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Old 03-19-2011, 09:11 PM
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Default Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands

I'm wondering if anyone has had a chance to cast either the Hardy ProAxis or Zenith with their new nano resin / sintrix technology. What were your opinions on the rods, and what was the difference in feel and tapor between the freshwater Pro Axis and the Salt Water Zenith?

I'm interested in learning if Hardy's sintrix technology is any better or worse than the same nano resins used in the new G-Loomis NRX and St. Croix Legend Elite series rods. I have not had a chance to cast any of these newer rods. I also wonder how they differ from a boron rod like the Winston BIIIX.

I have read the Yellowstone Angler 5 weight shootout, but nothing is available yet testing the 8 weight rods for saltwater or large, freshwater species. Please provide feedback and discuss your opinions.
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Old 03-19-2011, 10:44 PM
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Default Re: Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands

I rep Hardy, I can tell you that the Hardy's are extremely durable. Andy Mills designed the Proaxis and they are extremely powerful SW rods. The eight weights have been used to land Hammerheads up to 150 lbs. Having fished the six weight SW a lot (throwing streamers with a 200 gr. head) I can tell you it will do things some 8 weights won't do. The other thing I noticed is it almost imposable to throw a tailing loop with one, you just can't overpower them.

The FW rods are the real deal, they have great feel in close and seem to get more powerful the more line you have out. The Anderson shootout hit the nail on the head. I casted the eight foot four weight with Josh Greenberg from Gates Ausuble lodge last fall on the river. we both have a reverence for great Winston trout rods, both own TMF's and were both amazed at how close to the Winston the Hardy felt at real trout fishing ranges. The difference was the Hardy was lighter and far more powerful at distance.

I'm not going to comment on the Loomis or St Croix, but I will say that Hardy's rod lab chemists have tweaked the resin formula and they are not using the same stuff. Wether theirs is better or worse, I'll let the customers decide. I am very enthusiastic about these new Hardy rods as you can probably tell. I believe they are as much better than traditional graphite as first generation graphite was than fiberglass.

This link has some great video's on the design and testing of them.

HARDY GREYS FISHING
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Old 03-20-2011, 09:53 AM
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Default Re: Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands

How different are the tapers between the saltwater proaxis and freshwater zenith?

If I were to choose 1 rod for all around saltwater use, which is a tough task for any rod, would you recommend an 8 weight or 9 weight. I would be targeting everything from bonefish to permit and small tarpon. I would also consider using this rod for salmon, pike, and musky.

Would the 9 weight be delicate enough to use on bonefish or would the higher strength-to-weight ratios make the 8 weight the best chioce?
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Old 03-20-2011, 04:05 PM
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Default Re: Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands

My understanding is it's all 3M technology.
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Old 03-20-2011, 04:13 PM
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Default Re: Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands

Quote:
Originally Posted by burk48237 View Post
I rep Hardy, I can tell you that the Hardy's are extremely durable. Andy Mills designed the Proaxis and they are extremely powerful SW rods. The eight weights have been used to land Hammerheads up to 150 lbs. Having fished the six weight SW a lot (throwing streamers with a 200 gr. head) I can tell you it will do things some 8 weights won't do. The other thing I noticed is it almost imposable to throw a tailing loop with one, you just can't overpower them.
Burke: I watched a fly fishing show this morning where one of the Grey's reps were fishing for sharks (I can't remember the name), but the guy was really leaning on that rod and I thought he would cause a failure but it held up just fine, pretty amazing strength in that rod.

Larry
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Old 03-20-2011, 07:01 PM
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Default Re: Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands

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Originally Posted by mojo View Post
My understanding is it's all 3M technology.
Yes, but that doesn't mean that each of the companies is applying it the same way. Resins have complicated relationships with what they bond to and how they are applied. And Hardy has more than one chemist working with their rod designer to achieve their desired results. I have cast the NRX's and I am not going to comment if they are good or bad, but I can tell you this, while it may all be 3M tech, the NRX rods feel and perform different than the Hardy's. I haven't handled the St Croixs. Wether or not you prefer the Loomis or the Hardy construction is your call. But to say it's 3M tech is just like saying all high modulus graphite rods are the same. Tapers, construction and components can radically effect a rods performance as much as blank materials.

---------- Post added at 06:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:58 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnerney View Post
Burke: I watched a fly fishing show this morning where one of the Grey's reps were fishing for sharks (I can't remember the name), but the guy was really leaning on that rod and I thought he would cause a failure but it held up just fine, pretty amazing strength in that rod.

Larry
The link is in my first post has that video. It was Andy Mills and Howard Crofston. They are using straight 150 pound mono attached to 150 pound wire. And they are leaning on rods in ways that would have exploded about 90% of the rods on the market no doubt. Hardy had an SUV full of broken rods trying to get the formula right. From what I've seen and heard from a few Tarpon anglers they nailed it.
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Old 03-20-2011, 10:06 PM
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Default Re: Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands

Isn’t it more like saying many companies are using the same 3m technology? Orvis says their thermoplastic resins are way ahead of what 3m is using. Is it true? About as true as Hardy saying their 3m tech. is better than everyone else’s 3m tech i suppose. The real victory for Hardy IMHO is their fine tapers, Quality components and finally a real player in the high end market. The 3m gimmick is currently being used by many companies and i honestly don’t think its what makes the zenith a good rod. Its simply a good rod by design and 3ms nano tech is inconsequential. If strength were that important we would all be using ugly sticks after all.

Let me guess...your a Hardy rep and thier product is the greatest of all time and we should buy it now...Have i heard this before? Do you have a link we can buy from? With all due respect...i bet you do
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Old 03-20-2011, 10:20 PM
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Default Re: Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands



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Old 03-21-2011, 11:54 AM
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Default Re: Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands

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Originally Posted by db cooper View Post
Isn’t it more like saying many companies are using the same 3m technology? Orvis says their thermoplastic resins are way ahead of what 3m is using. Is it true? About as true as Hardy saying their 3m tech. is better than everyone else’s 3m tech i suppose. The real victory for Hardy IMHO is their fine tapers, Quality components and finally a real player in the high end market. The 3m gimmick is currently being used by many companies and i honestly don’t think its what makes the zenith a good rod. Its simply a good rod by design and 3ms nano tech is inconsequential. If strength were that important we would all be using ugly sticks after all.

Let me guess...your a Hardy rep and thier product is the greatest of all time and we should buy it now...Have i heard this before? Do you have a link we can buy from? With all due respect...i bet you do
But the fact is they aren't. Three companies are using it and all clearly applying it differently. Orvis makes that claim about their very different resins, if you want to put the Helios thru the same durability tests as the Hardy's go for it.

I do agree with you in the sense that I believe Howard Crofton is one of the finest rod designers on the planet today. I suspect that his name will soon have the same historical connotations as Jerry Green or Sam Druckman. But, the Nano Resins enable a vast expansion of the limitations of rod design. The Hardy Marksman is an excellent rod, certainly in the same class with the Z-Axis and the Winston B IIx when it was introduced. But if you compare it side by side to the Zenith, the Zenith is light years ahead in lightness, feel, power and durability. So I would have to disagree strongly that the "nano tech is inconsequential". And actually durrability is very important in SW rod, and critical in some freshwater applications (throwing heads).

As far "it's the greatest of all time" and "you should buy it now", that's your call. I will tell you this much, Anderson's Yellowstone Angler was not a Hardy dealer (rods) before the test. He now considers it the "finest rod ever made". Does that mean you have to have it? That's your call. If the current stuff in your inventory is doing the job for you, you should probably keep it. I have a few rods that I will never replace with the Sintrex resin product, but several rods that have always nagged me with some flaws that will probably be replaced as I can afford it.
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Old 03-21-2011, 05:31 PM
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Default Re: Nano Resin Technology & Differences Between Brands

Any rod company which has purchased the 3M tech has nothing but an expensive investment without a DESIGNER who is capable of applying it to building a better fly rod.

That includes designing & machining the mandrels, developing the TAPERS and applying the material to the mandrel in a way that will produce those tapers. In addition to desired flex, lightness and hoop strength result in what the company considers it's version of the so called perfect BLANK. Nano tech is a large improvement but wasted if not applied properly.
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