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  #131 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 09:37 AM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

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Originally Posted by sweetandsalt View Post
Not just yet, gentlemen, I have one last thing to say and I am directing it to all but, Dan, you in particular. You know I respect your opinions and I just know you are a terrific angler. Now, I have my prejudices...
And to that I say it is time for a blind rod test. The famous shoot-outs are all well and good as long as you know human nature and some bias is more than likely involved in the outcome.
I would simply LOVE to have the gamut of premium rods in the mix.
I mentioned this before but again, years ago when fine road bikes only allowed you different brand of steel with which to build your frame sets. Columbus, Reynolds and few others were the steel of choice for many who were as firm in their brand convictions as saltandsweet is with Sage.
A pro frame builder built up identical frame sets using the highest grade tube sets from the big tubing makers with the only identification being a number on the top tube. Only the builder knew which tube set went with each number. The professionals who test road the identically outfitted bikes were then given their evaluations of each frame using only the frame set number as an identifier. This test shook the industry and the convictions of a lot of people.
It would cost some big coin and a lot of time but a test like this I feel would shake things up TOO much in the comfy world of brand identity.
Maybe if we all chip in we can get a can of spray paint and paint some blanks all the same color and outfit them as identically as possible without changing guide spacing and numbers and do a REAL, blind shoot-out using fly fishers of all skill levels.
It seems that any other type of evaluation of rods is too tainted by human nature to be fair and unbiased, from shoot-outs to bulletin board posts. Cold, hard data on could prove to be interesting.
To back up the slick marketing and ads one would think rod manufacturers would jump at the chance to prove they are the best and would donate blanks to prove their confidence.
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  #132 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 02:07 PM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

All blanks, once sanded and before being painted are graphite grey. If a generic reel seat and cork grip where provided/specified and each company built their rod thus but using their own guides and spacing with plain black tread, only the arbitrarily assigned numerical code would significantly distinguish them. I too would LOVE to see such as test performed. I would like to see a team of FFF Master Casters and noted professional guides compose the evaluative committee (of course, I want to cast them too). Where I a rod maker I would jump at the opportunity to have my beloved design blind tested due to my overwhelming confidence in my product...as stated in my advertising. But I am not and I wonder which makers would risk having their $750 wonder go toe to toe with some up-starts $250 Asian imported blank. Such a blind test would be mighty informative and undoubtedly would shake things up.

---------- Post added at 02:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:47 PM ----------

Oh, and in addition to the great Sage rods I mentioned I am also a fan and fish rods from Hardy, G.Loomis, Scott, Rajeff Sports and some older models from Orvis, Redington and Albright as well. I plan this season on fishing new rods from Clutch, Rise and Flying Pig too. I will attend the FFF/CFFC&Museum Casting Rendezvous and switch some of these rods off with friends there to generate some comparative analytical opinion...not "blind" but as these rods are relatively unknown and I won't reveal price or build origin, it will be interesting.
  #133 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 03:22 PM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

Id like to see a way they could test 'fish on' performance. I know we do lot's more casting than catching,,and that casting IS important..but the climax of all that casting IS the feel of the fight.

Just not sure how they could,,scientifically,,, gauge that. ummm ??

Talk about individual 'notes' from the testers !!!!
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  #134 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 04:06 PM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

And in the end.......after all of the "blind" opinions were gathered and processed by computer program, using complicated numerical procedures.......the result would be announced as no surprise......because deep down in our hearts, we all know the truth......and the winner is.............

The Orvis Far and Fine....7 foot, 9 inch....5 weight....... secretly placed into the mix by one of our own.....under cover of mustache disguise....

It is now official...........The End.............
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  #135 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 06:07 PM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

Of course ,,,
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  #136 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 08:25 PM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

Fished with Sage rods of all levels for the last 20 years. Every one has been very competent to excellent when it comes to performance. Still own several that are "favorites". The Sage people know what they are doing when it comes to fly rods. The Sage Cosmetics? Are they the prettiest rods on the market? No, but Sage offers the most consistent rod performance on the market. I have always thought that the Premium Sage models were actually quite handsome. I do agree that the cork Sage uses hasn't been as clean and high quality as others, but it does hold up well over time. After you cover it up with layers of fish slime, it becomes unimportant anyway.

I own a Winston that is gorgeous, but it is a really poor casting and fishing rod. It never comes out of the tube any more. I have never found a Winston that performed well enough to justify the cost. There are many examples of Asian built rods that retail under $200 that out perform any rod Winston has ever made. IMO, Winston is a great example of "style over substance". Orvis is another example of the same thing. I have never picked up an Orvis stick that was worth buying at any price.

I do think that the CF Burkheimer rods are beautiful, and the ones that I have cast and fished, perform flawlessly. But, they should as they are semi-custom made.
  #137 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 09:10 PM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

Give me the Wiston. I'll take it.
  #138 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 09:58 PM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

LOL ! well,,I've had my 'funnie' for the night.
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Last edited by fly_guy12955; 03-24-2013 at 10:19 PM.
  #139 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 10:39 PM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

That was about as nice as you could have put it.
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  #140 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2013, 11:02 PM
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Default Re: Sage Fly Rod Cosmetics

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolhand View Post
Fished with Sage rods of all levels for the last 20 years. Every one has been very competent to excellent when it comes to performance. Still own several that are "favorites". The Sage people know what they are doing when it comes to fly rods. The Sage Cosmetics? Are they the prettiest rods on the market? No, but Sage offers the most consistent rod performance on the market. I have always thought that the Premium Sage models were actually quite handsome. I do agree that the cork Sage uses hasn't been as clean and high quality as others, but it does hold up well over time. After you cover it up with layers of fish slime, it becomes unimportant anyway.

I own a Winston that is gorgeous, but it is a really poor casting and fishing rod. It never comes out of the tube any more. I have never found a Winston that performed well enough to justify the cost. There are many examples of Asian built rods that retail under $200 that out perform any rod Winston has ever made. IMO, Winston is a great example of "style over substance".
Orvis is another example of the same thing. I have never picked up an Orvis stick that was worth buying at any price.

I do think that the CF Burkheimer rods are beautiful, and the ones that I have cast and fished, perform flawlessly. But, they should as they are semi-custom made.
Errr...... OK. Then you obviously have never cast a BIIIx, or a BIIt, or a WT, or even a BIIx (which I love though some hate it).

Now I am fairly new in the game but I cast rods any chance I get. When I meet someone new on the stream or am fishing with a buddy I'll ask to try out their fly rod.

Of all the rods I have cast (undoubtedly fewer than most here, but still a good representation of the major rod companies) I find that Winston is right up there with the others in performance, with looks that are to die for. I like small streams and medium actions, and the Winston BIIt is my favorite rod of all I have cast. So much so that I saved up for one and bought it.

Maybe its personal style- but you'll be hard pressed to find a lot of people willing to outright say Winston rods are all show and no go. I know enough experienced fly fisherman who fish them above any other that it's hard to believe that it's brand loyalty.

Oh, and care to give examples of sub $200 asian rods that outperform any rod Winston has made? I'm not being argumentative, its just that if such a rod exists I'd surely like to know about it. I love my TFOs and other brands as much as the next guy, but they aren't a match for Winston in any sense of the word.
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