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Old 03-01-2011, 05:44 PM
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Default What do you know about guide spacing?

Hey. I am getting ready to put together a new rod that I'll give to my brother. I haven't seen him in more than a year and figured I'd make up for multiple missed birthday's. Plus I just want to make another rod.

This will be my 4th rod, but it's been about 6 years. I've read and learned more things since then, one being the idea of "Ultimate Performance" rods.

This is a theory that by nearly doubling the number of guides on a rod you greatly enhance the rods casting ability. The theory says that the line stays straighter, doesn't sag or loop between guides. But then there is friction working the other way.

Have any of you out there experimented with adding guides to a custom built rod? I am not considering doubling, but maybe adding one or two so instead of 10 guides on a 9' I end up with 12. I have the manufacturer's spacing, so it would be easy to keep the spacing ratio consistent.

My brother is a novice fly fisherman but has come out here and fished a few times and enjoyed it. He makes an annual trip to the UP when he's home visiting our parents in Michigan. I thought this could be a cool way to add a custom touch to the rod and help him out with his casting.

Thoughts?

Thanks!
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Old 03-01-2011, 06:00 PM
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Default Re: What do you know about guide spacing?

Dean,
Have you considered 'Static Guide Spacing'?
Rodbuilding.org - Static Guide Placement
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Old 03-01-2011, 06:03 PM
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Default Re: What do you know about guide spacing?

Dean,

Extra guides are not one of the things I am thinking about when trying to fall asleep but if I were going to add any I would add a second stripping type where the first snake guide is usually at. Other wise if adding more snakes I would just measure the distance between my last stripper (extra that I added) and then just make them equally spaced. For that extra stripping guide I would go a tad smaller than the first stripper.

I am not a rod designer but you ask so..............

Ard
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Old 03-01-2011, 06:22 PM
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Default Re: What do you know about guide spacing?

A ton of guides have been tried for years. Latest rod to try it is the Ultra Wave recently pushed here. I could see where rod manufacturers would stick to one guide per foot plus one (cost wise) but custom builders I'm sure have tried it more than once. If it worked as good as some write about, it would be all over the rod builders forums and the rod manufacturers would have to give the people what they want. But I have yet to see it happen. You put as many guides on a rod as the Ultrawave, or as you mentioned doubling the guides, which would nomally be 10 on a 9' rod you'll stiffen the blank up and add extra weight by putting 19 or 20 guides on. It will effect the way the rod casts.
I use a program that Chris Carlin developed on guide placement. After taping on the guides, I do the static guide placement. Not a whole lot of difference, but it does change where some of the guides go. Very easy to do. Plus I usually use only two sizes of guides and a 10 or 12 stripper.
If you want to try the doubling of guides, buy some extras and tape them on and lawn cast your rod. Go back to traditional guide spacing, static place them and lawn cast. See what happens.
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Old 03-01-2011, 06:38 PM
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Default Re: What do you know about guide spacing?

By getting your guide spaced he may not be able find fish for you....
Just kidding. I don't think that doubling the number of guides is going to be the great thing you think it is. It will increase the weight of the rod in places that you really don't want to, making the action slower. If you want to reduce line slap and make it cast farther, a much better option is go bigger on guide size. In casting rods, by going from a 12 to 20 choke guide, and upsizing the rest f the way down, you can get more distance in the 10's of yards. I have not seen this tested with fly rods, But I assume it works the same way. By doubling the number of guides I think you will just be adding cost and work to make the rod look odd and cast less well. One last thing that some say works, is to put the first stripping guide slightly out of line from the rest towards the stripping hand. I don't do it because people are inevitably going to think it was a mistake, but I can see where it may help some in reducing line slap, thereby giving you better distance.
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Old 03-01-2011, 09:25 PM
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Default Re: What do you know about guide spacing?

Thanks for all your thoughts, guys. I just wanted to clarify that I have no intention of putting 15 guides on a 9' rod...let alone 19 or 20 of them!! I really just wanted to hear some of your thoughts, I tend to agree you all too.

Ard, this is a TFO rod and one of good old Lefty's tricks is to use two stripping guides just like you say. I am definitely going to go that route.

I'll take a look at static spacing as well since both John and Mojo have suggested it.

Thanks guys, please, do not lose any sleep, I certainly will not!
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Old 03-01-2011, 10:51 PM
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Default Re: What do you know about guide spacing?

i'm not sure about putting a tamer guide on a 9'er, but I'd give it a shot. I know some builders swear by them. Try casting a line with one on and without. Post your thoughts on it.
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Old 03-01-2011, 10:58 PM
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Default Re: What do you know about guide spacing?

Mojo,
What's a 'Tamer Guide'? Another name for a Stripping guide?

I googled and found nothing.
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Old 03-01-2011, 11:35 PM
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Default Re: What do you know about guide spacing?

Dean,

I am all for the extra stripper but honestly the extra guide thing did not sound good to me. I have some old rods with less than modern line guides on them and they cast very well.

This distance thing goes to our heads I think. I don't enjoy it when I have to distance cast. Maybe it would look cool on a video but I get tired of it.

Ard
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Old 03-02-2011, 05:52 AM
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Default Re: What do you know about guide spacing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fyshstykr View Post
Mojo,
What's a 'Tamer Guide'? Another name for a Stripping guide?

I googled and found nothing.
It's the second stripping guide- it "tames" the line. Supposedly it takes some of the slap out when you cast. I would think it adds more weight to the rod. If yo want to throw further, buy Sharkskin.
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