you are lubricating the knots before you pull them tight.

As for drag, I have mine set to minimum almost all of the time and only turn it up when I need it. I don't like having the springs tensioned all the time, and I use reels with spring tension click-pawl drags because I rare need the drag as it is.

As far as leaders and tippets for a 5 weight and a 7 weight can be very similar. Both could easily take a 7.5' or 9' 4x leader with no problem. Generally speaking, you will be running slightly heavier leaders and tippets on the 7.

I use a 3-weight, a 5-weight, & 7-weight.

A 4x tippet rarely sees a the 3-weight and when I have used it I have considered it "heavy".

A 4x tippet is common on my 5-weight and is the top of what the rod sees generally.

A 4x tippet is uncommon on 7-weight, and when I do use it I consider it "light".

For a little perspective on that: Am kind of a small-niche guy. I like small rivers and soft hackle looking for trout, hence the 7'6" 3-weight. I use a 9' 5-weight on larger water again targeting trout. The 7-weight is for targeting large nocturnal browns, and that turned into river run smallies and now I am using it to figure out the warm, still water stuff for large mouth.

Hopefully that sheds some light on the leader thing. So, the leader on your 7-weight will work fine on your 5-weight.
__________________
I'm currently out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message, and if you would like to reach me by phone, please hang up now.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 06-23-2013, 11:48 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 7
dronedog is on a distinguished road
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

It does help. Thanks. Being so new to this I am sure I do not help the line with my casting and Knots on cast knots on occasion.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 06-24-2013, 03:44 AM
turbineblade's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: NA
Posts: 776
turbineblade is just really niceturbineblade is just really niceturbineblade is just really niceturbineblade is just really nice
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

I still get a wind knot probably once during a day's fishing -- mostly from not paying attention to my casting stroke and/or fishing at a fairly long distance >50'.

I hate to admit it, but I still pick one out occasionally

I don't know that I'll ever eliminate them, but avoiding as best as possible seems reasonable. So don't get discouraged.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 06-24-2013, 09:54 PM
Jackster's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 1,641
Jackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant futureJackster has a brilliant future
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

Try doing a search here for a certified casting instructor: Casting Instructors
Build on a good, solid foundation and you will eliminate a lot of frustration later. Learning solid habits to practice is much better than learning, practicing and then breaking bad habits. Ask any instructor who had to retrain anyone who spent a long time using nothing but wrist or who spent their time practicing poor power application.
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 06-25-2013, 09:26 AM
nick k's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Brookline, MA
Posts: 1,206
nick k is just really nicenick k is just really nicenick k is just really nicenick k is just really nice
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

In my opinion, a premade tapered leader is very unnecessary when fishing for average warm water species. For bass in areas with weeds and lily pads, I would use 4-5ft of 16lb tippet as the leader, then tie on 2-3ft of 12lb tippet as the actual tippet. If you don't have a lot of weeds or stuff to worry about, you can go lighter on both ends.

Also, for average warm water species, your drag setting will only serve to keep the reel from free spooling when you pull line out.
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 06-26-2013, 10:56 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 7
dronedog is on a distinguished road
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

hey, I found 2 instructors on that list that are not too far away from me. Thanks for that.

SO I probably should have read this but what is the purpose of the tapered leader? most of what I have been reading so far is on casting. still not trying to fish until I get better.

my loops are definitely getting better but even better is they are getting more consistent. I am working in just the 25-40 range with the line. not really doing much false casting but just a lift cast and letting the line shoot. the two big things I have realized so far is that; one the stroke is a lot shorter than you would think. on the back cast I feel like I stop at 12 and on the front I go to 11. in reality I am probably going farther than that but that is what it feels like. I also saw a tip where the guy said he feel like he is throwing the line up in the air on the back cast. since trying that my fly stays air borne better. it is just tough to do while trying to keep that elbow close to your side. the tendency is to lift the arm and elbow and then I go too far back.
the second thing I am realizing is how important it is to wait on the line to extend on the back cast. when I wait enough I get a nice loop on the forward cast. I think the 5wt rod with this mod/fast tip is really helping on the timing.
I practice everyday some place. either in the front yard or right on the bank.
so I am still water casting in a pond. right now I try to start with about 25-30 feet of line. no false casting but I just try to see how much line I can shoot. if I have my stroke and timing right it will go out to about 40 feet or close. my questions right now for you all is this.
do you guys strip line in to a certain distance most times and then begin another cast? in other words does it make sense to start at the same fixed amount so if you see a fish at a distance you have a feel for whether you should work out more line or less?
when the line lays out on the cast should it all drop to the water at the same time or do you let the fly line drop in and let the fly land last?
I have seen where some instruction says to lift the line to the leader before you start a back cast. in other videos it says to start from the water. obviously you do not want to rip the fly out of the water. so I am a little confused on that. surely with a popper you want some lift I would think but what about other fly's?
Thanks again for all the info
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 06-26-2013, 11:07 AM
random user's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: S. E. Taxachusetts
Posts: 581
Blog Entries: 9
random user is a jewel in the roughrandom user is a jewel in the roughrandom user is a jewel in the rough
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

Quote:
Originally Posted by dronedog View Post
my loops are definitely getting better but even better is they are getting more consistent. I am working in just the 25-40 range with the line. not really doing much false casting but just a lift cast and letting the line shoot. the two big things I have realized so far is that; one the stroke is a lot shorter than you would think. on the back cast I feel like I stop at 12 and on the front I go to 11. in reality I am probably going farther than that but that is what it feels like. I also saw a tip where the guy said he feel like he is throwing the line up in the air on the back cast. since trying that my fly stays air borne better. it is just tough to do while trying to keep that elbow close to your side. the tendency is to lift the arm and elbow and then I go too far back.
the second thing I am realizing is how important it is to wait on the line to extend on the back cast. when I wait enough I get a nice loop on the forward cast. I think the 5wt rod with this mod/fast tip is really helping on the timing.
I practice everyday some place. either in the front yard or right on the bank.
so I am still water casting in a pond. right now I try to start with about 25-30 feet of line. no false casting but I just try to see how much line I can shoot. if I have my stroke and timing right it will go out to about 40 feet or close. my questions right now for you all is this.
[forgot this before] sounds like you are right on track and doing well. [end of what I forgot to type before]

I almost always use a roll-cast-pickup when I can. It seems a lot less obnoxious to me. With the line in the air in front of me, I find the back cast to be a lot easier.

I have all of my lines marked. There is a certain point with all my setups where I can easily roll cast the line of the water and load the rod easily. The point varies on different set-ups. I used a sharpie to indicate where to grab the line with my line hand. What this gives me is the ability to get the line up and moving easily and a baseline that I can use to determine how much line to let out of take in.
__________________
I'm currently out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message, and if you would like to reach me by phone, please hang up now.

Last edited by random user; 06-26-2013 at 10:48 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 06-26-2013, 11:31 AM
nick k's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Brookline, MA
Posts: 1,206
nick k is just really nicenick k is just really nicenick k is just really nicenick k is just really nice
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

Quote:
Originally Posted by dronedog View Post
SO I probably should have read this but what is the purpose of the tapered leader?
The purpose of tapered leaders is twofold. The taper allows for more delicate presentations and for flies to turn over more efficiently. The second reason is simply for the gradual progression of a thick, strong, more noticeable line diameter to a smaller, weaker, but less visible diameter.

Many warm water species (such as bass and bluegill) don't care much about loud or perfect fly presentations. Some are even drawn to the extra disturbance. One piece tapered leaders can also get expensive to constantly buy, where as a leader made of two different sizes of tippet material tied together can be just as effective (in the right circumstances) but cheaper.

Like I said in my previous post, I see no significant benefit to one piece tapered leaders in most warmwater applications. I make my bass leaders from one length of 16lb line tied to one length of 12lb line. Bass and bluegill aren't generally line shy so the thick line helps with pulling bass and flies from weeds and lily pads without much downside.
oarfish likes this.
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 07-01-2013, 03:21 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 7
dronedog is on a distinguished road
Default Re: new guy and never really fished before

well I have been in touch with an instructor and am in the process of setting up some lessons.

I was out last night and actually caught a couple of perch. And so it begins...
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Have you fished The Green? fysh News & articles for discussion 2 04-16-2012 10:15 PM
most fished river araitim Great Lakes Region 13 01-09-2011 10:47 PM
Fished in Iowa LenHarris Upper Mid-U.S. 4 11-10-2008 10:06 PM
Some of the Best water I've ever fished! Lambster Coldwater Fly Fishing 0 09-05-2008 08:07 PM
I fished the San Juan and look...... trixie General Discussion 6 07-22-2008 07:58 AM













All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:08 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
2005-2014 The North American Fly Fishing Forum. All rights reserved.