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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 03-09-2011, 11:21 AM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

Another thing that's easily done and useful when presenting a fly this way is a slight "twitch" at the last moment to get the trouts attention. With a slightly longer tippet and by just raising the rod tip again(and lowering when achieved) you can fairly easily "twitch" your fly.
Not that your gonna do this on every fish, or even when you start working one, but sometimes on a difficult fish or a during a heavy hatch it can make a difference.
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Old 03-09-2011, 11:31 AM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

John, that tip is right there with "the mud".
Say no more, mums the word, forget I said it........
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Old 03-09-2011, 12:15 PM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

LOL! Yea, but I can go back and 'edit' my post.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 03-09-2011, 06:30 PM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

I dont dry fly fish very often, or, I should say without attaching a dropper nymph. But when I do fish a single dry fly, I use an old Cortland 6'6" pro crest and an extremely long leader, upstream. I'm just more comfortable fishing up then down. Although I think I keep that tendency as I haven't had success fishing downstream


*they replaced my 7' 40+ year old pro crest for free when it cracked this past season.*
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Old 03-09-2011, 08:21 PM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigfly View Post
In my opinion, up or downstream gets the job done.
Besides pinpoint placement, a downstream drift allows for much more range.
I may cast 50-60 ft upstream on occasion (accurately), but can present almost double that downstream. (Not that you should).
To me, there is nothing better than spotting a piggy in a bubble line, placing my fly in said line, a sending it (same day) to him.
Timing his rises and having the package arrive just when he's ready for another bite.
I'm getting worked up just writing this!!!!!!
The Truckee has converted me to this style, because fish here are pretty spooky.
Waving the rod around isn't sneaky enough. But drop a fly on the water and send it down. They just can't see ya coming.
About a million misses led me to strip set, so ya, it's a learned thing.

Jim
When your drifting downstream, how do you effectively feed line out of the guides and keep a long drift going? I've tried a few methods, but just about everything moves the fly in an unnatural way. I guess maybe it's easier when you know you need a natural looking drift for only a few feet in front of a fish that you've spotted.

The main reason I fish upstream is the ability to keep a drag free drift while keeping slack in the line to a minimum. I will, however, be giving the strip set a try next time I go out. I figure it's worth a try, as I am hit or miss with the hookset as is.
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Old 03-10-2011, 09:55 AM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

oregonism, it would be easier to show, but I have a small J-loop near my fly/bobber.
I don't want the line running straight to the fly because drag would be immediate, and costly!
First cast up stream, then as the the fly drifts by you and starts downstream, place your line in the same current line that the fly is in (a steel-head mend). Continue to "bump or wiggle " line out of the guides. If you move the rod tip nearer the water when you do this, more surface tension grabs the line and allows you to move your rod/line without moving the fly. This takes some practice, and it helps to be able to see in your mind what effects the currents will have on your line, before they actually do.
Mending is much more about proactive moves, than it is reactive. See where a belly is forming in the line's drift and address it before drag is a problem. Don't allow a belly to get downstream of your bobber/fly. If you do, you are behind the curve.
Then when you move line the fly will move for sure.
I use this technique to maintain drifts of 50-60 feet without a problem. The most important thing, is not to do a lazy mans mend.
Almost every one I guide does this. We are taught a sideways flip will do the job.
When I mend, I lift ALL the line I can off the water first, then gesture towards the mend direction. If done correctly the fly/bobber won't move. The more line you have on the water, the more force it takes to move it.
Remember, if your bobber moves, the fly moves. The enlightened fish watches for this. You can usually manipulate all but the three feet of line next to the fly, without issue.
Very little is written about placing line on the water, but this is as important as fly choice, or water choice. If you get a "maximum drift" you will get a better shot at more and bigger fish. A low sweep set downstream works well until the fly goes by you.
Then, rod tip down and slow/fast strip. Hope this helps.

Jim
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Last edited by Bigfly; 03-10-2011 at 10:39 AM.
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Old 03-10-2011, 12:23 PM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

I actually learned the downstream method from Gary Borger on one of his videos years ago as he fished to a persnickety bow on the Railroad Ranch section of the Henry's Fork. Measure your cast away from the fish, and then drop a short cast into the feeding lane. Feed line until you're quite close to the rising fish, skating your fly if necessary so it hits the mark right on, and then drop your rod tip and feed line as it passes over the feeding fish. The key to good hookups is pausing to set the hook after the take to assure the fish has turned down - too soon and you will pull the fly right out of its mouth. Anyway, this is my favorite way to fish dry flies. When you only get a few chances, if that, you want to make it count, and being able to pinpoint your cast, make adjustments by skating your fly into the feeding lane when necessary, and, most important of all, not allowing any leader to pass over the fish ahead of the fly, the rewards are great and its a fun process to behold and to master.

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Old 03-10-2011, 01:10 PM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigfly View Post
oregonism, it would be easier to show, but I have a small J-loop near my fly/bobber.
I don't want the line running straight to the fly because drag would be immediate, and costly!
First cast up stream, then as the the fly drifts by you and starts downstream, place your line in the same current line that the fly is in (a steel-head mend). Continue to "bump or wiggle " line out of the guides. If you move the rod tip nearer the water when you do this, more surface tension grabs the line and allows you to move your rod/line without moving the fly. This takes some practice, and it helps to be able to see in your mind what effects the currents will have on your line, before they actually do.
Mending is much more about proactive moves, than it is reactive. See where a belly is forming in the line's drift and address it before drag is a problem. Don't allow a belly to get downstream of your bobber/fly. If you do, you are behind the curve.
Then when you move line the fly will move for sure.
I use this technique to maintain drifts of 50-60 feet without a problem. The most important thing, is not to do a lazy mans mend.
Almost every one I guide does this. We are taught a sideways flip will do the job.
When I mend, I lift ALL the line I can off the water first, then gesture towards the mend direction. If done correctly the fly/bobber won't move. The more line you have on the water, the more force it takes to move it.
Remember, if your bobber moves, the fly moves. The enlightened fish watches for this. You can usually manipulate all but the three feet of line next to the fly, without issue.
Very little is written about placing line on the water, but this is as important as fly choice, or water choice. If you get a "maximum drift" you will get a better shot at more and bigger fish. A low sweep set downstream works well until the fly goes by you.
Then, rod tip down and slow/fast strip. Hope this helps.

Jim
I was originally taught to stack the line after the initial mend when fishing downstream. Cast slightly upstream, toss in a quick mend and start stacking so the fly can drift below you a ways. I can do it pretty well, and it keeps enough tension on the line so you can 'shake' line out of the guides and keep a nice drift going... I just never understood how to set the hook when you create that much slack in the line, so I've missed a lot of small takes that way. That's why I'm curious if there is a more effective method.

My mend techinque is a little more agressive... I lift up line and then snap the rod forward like a mini roll-cast, and it can move a lot of line quickly and you can stack the line if you need to as well. I am still experimenting with indicator techniques for different water types though.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2011, 01:33 PM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

I do not stack line. I keep fly line as direct straight-line as possible, except for the J shaped bend in the line near the fly.
That way a quick short move of the rod, or short strip set will connect.
Very little slack actually in the system. This only works well if your fly line is in the same speed current that your fly is in, and keeping pace with it.
Of course, you still need the gunfighter squint.

Jim
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Old 03-10-2011, 01:41 PM
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Default Re: Upstream or downstream....

"Gunfighter Squint", I like it! I've always called it my very poor Clint Eastwood imitation as I ask the fish if their "feelin' lucky" today; "well, are ya, punk?!"

My best presentation in such situations requires me to trail my imitation behind something such as a Parasol Emerger in order to let me know where the fly is in the drift. The "Gunfighter Squint" quit serving me quite a few years back. Getting old ain't for sissies...

Kelly.
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