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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2008, 02:56 AM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

Quote:
Originally Posted by steely View Post
I 1) can cast my tfo axiom 5 weight over 75 feet (not that this is something to brag about, many here can cast a 5 weight 100 -125 feet, just saying I am not a beginner)
2) own a $250 tfo 5 weight and a over $600 6 weight z axis. So obviously the $600 rod casts farther? NOPE. Well obviously it is more of a joy to cast? NOPE. I so strongly object to what you say.
3) I obviously like TFO's. But again I have to say I strongly object to you saying he should get a <insert model>.
4) why are rod prices so divergent? Why are some purses $50 and others $4000? If the $4000 purse had the name brand of the $50 purse do you think it would cost $4000? Uh huh.
1 - It's not about how far you can cast, it's about presentation.
2 - I didn't say one major brand it better than the other. But everyone will agree that $12 Wally World specials don't come close to another brand. That's why we all have Sage, Orvis, TFO and the likes.
3 - I referred to the TFO NXT series because they're an all in one package. My first time out I didn't realize that I also needed a reel, backing, line, leader, tippet, flies, and a rod case to put it all in. When you add it all up it is an expensive hobby, especilly if you're starting out and aren't sure if you'll ever go again.
4 - If I slap a Sage ZXL logo on that Wal-Mart special is it gonna be worth $700? A lot of stuff factors into the price of a rod. R&D (all rods start out as proto types), where it's made (USA vs. China), who makes it (experianced pro or cheap labor), and how it's made (machined or hand made). Just to name a few.

Randy
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2008, 07:10 AM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

Here's my suggestion...What kind of car/truck do you drive...what options?...then buy the fly rod or rods... that match your vehicle in model and performance.

Unless you want cane 1000 is a bit over the top...and I do not pay 600-700 either but that does not mean I buy third world counterfeits either...I roll my own...or I look to the used or demo market. China and Korea are not originals unless Ming or marshal arts...blank originators they are not...they copy for the most part that which originated from Sage boys or Gary Loomis and then spec from here...it's not just a 10 cents an hour wage for 10 year old girls wrapping.. it's total labor/overhead cost....it's workman's comp...it's toxic waste...health care benes...401K...not the least of which is child labor...

IMHO If one must buy cheap then get real cheap...the private labels...bass pro or cabelas for about 100 bucks...if you are going to spend 250 or more for china or korea then look to sage loomis scott or st croix USA rods or buy good used high end...

I am almost sure it was a publishing requirement but maybe not but when I looked at Lefty K's latest up dated book, the cover jacket photos were not his TFO models...his picture was covered in Sage.
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2008, 07:18 AM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

Here's my suggestion...What kind of car/truck do you drive...what options?...then buy the fly rod or rods... that match your vehicle in model and performance.

Unless you want cane 1000 is a bit over the top...and I do not pay 600-700 either but that does not mean I buy third world counterfeits either...I roll my own...or I look to the used or demo market. China and Korea are not originals unless Ming or marshal arts...blank originators they are not...they copy for the most part that which originated from Sage boys or Gary Loomis and then spec from here...it's not just a 10 cents an hour wage for 10 year old girls wrapping.. it's total labor/overhead cost....it's workman's comp...it's toxic waste...health care benes...401K...not the least of which is child labor...

IMHO If one must buy cheap then get real cheap...the private labels...bass pro or cabelas for about 100 bucks...if you are going to spend 250 or more for china or korea then look to sage loomis scott or st croix USA rods or buy good used high end...

I am almost sure it was a publishing requirement but maybe not but when I looked at Lefty K's latest up dated book, the cover jacket photos were not his TFO models...his picture was covered in Sage.
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Old 01-07-2008, 02:07 PM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

Echoing a few suggestions:
1. Being a new comer, WARRANTY!
2. Line is more important than even the reel. My choice is RIO Selective Trout which due to the fact that there has been an update on this line to a II statice you can score this line for around $35. Plus it is a great all year line.
3. Take a casting lesson. A lot of schools or other organizations offer these for free. Then and only then will you find out what TAPER you need. No one can answer that but you.
4. Rods...TFO, ST CROIX, ECHO, SAGE LAUNCH to name a few.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2008, 04:28 PM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

I have posted a number of factors that influence rod design and prices on my fly fishing wiki at Main Page - Flycatcher Fly Wiki It doesn't cover everything but it does go into some detailed discussion on various rod components.

You might find it helpful in addition to what you see above. Also, if anyone would like to contribute, the web site is open for input.

One comment I would like to add however is that while a lifetime warranty is nice you ARE paying for it. How many of you have purchased the extended warranty on that new television? Not many I would bet. That is why I have made lifetime warranty optional on the custom rods I build. Food for thought...

Mark Waldin
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2008, 06:01 PM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

There have been a many good things written here, and a few vast generalizations, and some half truths. A few suggestions, first in a general way. What kind of fishing do you intend to do? Where? I was at the Louisville fly show ( I'm a rep) yesterday and had an older gentleman shopping for a first time outfit looking at a Cortland beginners combo. He told me he meets his sons every year at some exotic location and his sons have become hard core fly fisherman. They were going to an exclusive club in CO to trout fish. He could have "gotten by" with the cheap combo, but the was spending over 5000$ for a week of fishing and to me it made sense to do more then get by. I suggested a 200$ rod with matching line and reel. He came back latter after talking with a few shops having agreed. I think even for a beginner this is a great sport and when I get into anything I want to do more then just get by.

1) The combos mentioned here are OK but for a 250-350 you could end up with a rig that you will enjoy much longer, that will be much more satisfying to use, and that you may never get rid of. My take on the cheaper combos 150-175 is that they are great for kids, second outfits, or for someone who is not serious about the sport. It is my hope that you dive in and get serious, the more you invest in this sport the more you'll get out of it.

2) As far as value there are a lot of great fly rods inbetween 150-300. My suggestion is that you look at TFO, Sage FLI and Launch, and the new Cortland Big Sky, Brook or Diamondback Flawless. One note, the new Cortland and Diamondback are only available at independent tackle shops, this gets to my next suggstion.

3) Go to a local fly shop, maybe check out a couple of them. Try to find someone you can trust, most fly shops are interested in customer service. They know the local waters, flies, and in most cases they want repeat customers so they won't stear you wrong. Most of them will be willing to take the time to SHOW YOU the differences, and they know how to rig your set up. While they may charge a bit more, their expertise is worth it.

A couple of other quick notes, the ONLY fly rods under 200$ made in the US are the Sage Launches, St. Croix imports their low end rods from China. The Scott A2 is no longer made.

Also I can't believe someone is suggesting a fly line without knowing which rod, and what presentation will be used. Figure out what kind of fishing your going to do first, then pick the appropriate rod, line and reel. For most FW fishing (excluding Steeelhead Salmon) you can save money on the reel. DO NOT try to save money on the line.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2008, 07:58 PM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

burk48237, You have some very valuable info there.
I didn't mean to ruffle any rep. feathers. Reason I mentioned this line at all is it is a WONDERFUL line and at a great price right now. He mention a 9' 5wt. which to me says TROUT.
I worked for Orvis and still bought RIO line, and CORTLAND, and SA.
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Old 01-27-2008, 08:07 PM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

Quote:
Originally Posted by burk48237 View Post

Also I can't believe someone is suggesting a fly line without knowing which rod, and what presentation will be used. Figure out what kind of fishing your going to do first, then pick the appropriate rod, line and reel. For most FW fishing (excluding Steeelhead Salmon) you can save money on the reel. DO NOT try to save money on the line.
Bet if she mentioned Cortland you wouldn't have even mentioned this last paragraph.
I'd pretty much guess the gentleman is refering to trout fishing (when the post starts out him looking at a 9' 5w.) And most people out there try a floating line first. And suggesting the best line for the money ain't a sin or a crime. The Selective Trout can be used on any rod. You might want to try it sometime. It's a great line and the STII is even better.
FWIW, I've used Cortland, SA and Orvis "floating" lines for years. Then I discovered Rio. I was mildly taken aback when I noticed that the first 6' (tip) of floating line didn't sink. Worst offender was Cortlands Sylk line.

Mojo

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Old 01-27-2008, 08:53 PM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

Quote:
Originally Posted by mojo View Post
Bet if she mentioned Cortland you wouldn't have even mentioned this last paragraph.
I'd pretty much guess the gentleman is refering to trout fishing (when the post starts out him looking at a 9' 5w.) And most people out there try a floating line first. And suggesting the best line for the money ain't a sin or a crime. The Selective Trout can be used on any rod. You might want to try it sometime. It's a great line and the STII is even better.
FWIW, I've used Cortland, SA and Orvis "floating" lines for years. Then I discovered Rio. I was mildly taken aback when I noticed that the first 6' (tip) of floating line didn't sink. Worst offender was Cortlands Sylk line.

Mojo

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Actually I would, RIO makes very good lines, as do we, SA, Airflow, Teeny and Wulff among others. But most of the high end fly lines are fairly specialized. In all sincerity for most entry level rods, I wouldn't recommend Selective trout (for the record I wouldn't recommend Sylk either, a line designed for bamboo fly rods). Although it's a great line on most rods in the middle scale of flex. It would not be my first choice for fishing bigger streams out west for instance. I would much prefer our Western Drifter, SA's GPX or RIO Gold, or Grand for that application. That was all I'm saying I didn't mean to offend anyone, and certainly wasn't saying it was a bad line. That is why you pick the best rod for your application FIRST, and then MATCH THE LINE TO THE ROD. And for the record I have fished plenty of SA, RIO and Teeny lines in my life along with Cortland, I was fishing way before I became a rep.
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Old 01-27-2008, 08:55 PM
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Default Re: Rod Prices

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joni View Post
burk48237, You have some very valuable info there.
I didn't mean to ruffle any rep. feathers. Reason I mentioned this line at all is it is a WONDERFUL line and at a great price right now. He mention a 9' 5wt. which to me says TROUT.
I worked for Orvis and still bought RIO line, and CORTLAND, and SA.
No problem, I do wish the OP would have provided more info, Location? Species? Friends who fish? ect. But I didn't mean to attack you personally and sorry if it came across that way.
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