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-   -   Fish - Smart / Notsmart? (http://www.theflyfishingforum.com/forums/forum-polls/103008-fish-smart-notsmart.html)

Bigfly 02-11-2011 01:09 PM

Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
OK, it won't be scientific, but let's see if we can't get something usable out of this effort.
As far as a definition of "smart", lets just say they're able to learn and can get tougher to catch.
Since there are all kinds of fish, and fisher-persons, let's include age, yrs fished, and type of water fished (nameless dinky creek, famous destination waters, mid sized mountain stream, stocked pond, etc.).

So, which is it, in your expirience? Fish - Smart / Not-smart?

Jim

trout333 02-11-2011 05:47 PM

Re: Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
Not Smart! Fish for the most part do what they do. Be one with the fish and you should be able to catch them. But I have experienced the phenomenon of pressured versus non pressured water and sometimes wonder what that is about.

fyshstykr 02-11-2011 06:03 PM

Re: Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
I too believe fish become conditioned. How could they not get conditioned when on some water they see almost every imaginable fly everyday during the season? Like-wise a wary fisherman will also develop new techniques to fool them, much like Ard has done.

I was once told to "Never offend a fish's instinct to sense danger".

madjoni 02-11-2011 06:20 PM

Re: Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigfly (Post 207662)
OK, it won't be scientific, but let's see if we can't get something usable out of this effort.
As far as a definition of "smart", lets just say they're able to learn and can get tougher to catch.
Since there are all kinds of fish, and fisher-persons, let's include age, yrs fished, and type of water fished (nameless dinky creek, famous destination waters, mid sized mountain stream, stocked pond, etc.).

So, which is it, in your expirience? Fish - Smart / Not-smart?

Jim

No easy answer,but fish can learn( something:rolleyes:)...so its smart:)

Guest1 02-11-2011 07:43 PM

Re: Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
Based on fish in general, not smart. Some species are fairly smart though. Like Largemouth Bass, which once caught on a specific lure or fly, will never hit one again. Years ago, I basically trained an entire small lake full of Bass to never hit a white spinnerbait. Musky are the same not only turning down the lure thereafter, but generally will not return to the spot it was hooked, associating it with a bad experiance and will not venture that shallow again as a rule. Then you have fish like Goldfish which have been scientifically shown to have a short term memory shorter than a minute.....by nearly a minute. It varies species to species. Walleye, despite their reputation as a smart and wary fish, are dumber than a bag of hammers. This is a you tube video where I caught the same large Walleye twice. 15 days apart with the same fly, in the same spot. It was caught at least once in between the two times I caught it, as I hand land them and it's fins are split up the second time, from being in a net.



Bigfly 02-11-2011 08:04 PM

Re: Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
I wasn't asking if they can do advanced math.
I just don't have a better word for what they do.
"Conditioned" implies no free will, and I can take you to a fish that will try for a stump he loves, before you know he's on.
Another fish (shamu) goes straight to the bottom and straight back out, for as many times as it takes, for you to go away.
More than few have a "trick list". A client got to see me with a big brown, who went through all... of his tricks, and I stayed right with him.
Then he decided to climb/crawl over a beaver dam. We stood there with our jaws quite relaxed. Seemed like a smart basterd to me.
Thought you guys would understand.....

Trout 333, the "wonder" is your jedi sense kicking in, when faced by a worthy foe. Who may pull your pants down.
Oh and Dan, you are my new film hero.

Robgcp 02-11-2011 09:07 PM

Re: Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
I honestly believe fish are stupid....Most of them are smarter than I am it seems:rolleyes:

ant 02-12-2011 07:26 PM

Re: Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
I'm throwing my hat in with that fish are smart, depending on the fish. I have the privilege of fishing some of PA's most pressured waters. There is one spot that has dozens of trout of all sizes(literally.)Big bubba's down to sardines. No matter what fly, bait, etc. you throw to them, you will never get a fish over 7", unless you get lucky and get one that's freshly stocked.

My only explanation is that as the fish matures it will see every K-mart bait and fly thrown at it, and it learns from that experience.

Now if we're talking bluegills....;)

trout333 02-12-2011 10:23 PM

Re: Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigfly (Post 207881)
"Conditioned" implies no free will, and I can take you to a fish that will try for a stump he loves, before you know he's on.
Another fish (shamu) goes straight to the bottom and straight back out, for as many times as it takes, for you to go away.
More than few have a "trick list". A client got to see me with a big brown, who went through all... of his tricks, and I stayed right with him.
Then he decided to climb/crawl over a beaver dam. We stood there with our jaws quite relaxed. Seemed like a smart basterd to me.
Thought you guys would understand.....

I thought about this for a little bit and this is what I came up with. Maybe fish have "routines". For example, if you hook a fish in it's favorite particular stomping ground, he always goes for the same boulder and breaks you off. Maybe fish have a "safe place" that they run to whenever they sense danger. Danger being birds of prey swooping down on fish, other land dwelling predators, and getting a hook upside the head. If anything upsets them, they go to the "safe place." Perhaps there are other "routines" fish have that if we are mindful, know how to adjust our fishing for them. Maybe fish aren't smart or not smart, we just get to be smarter than them :D

Hardyreels 02-13-2011 01:56 AM

Re: Fish - Smart / Notsmart?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by trout333 (Post 208436)
I thought about this for a little bit and this is what I came up with. Maybe fish have "routines". For example, if you hook a fish in it's favorite particular stomping ground, he always goes for the same boulder and breaks you off. Maybe fish have a "safe place" that they run to whenever they sense danger. Danger being birds of prey swooping down on fish, other land dwelling predators, and getting a hook upside the head. If anything upsets them, they go to the "safe place." Perhaps there are other "routines" fish have that if we are mindful, know how to adjust our fishing for them. Maybe fish aren't smart or not smart, we just get to be smarter than them :D

Now that sounds like good solid thinking, I once posted about such behavior but can't remember which thread that was on. Anyway I think you're onto something there 333


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