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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2009, 09:10 PM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoJer View Post
Is fishing with leadcore different than fishing with a full-sink line or a sink tip?
Lots of folks "troll" with sinking lines and streamers, chironomids, from float tubes. It's a pretty common way of fishing deep stillwater.
I don't have an opinion pro or con as far as the "cheating", I'm just throwing this out there.
Agree with you 100%. More to life than floating line and dries.
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Old 08-11-2009, 11:52 PM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

There are guys on the North shore of Lake Superior who use slinky rigs on fly rods. They either put a spinning reel on the rod or spool the fly reel with mono. Camo line as the prefered line. They then fish the slinky rig on the bottom of the line with a yarn fly on a dropper a foot or so up the line. You "chuck" it up current and keeping the line tight and allowing the slinky to slide along the bottom, set the hook on any pause in the drift. It's called "Chuck and Duck" I don't consider that fly fishing either.
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Old 08-12-2009, 07:34 AM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

Back in the 80's we did that with salmon fishing in N.Y. (salmon river) you filled your fly reel with mono then a swivel, add to that 4' of leader and some weight, add the fly to the end. Oh wait I think it is called center pinning now...lol...
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Old 08-15-2009, 09:29 PM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

I manage to get out fly fishing for walleyes a couple times per year. I fish for them in rivers, but i just use sink tip line with large streamers. I have found that i can keep up with a person using rapala's, and once this year the spin fishermen were skunked and i still managed to land a couple small walleyes on flies.
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Old 08-17-2009, 02:11 AM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

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Originally Posted by MTskibum View Post
I manage to get out fly fishing for walleyes a couple times per year. I fish for them in rivers, but i just use sink tip line with large streamers. I have found that i can keep up with a person using rapala's, and once this year the spin fishermen were skunked and i still managed to land a couple small walleyes on flies.
What kind of flies are you using? So far the best flies for me have been clousers, and a black marabou leach pattern I tie with hourglass eyes (plain lead) tied on clouser style.
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Old 08-22-2009, 05:59 PM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

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Originally Posted by Diver Dan View Post
I decided to see what kind of advice is floating around the internet for fly fishing Walleye. I hate to say it, but most of it is outright wrong or cheating in my opinion. One site said troll flies with a BOTTOM BOUNCER (!!!!!) on the leader. Another said troll flies with lead core line. Am I the only one who thinks this is not fly fishing? Sure you use a fly rod and flies, but really? Bottom bouncers and lead core? Is this still fly fishing? Another one said you have to go to far North Canada to fly fish Walleye this time of year. Nobody told the three big Walleyes I got this evening. (Just South of far South Canada)
Ok Diver you got my argumentative side up

The way you are ranting I figure you consider Nymph Fishing or High Sticking Nymps with Doubles and a SPLITSHOT not fly fishing either? I totally disagree and wouldn't it be better spent to rant on those that are poaching fish or fishing illegal rather than the ones that are going out and enjoying what we call as fishing fly or not?

My rant over.. I still call nymph fishing fly fishing and quite the addictive art.

CritterGetter
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Old 08-23-2009, 01:24 AM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

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Originally Posted by crittergetter View Post
Ok Diver you got my argumentative side up

The way you are ranting I figure you consider Nymph Fishing or High Sticking Nymps with Doubles and a SPLITSHOT not fly fishing either? I totally disagree and wouldn't it be better spent to rant on those that are poaching fish or fishing illegal rather than the ones that are going out and enjoying what we call as fishing fly or not?

My rant over.. I still call nymph fishing fly fishing and quite the addictive art.

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Well you would be figuring wrong about that. I have no problem with any of your examples. I seriously don't think you understand what a bottom bouncer is. It is a wire, 12 - 18" or so, bent into an L shape with a line attachment at the bend and another on the short end of the L. On the long end of the L there is a lead weight in the 3/4 to several Oz. zone. This was recommended on a site for FLY FISHING for walleye. I have a casting rod, with a line counter reel spooled with lead core. I troll crankbaits for walleyes. If I replace the crankbait with a fly, am I fly fishing then? This is what the fly fishing for walleye site recommended except it was with a fly rod. I do not see how that is fly fishing. Do you? If you had read my post you would have seen this was THE only two things I did not think was fly fishing. Not nymphs, split shot, or anything else you put there. None of it. And to top it off you didn't even mention the two things I did list. Just for the record the last guy I caught poaching, I took video of it and hand delivered it to the game warden. No cheesy pixilated video either. Good clear video with chapters, and an interactive menu. I have optical zoom, and really good video software. So how about this, start over and look at what I actually said, and stop assuming, reading tarot cards, crystal balls or whatever it is you did there. Seriously, where did you get any of that?
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Old 08-23-2009, 04:17 PM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

Since up to this point, I don't think any of you know what a bottom bouncer is, ( nor should any fly fisherman need to ) I am posting a picture of it. The big orange and chartreuese lump on this giant wire hardware is a 2 oz. chunk of lead. This hardware was suggested to go in the leader and then troll the fly. In this system the entire fly rod/ fly line/ fly reel system is just for show. Any rod can do this. Hence my feeling that this is not fly fishing despite what the fly fishing site that recomended it thinks. Also pictured is a rod with a line counter reel and a spool of lead core. The rod set up pictured is the best way to troll lead core. Once again making the fly rod etc. just for show. I'm not saying you shouldn't do it or it should be made illegal or anything other than I don't think it should still be called fly fishing just because there is a fly involved. If I tape a fly to a piece of dynamite would that still be fly fishing? Here is a question for you; What would the IGFA call it?
Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 08-23-2009, 07:53 PM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

TOUCHE

And before I have my rebuttal I want to THANK YOU for helping out your local Fish and Game. (I have taken digital photo of the cars and the poachers but never video) Our Fish and Game employees are overworked, undermanned, underpaid and need all the help they can get. To often you will find Fly Fishing elitists standing in a fly only catch and release area and will say noting and I mean nothing a the illegal fishing some 30 feet from them. I can rant over and over about that. And, it isn’t that I am a fly fishing elitist. I fish bait in the bait area (In Mo we call it Beer and Bell’s fishing). I fly fish in the fly only area why can’t they. I just prefer fly fishing over bait.

So now to the rebuttal:
I what I am saying is… if you are catching fish by any means with a fly rod it is fly fishing and that is ok by me.

Now it isn’t a “River runs through it fly fishing” but would that be you have to be a Brad Pit and top water fly fish all the time to call it fly fishing? I recently showed a 65 year old ultra light fisherman how to tie a double beadhead wollybugger like I had on my fly rod and he went to town. I still would say I was fly fishing and he was spinner fishing but we were using both the same setup. Two months ago I figured out how to rig a 12’ to 15’ leader with two hooks of Minnows. I would “Plop Cast” and had a ball nymphing a East Texas lake for Crappie. Incidentally the sensitivity of my fly rod would transmit a strike better than my fishing buddies with their ultra lights. I would consider that fly fishing for crappies. Again, I wouldn’t consider that traditional at all but I really had a ball.

My biggest point here is you can use any technique to catch fish with any type of rig. I prefer a fly rod over ultra light or St. Croix bass rod.

I could take your point and I actually couldn't see myself fly fishing with the bottom bouncer. spin cast getup would work better...

However, using your point would you say any form of streamer or minnow or even tandem rig on a fly rod isn’t fly fishing.. I would still prefer to say, use what ever technique you want with what ever getup you want as long as you enjoy the outdoors and being in the moment. And, most of all “pass it on to others” we don’t have enough XBOX kids learning outdoors activities and I feel in 30 years they will be voting tax dollars away from already dwindling fish and game and DNR coffers.

thanks..
Crittergetter

PS.. and thanks for the debate this weekend I couldn't go fishing so this was fun and if you ever want to get a zen like read "Trout Bum" is great for this esoteric form of thought.
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Old 08-23-2009, 10:02 PM
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Default Re: Funky internet advice.....Cheating?

Quote:
Originally Posted by crittergetter View Post
TOUCHE

So now to the rebuttal:
I what I am saying is… if you are catching fish by any means with a fly rod it is fly fishing and that is ok by me.



My biggest point here is you can use any technique to catch fish with any type of rig. I prefer a fly rod over ultra light or St. Croix bass rod.

I could take your point and I actually couldn't see myself fly fishing with the bottom bouncer. spin cast getup would work better...

However, using your point would you say any form of streamer or minnow or even tandem rig on a fly rod isn’t fly fishing..
thanks..
Crittergetter

PS.. and thanks for the debate this weekend I couldn't go fishing so this was fun and if you ever want to get a zen like read "Trout Bum" is great for this esoteric form of thought.
I agree with the first point I left in your quote. If it is legal, it is fine to do it. I just think it should not be called fly fishing on a fly fishing site when it clearly isn't. You said any method using a fly rod is fly fishing. Would trolling a crank bait on a fly rod be fly fishing?

Your second point I completely disagree with. I have used tandem fly rigs, nymphs, strike indicators, split shot, etc. and have no problem with that being called fly fishing. All of that is accepted methods of fly fishing. I never even mentioned them.

And your welcome for the debate. All in good fun.
Update on the video: I watched the game Warden come down and get a poacher at the same spot tonight. Not the guy I had in the video, as he's still waiting for that guy to come back. I know this warden, and he'll get him eventually.
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