Echo Fly rod questions

[joefbtg28]

Well I just got my Allen Kraken (size 2 for 5-6wt) in the mail today! It looks gorgeous in the Emerald Green. Looking to pair an Echo rod with it. My question is I can get a 2014 echo carbon for normal price $169 (at a local store) or a 2013 echo III for $225, reduced from $350, with free shipping (from an online retailer). Would it be worth the extra $56 (and the wait) to get the Echo III? Also, was there any major changes to the Echo III from the 2013 to 2014 versions? I will primarily be trout fishing streams and still water, with the some bass fishing. I was planning on getting the 9' 5wt, but would consider the 8'6" as well. I am guessing the medium-Fast would be better for trout and the Fast action would be better for Bass? Any insight would be very helpful, as I have been fishing my whole life, but am brand new to fly fishing.

 

[sweetandsalt]

The ECHO3 is a terrific rod. I do not know the reason for the discount but you can easily call Rajeff Sports and find out. Let us know what you discover.

 

[joefbtg28]

Thanks for the quick response! I will give them a call to verify if there were any changes and post back. The other rods I was looking at were either the TFO Pro II or the BVK, but sort of got put off with all the talk of the cork disintegrating. Am I worrying about that too much? I have heard reports of the handles starting to fall apart after 10 outings!

 

[sweetandsalt]

I believe both TFO and ECHO are built in Korea...the ECHO's seem better fabricated and more sophisticated in taper but I have not heard of TFO cork disintegrations. The ECHO's are tougher with better cork though. And they come with a tube.

 

[glacierjohn]

I LOVE my Echo 3 six weight...

 

[stl_geoff]

Where did you find an 2013 Echo 3 online for that price?????

Let me tell you why, I won a Echo 3S ( saltwater ) 6wt a few months ago. i REALLY like that rod, A LOT. So much so I wouldnt mind owning another or a few more. Compairing it to high end rods, it has almost nicer cork then my 5wt TCX and it definitly has nicer cork them my 7wt TCX. They are pretty similar in action, but the Echo feels alot more alive in my hands.

 

[fireroad]

I LOVE my Echo 3 six weight...

What's the action and tip like on the Echo3 6 weight? What do you primarily use it for?

 

[glacierjohn]

What's the action and tip like on the Echo3 6 weight? What do you primarily use it for?

Mine's a 10' six weight, I primarily use it streamer fishing spring high water conditions. It's a fast action and I don't normally like fast actions, but I like this one. I would guess it has a softer tip than most fast action rods, but S&S can better answer that question.

 

[stl_geoff]

I would agree to a softer tip then most fast action rods.

 

[sweetandsalt]

And I would call mine (9'/#6) medium-fast with responsive tip. I have used it as my go to drift boat rod for general conditions (as I said, replacing my only satisfactory BVK#6) which means it has tossed golden stone dries at the banks while floating and PMD's to risers while on anchor. It is well matched with an Airflo #6. I consider the ECHO3's among best in class in the mid price range and the above mentioned cork is (I suspect) from the same source as used on the other Rajeff brother's NRX's. This is an old growth, dense and grain figured cork that I too like the look and feel of. Unlike NRX, Tim Rajeff's taper designs are intentionally more forgiving and accessible to casters across a broader capability range and Tim is also obsessed with durability, testing his rods beyond where the breaking point should be.

 

[plecain]

I ended up with an Echo3, 7'6" 3 wt. when I broke a Shadow PE and they didn't have the parts to fix it.

It's a great rod - moderately fast with good soft tip action.

A couple of weeks ago I took it on a trip to Maine (see "A day in Maine" on this forum). I got into 3½ - 4 lb. brook trout. The rod handled those perfectly. I got them to the net quickly and its tip protected the tippets. I did switch to 4X tippet to help getting the fish in quicker.

 

[fireroad]

And I would call mine (9'/#6) medium-fast with responsive tip. I have used it as my go to drift boat rod for general conditions (as I said, replacing my only satisfactory BVK#6) which means it has tossed golden stone dries at the banks while floating and PMD's to risers while on anchor. It is well matched with an Airflo #6. I consider the ECHO3's among best in class in the mid price range and the above mentioned cork is (I suspect) from the same source as used on the other Rajeff brother's NRX's. This is an old growth, dense and grain figured cork that I too like the look and feel of. Unlike NRX, Tim Rajeff's taper designs are intentionally more forgiving and accessible to casters across a broader capability range and Tim is also obsessed with durability, testing his rods beyond where the breaking point should be.

I appreciate the input! Obviously different price ranges but...any thoughts on how it compares to the Zenith with regards to streamers?

 

[glacierjohn]

I appreciate the input! Obviously different price ranges but...any thoughts on how it compares to the Zenith with regards to streamers?

Fireroad, are you getting my PMs? I replied twice but they don't show up in my sent file?

 

[glacierjohn]

Alright, I just got back in the house after lawn casting both my Radian 9' five weight and my Echo-3 10' six weight. Fireroad had PMed me wondering how fast the Echo-3 was compared to a Radian which he had cast previously.

First thing is there is a lot of difference between a ten foot six versus a nine foot five, even in the same series, so it's a little apples to oranges. Also the Radian is a very light rod with its new technology compared to the Echo-3 which is a bit more traditional, so the ten foot Echo-3 felt and was way heavier in hand, probably about what you would expect from any normal graphite ten foot rod. So casting a lighter rod with lighter line didn't really compare to the six weight with a WF GPX.

I have always found it easier to cast heavier line weights further and that was the case here. I put a bucket lid 70' out on the lawn and was easily able to hit it with the Echo-3. I could consistently hit it with the Radian with a double haul and shooting the line, but it was more work. Both rods are more fast action than I'm used to, but despite Scott's "fast with feel" mantra, I was able to feel the Echo-3 load a bit easier. They both cast well 25-30 feet, but again I could feel the Echo-3 a little more, I think it's just a difference in line weight.

As I said really hard to compare, I did notice the Echo-3 bends a little further toward the handle than the Radian, but they were close. I don't know how much this helps but that's all I got.

John

 

[fireroad]

Hey John - Thanks for the pm's and the input. And thanks for casting your rods side by side and sharing the results! I've only found one shop (online) that carries the Echo 3 and the Radian. When I talked to them 4-5 months ago asking about med-fast to fast action rods with a tip firm enough to throw streamers they suggested either the G Loomis Pro 4x or the Echo 3, with most of the staff preferring the Echo 3.

Just for giggles I called them again today with the same question. The guy I spoke with felt that, while the Echo 3 is a good rod, the Radian was by far the better choice. I shared my initial thoughts in that I felt the Radian was much stiffer and faster than expected (or advertised). They strongly suggested giving it a second chance as it does takes some time with the rod to get the right cadence. That makes sense to me,but since the closest Scott dealer is 5.5 hrs away I just might take a chance on the Echo instead.

 

[sweetandsalt]

Just for giggles, ask them about the Loomis SteamDance GLX HLS #6 and see what they say. I am intrigued by the Radian #6 but more as a dry fly rod for bigger water. I have not fished one but cast it at our winter show and did not consider it fast as in ONE fast. In fact the new Sage Method was in the same group of rods I cast at that time and compared to it the Radian felt medium!

 

[glacierjohn]

Just for giggles, ask them about the Loomis SteamDance GLX HLS #6 and see what they say. I am intrigued by the Radian #6 but more as a dry fly rod for bigger water. I have not fished one but cast it at our winter show and did not consider it fast as in ONE fast. In fact the new Sage Method was in the same group of rods I cast at that time and compared to it the Radian felt medium![/QUOTE]

Wow, that's why I asked people to rate rod actions on that other thread. I think it's all what you are used to. I hated the Z-Axis because it felt way too fast (stiff) to me. I tried to open my mind and tried the One and Radian, to me they are almost exactly the same, super fast, but both "felt" better than the Z-Axis. I can't imagine what a Method feels like. As I posted above, to me the Radian seems a little faster than the Echo-3.

John

 

[coolhand]

At the $300-$400 price point:

Echo3 9', #6 is an excellent streamer rod (it is what it does best) at it's price point. Super tough blank, good components and cork for a Korean built product. FWIW, this is my primary workhorse #6 for heavier payloads.

G. Loomis Pro 4X 9'6", #6 (not the 9') maybe a little better yet (a little stronger butt section) as a streamer rod for a few more dollars. USA made, components are good, kind of ugly.


At the premium price point (over $500):

Sage XP (690 or 790) - discontinued but excellent for streamer rod

G. Loomis NRX (#6 and #7, 9') are my favorite "power" rods for streamer fishing and bigger payloads. Pricey, though...

The Scott Radian is a beautiful rod, but probably better suited for dry fly and nymphing. Enough power for streamers? Jury is still out for me.

The Sage One is super light, quick and fun to cast. But lacks the absolute butt power that the NRX or XP has. I don't like the One as much as the previously mentioned series with heavy payloads. Seems like kind of a "race car" specialty rod that likes light and medium sized flies doesn't like to get "dirty".

 

[fly_guy12955]

I'm starting to think Echo has their act together really well. I hear the glass callin' my name ! But I like the looks of them all really.

Mike

 

[fireroad]

At the $300-$400 price point:

Echo3 9', #6 is an excellent streamer rod (it is what it does best) at it's price point. Super tough blank, good components and cork for a Korean built product. FWIW, this is my primary workhorse #6 for heavier payloads.

Thanks for your input! I've narrowed down my search for a 6wt streamer rod to the Echo 3 and the Zenith. If I can't get a opportunity to cast either rod I will probably take a chance on the Echo 3 based on input from glacierjohn and coolhand.