tips on roll casting

[n5td]

I'm still new to fly fishing. I'm throwing a 3wt fiberglass rod with a wf floating line with DIY leader made out of fluorocarbon. 12lbs to 8lbs to 6lbs

sometimes I can get a good cast but other times the fly does not turn.

any tips?



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[rangerrich99]

Take this with a couple grains of salt, as I'm not an expert caster or an instructor, or a certified guide. I'm just a fly fisherman who likes to toss my two cents at people, even when they don't ask for it. However, you asked for it, so here it comes, like it or not.

Here's my advice, such as it is:

Try a 4- or a 5-weight to start out trying to learn how to roll cast. A medium to medium-fast action is where I'd start. Also, try using a 7.5 ft. 3x tapered leader (store bought) and tie on a small-ish relatively low-drag fly. Maybe a #10 bugger.

When attempting to roll cast, make sure you pause for about a half a second after the line passes you, making the D-loop. On the forward portion of the cast, use the same forward cast that you use for an overhead cast.

You say that sometimes you get a decent roll cast, but sometimes your attempt collapses? Probably, when it doesn't work, your casting 'down' too much. Try casting out or forward more than down.

And, last but definitely not least - SLOW DOWN.

Okay, now that I got that out of my system, here's my real advice: unfortunately, from your description, I can't really give you any constructive advice about how to help you with your roll casting. I'd need a lot more information, like a video. Barring that, the specific make and model of your rod, the make and model of the fly line, including a description of the taper, and at least the length of your leader, and what type of fly you're trying to use.

And even then, without seeing your cast, I'd pretty much be tossing out a pure SWAG.

So, my best advice to you is to go find your best, nearest, most affordable casting instructor and show him/her what you're doing and let him /her teach you how to roll cast.

I know, not very helpful, but it's the best I can do unless you show up at my doorstep rod, reel and a positive attitude in hand.

And a good hat. All self-respecting fly fishermen need a good, lucky hat.

Peace.

 

[n5td]

Take this with a couple grains of salt, as I'm not an expert caster or an instructor, or a certified guide. I'm just a fly fisherman who likes to toss my two cents at people, even when they don't ask for it. However, you asked for it, so here it comes, like it or not.

Here's my advice, such as it is:

Try a 4- or a 5-weight to start out trying to learn how to roll cast. A medium to medium-fast action is where I'd start. Also, try using a 7.5 ft. 3x tapered leader (store bought) and tie on a small-ish relatively low-drag fly. Maybe a #10 bugger.

When attempting to roll cast, make sure you pause for about a half a second after the line passes you, making the D-loop. On the forward portion of the cast, use the same forward cast that you use for an overhead cast.

And, last but definitely not least - SLOW DOWN.

Okay, now that I got that out of my system, here's my real advice: unfortunately, from your description, I can't really give you any constructive advice about how to help you with your roll casting. I'd need a lot more information, like a video. Barring that, the specific make and model of your rod, the make and model of the fly line, including a description of the taper, and at least the length of your leader, and what type of fly you're trying to use.

And even then, without seeing your cast, I'd pretty much be tossing out a pure SWAG.

So, my best advice to you is to go find your best, nearest, most affordable casting instructor and show him/her what you're doing and let him /her teach you how to roll cast.

I know, not very helpful, but it's the best I can do unless you show up at my doorstep rod, reel and a positive attitude in hand.

And a good hat. All self-respecting fly fishermen need a good, lucky hat.

Peace.

rich,

so the backward motion is important? I can't just start with the rod tip behind me and do a forward cast?

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[rangerrich99]

rich,

so the backward motion is important? I can't just start with the rod tip behind me and do a forward cast?

Again, just to be clear, I'm no expert, but in my experience, yes, the back cast is fundamental to roll casting. It may be that the more experienced and knowledgeable casters here on the forum will declare that the back cast is of no importance whatsoever, but I'm pretty sure that it is critical.

For myself, if I let the fly and leader sink too far below the surface, it tends to 'anchor,' depriving the forward cast of much needed velocity during the forward cast, which will cause the loop to collapse before reaching your leader/fly. Too far below the surface for me is more than about 8-12 inches.

 

[n5td]

Again, just to be clear, I'm no expert, but in my experience, yes, the back cast is fundamental to roll casting. It may be that the more experienced and knowledgeable casters here on the forum will declare that the back cast is of no importance whatsoever, but I'm pretty sure that it is critical.

For myself, if I let the fly and leader sink too far below the surface, it tends to 'anchor,' depriving the forward cast of much needed velocity during the forward cast, which will cause the loop to collapse before reaching your leader/fly.

every thing you're saying make sense. thanks

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[rangerrich99]

You're welcome.

And don't worry, sooner or later the real gurus, like sweetandsalt, Silver, Ard, and a host of others will drop a couple bucks worth of knowledge on your head, and with a little practice and a lot of reading, you'll soon be posting about how great a roll caster you've become.

Peace.

Your Friendly Neighborhood Hopper Tosser.

 

[smilingduck]

If your in So Cal you should use google and see if there are any casting ponds or casting clubs in your area. If you have someone help you for a few hours it should be easy to remedy.

Also like stated using a heavier longer rod really helps. Just make sure you go slow and form a nice D-loop before the forward cast.

Good luck

 

[rockriver]

Go with a 5wt. is my suggestion, 8.5 or 9ft along with a tapered leader. A light soft rod makes it harder to roll cast.

 

[fishmandoug]

Once you understand the basics it is just all about practice and feel.

Next time you go out, dont throw any overhand casts. Do this a few times and you'll be doing it in you sleep with surprising accuracy.

For me I started to get more accurate when I read somewhere that the forward acceleration and stop part of the cast should be the same as an overhand cast. Keeping the rod tip higher helped to tighten the loop a lot and give much more control.

 

[dillon]

The most important aspects of the roll cast or spey casts are the anchor and the D loop. The D loop loads the road with resistance form the anchor. Spey casts are change of direction roll casts and can be executed with a single hand rod. Watch this video and practice setting the anchor and forming the D loop on the lawn. IMO, good roll and spey casts are difficult to learn without proper instruction and lots of practice. A double taper line or a line specifically designed for roll casting may also work better than a weight forward.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFDPIn0L0Uw&list=PL101B58488C09AE04

 

[Hirdy]

Like others before, without seeing your cast it's hard to offer specific advice.

One of my problems when trying to teach myself this was that I was trying to cast too far whilst learning. For the roll cast to be effective, you need at least as much line mass in the D loop as there is laid out in front of the anchor point.

So when you're just starting out, make sure the nail knot joining the line to the leader is no more than (say) 15' in front of your body after you have formed the D loop. (Perhaps a rod length in front would be a better measure.)

As you get better and wish to cast further, you can put more line into your D loop (giving you more mass in it) and hence cast more line.

Cheers,
Graeme

 

[jpbfly]

+1 what the others said....+I sometimes show how the roll cast works with a rope,a big electric wire or a water hose.... hold it make a D loop and push it.....you'll understand how roll cast works....

 

[Ard]

A good roll cast is executed in the same way that a good Spey cast is done but without so much repositioning of the line for a beginner. However, if you are casting out into the current than allowing the line - leader and fly to drift downstream until it is below your position by a significant distance you need what is now commonly known as a single hand Spey cast. This involves sweeping the line back upstream until the entire length of floating line is above your position. At that point you must move directly into the move of bringing the rod tip up and angling away from the casting shoulder and then immediately make your forward stroke.

If a person does not learn this simple step of moving the line (sweeping it upstream) prior to attempting to make a roll cast to a point directly in front of their position that person will eventually find the line will either hit them or get looped around the rod tip. The single hand Spey cast is simple yet there is a lot going on involving both hands in order to make things work. It is very hard to explain in text what exactly the 'line hand' is doing during the cast but safe to say that your line hand (and arm) are busy keeping tension on the line so that the rod is under constant load during the cast.

I'm not in the business of making casting videos so I had a quick look on line and found one that may or may not be helpful to you. At about one minute and thirty seconds into this the guy starts laying the line off to the side of his (right) casting arm. He is doing all of this with just one hand, the rod hand but that move where he tosses the line off to his right and then quickly rolls it back out in front is kinda what I am describing.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...162B38238DF71EF075F8162B38238DF71EF&FORM=VIRE

The man doing the demo is not standing in a swift current and your conditions may vary greatly from what you see but his moves are the basics. When you are in a fairly swift current and must bring the line from below your position to above your position as I mentioned earlier you need the move he is showing at 1:30 into the video.

I would advise starting with a controlled length of line like the demo is showing you and when you can do that in fast water you are ready to begin advancing your skill level. With practice you will learn what that left hand (if you are right handed) must be doing to allow for much longer casts. Once you have grasp the concept and have all parts working in concert an angler can make an astoundingly long forward cast with a single hand rod with very little space behind their position for back cast.

I did this type casting for a long time because of the areas I fished in. When I came here to Alaska the conditions became even tougher regarding room for the back cast. In my case I moved to 2 handed rods because they are the ultimate roll casting tool. There is a great deal of mystique surrounding Spey casting but I find it to be variations on roll casting albeit being done with rods 11.5 to 15 feet long. If your fishing requires roll casts more than overhead style I would suggest you master the single hand style and then move to a 2 hand rod to suite the size waters you fish.

Ard

 

[markfrid]

These guys have all given you such good advice I hate to chime in, but I'm going to offer this: roll casting is not hard if you are keeping your casts short. If you're in the 15-20' of fly line out range, you can do it pretty well, with a minimum of practice, with almost any rod. But you have chosen a tough cookie to learn with, if you want to make longer roll casts. A slower action 3-wt is going to test you - everything will have to be perfect to get that light line to roll out very far. Anchor, timing and stroke will all have to be just.....so. If you need to roll cast farther, you'll find a 5 or 6 weight line will be a lot more forgiving. The momentum carried by the heavier line will help make up for many small errors and a med to med-fast action rod will help deliver more line speed to the roll. Just my 2 cents. Good luck!

Mark

 

[bigspencer]

Good mechanics and the formation of a loop with momentum(from your rodhand to the rodtip..in THAT order!)...in a roll cast are just as important as in a basic cast...and momentum comes from the loading of the backbone of the rod with the line without any deflection in the rod's bend, in the Speed Up and Stop motion of the forward motion, but most of all it's in keeping your rod in a straight plane(whatever angle you choose = a 45deg angle or straight over your head).
Just as in a normal forward cast, Even with the shortened stroke of a rollcast, if you throw any type of curveball....the line will lose most of its momentum(against the resistance of the air)...especially with a lightline. Any kind of curve you put into the short stroke of a rollcast(ie across your body somewhat) will really kill any momentum it had at the very beginning of your stroke. Again, start short.~15'..to keep that path of your rod Straight... ..And practicing the rollcast on water is much easier than on grass...the resistance is just too erratic, both not enough and too much as the grass sometimes tend to grab....

 

[adkmountainken]

WOW that I had a decent roll cast until I watched that video!

 

[photoguy]

Don't know if this will help you or not, but sometimes seeing it happen makes it click. My first casting instructor was of the Joan Wullf school, so this is how she taught me.

Sorry, I don't know how to embed a video, but here's a link-

https://vimeo.com/70576601

 

[angledangle]

Snap it!unk:

RIP Reesasuarus Rex You will be missed

 

[axle27]

Simple:

Use a double taper line.

Make the forward cast a HARD STOP.

 

[silver creek]

Don't know if this will help you or not, but sometimes seeing it happen makes it click. My first casting instructor was of the Joan Wullf school, so this is how she taught me.

Sorry, I don't know how to embed a video, but here's a link-

https://vimeo.com/70576601

Tried to embed it for you but it is protected and can not be embedded

[ame]http://vimeo.com/70576601[/ame]