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Old 02-14-2010, 05:00 PM
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Default Regarding Traditional Methods

This is an old thread but after reading through the posts; there are some very interesting entries. It is a little hard to follow but I think you'll get the idea of what we were talking about.

I have moved the last two posts regarding fishing methods to this thread to avoid diluting the original threads content.

Quote (Hardyreels)

"Thank you Walter,

My having acquired the knack for detecting a take was the result of growing up in the midst of a generation of old fishermen who would never have dreamed of an indicator. The measure of a nympher was his technique and his ability to consistently catch fish even when no hatch was on the water. Today we live in a country driven by a need for instant gratification and sometimes in the rush to obtain results many important intrinsics are lost."


Quote (Walter)

"That is a great point. If there were any justice in the sport - the guy who first decided to call a bobber a "strike indicator" would be relegated to fishing for sunnies with wonderbread balls on the end of his eagle claw...LOL. (intellectual gobbledygook at its best) I guess in essense the true definition of a strike indicator is a guy who knows when his leaders been messed with.... a pair of good eyes, a sensitive leader, a "feeling" all can be used to describe that. Right now I've been focused on dry fly fishing because 2009 was the year I became a semi-purist....I just became addicted to watching our finned friends fall prey to our trickery. That being said - maybe dry fly purists are nothing more than loafers. A lazy uninterested novice can witness a trout rising to your dry fly....but only an experienced gent or lady will be able to note the subtle movements in your leader."

OK Walter, lets continue..................


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lambchop

Having suffered through 26 years of walking the high road with Ard back here in PA, I have to say that it ain't the catchin' it's the fishin' that matters. I say "high road" not to disparage those who choose to use other, and many times more effective, methods, but to relate the highroad as a personal standard. Set your personal highroad and stay true to it.
As we liked to say back in the day, "If all I want to do is put fish in the creel there are always quarter sticks, that'll bring 'em to hand tight quick".

The Chop

Last edited by Hardyreels; 01-13-2012 at 05:11 PM. Reason: Interesting post added!
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Old 02-14-2010, 06:49 PM
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Default Re: Regarding Traditional Methods

I'm not Walter, but had considered starting the same thread, Ard.

tra-di-tion:
1 a : an inherited, established, or customary pattern of thought, action, or behavior (as a religious practice or a social custom) b : a belief or story or a body of beliefs or stories relating to the past that are commonly accepted as historical though not verifiable
2 : the handing down of information, beliefs, and customs by word of mouth or by example from one generation to another without written instruction
3 : cultural continuity in social attitudes, customs, and institutions
4 : characteristic manner, method, or style <in the best liberal tradition>

Which ff'ing tradition are we speaking of? Perhaps this:

British fly-fishing continued to develop in the 19th Century, with the emergence of fly fishing clubs, along with the appearance of several books on the subject of fly tying and fly fishing techniques. In southern England, dry-fly fishing acquired an elitist reputation as the only acceptable method of fishing the slower, clearer rivers of the south such as the River Test and the other chalk streams concentrated in Hampshire, Surrey, Dorset and Berkshire (see Southern England Chalk Formation for the geological specifics). The weeds found in these rivers tend to grow very close to the surface, and it was felt necessary to develop new techniques that would keep the fly and the line on the surface of the stream. These became the foundation of all later dry-fly developments. However, there was nothing to prevent the successful employment of wet flies on these chalk streams, as George Edward MacKenzie Skues proved with his nymph and wet fly techniques. To the horror of dry-fly purists, Skues later wrote two books, Minor Tactics of the Chalk Stream, and The Way of a Trout with a Fly, which greatly influenced the development of wet fly fishing. In northern England and Scotland, many anglers also favored wet-fly fishing, where the technique was more popular and widely practiced than in southern England. One of Scotland’s leading proponents of the wet fly in the early-to-mid 19th century was W.C. Stewart, who published "The Practical Angler" in 1857.

....or this:

In the late 19th century, American anglers, such as Theodore Gordon, in the Catskill Mountains of New York began using fly tackle to fish the region’s many brook trout-rich streams such as the Beaverkill and Willowemoc Creek. Many of these early American fly anglers also developed new fly patterns and wrote extensively about their sport, increasing the popularity of fly fishing in the region and in the United States as a whole.[8] One such man was Charles F. Orvis, who through his actions helped to popularize fly fishing by designing and distributing novel reel and fly designs. His 1874 fly reel was described by reel historian Jim Brown as the "benchmark of American reel design," the first fully modern fly reel.[9][10]. The founding of The Orvis Company helped institutionalise fly fishing within America and supplied angling equipment and accessories to the homes of millions of Americans. His elegantly printed tackle catalogs, distributed to a small but devoted customer list in the late 1800s, are now highly collectible as early forerunners of today's enormous direct-mail outdoor products industry. The Junction Pool in Roscoe, where the Willowemoc flows into the Beaver Kill, is the center of an almost ritual pilgrimage every April 1, when the season begins. Albert Bigelow Paine, a New England author, wrote about fly fishing in The Tent Dwellers, a book about a three week trip he and a friend took to central Nova Scotia in 1908.

...or is this it?

Participation in fly fishing peaked in the early 1920s in the eastern states of Maine and Vermont and in the Midwest in the spring creeks of Wisconsin. Along with deep sea fishing, Ernest Hemingway did much to popularize fly fishing through his works of fiction, including The Sun Also Rises. It was the development of inexpensive fiberglass rods, synthetic fly lines, and monofilament leaders, however, in the early 1950s, that revived the popularity of fly fishing, especially in the United States.

During which era did any technique, or acceptable equipment become carved in stone? I'm a romantic, and have read enough older books to have a warm
spot in my heart for split cane. Of course I'm referring to the Catskills tapers, and not the older English tapers. I wouldn't want to have to care for a silk line, however, so I use the modern convenience of plastic. Same with horse hair leaders, and I like to tie my own leaders, regardless of what anyone says
about modern extruded types. It suits my tastes if at least half of the material on my flies is natural, and synthetic flies tend to leave me cold.

I do not accept using scents of any sort in my world of ff'ing, nor do I consider it proper. Same goes for prospecting with spinning gear, and then
breaking out the fly rod once fish are found. Canoes are preferred over Triton bass boats, but a larger boat would provide greater safety on big lakes and
rivers. I occassionally use a dropper, but like to have an idea of which fly the fish will take: a large Hare's Ear to get a fish's attention, and a small
midge for the take in swift currents works well for me. I have used indicators during the past couple years, but have run out. I'm to go back to using a dry
as an indicator again. It looks more like flyfishing, and suits my own personal notion of style.

Speaking of style, I'll have to use Justice Potter Stewart's remark, "I know it when I see it." Style is very important to my fly fishing aesthetics, and guady indicator/bobbers do not suit my style. The little section of tubing that Gary Borger used 30 years ago, is more to my liking if anything must be attached to the leader. That's my story, and I'm sticking with it...for now.
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Old 02-14-2010, 07:20 PM
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Default Re: Regarding Traditional Methods

I grew up fishing a cast of wet flies on a long leader with a 9' cane rod
That was the way my grandfather fished and that's the way I learned, That's traditional fly fishing to me.
Simple mending, the greased line swing, the Leisenring lift...
Those are the fundamentals.

When I wasn't doing that, I was high stick, dead drifting bait through pocket water.
I'm talking 40-45 years ago when I was just a kid.
High sticking worms with a long rod is the single best way to learn nymphing. I had learned by the time I was 12 that fishing with a bobber never worked as well as with a high stick and a tight line.
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Old 02-14-2010, 07:34 PM
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Default Re: Regarding Traditional Methods

Quote; (Rip Tide)

" I had learned by the time I was 12 that fishing with a bobber never worked as well as with a high stick and a tight line."

Rip has summed up the essence of nymph fishing with that last remark, (my opinion only)
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Old 02-14-2010, 07:36 PM
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Default Re: Regarding Traditional Methods

I am a Dry fly fisherman at heart,and when necessary I will ad on a dropper. Where I fish they tend to fluctuate the flow, sometimes causing the fish to go deeper,when this occurs I resort to using a much deeper dropper with a micro shot above the dropper to get it down. If you are getting fish to eat the dry indicator fly on top occasionally,why do some people not consider this to be dry dropper fishing? Whats does it matter if my dropper is short or long,besides being more productive?
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Old 02-14-2010, 07:57 PM
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Default Re: Regarding Traditional Methods

Hi Tailwalker,

I would consider you to be fishing a brace of flies, one dry one wet. Regardless of the length of your dropper, you still have a brace. That's fair
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Old 02-14-2010, 09:17 PM
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Default Re: Regarding Traditional Methods

Having suffered through 26 years of walking the high road with Ard back here in PA, I have to say that it ain't the catchin' it's the fishin' that matters. I say "high road" not to disparage those who choose to use other, and many times more effective, methods, but to relate the highroad as a personal standard. Set your personal highroad and stay true to it.
As we liked to say back in the day, "If all I want to do is put fish in the creel there are always quarter sticks, that'll bring 'em to hand tight quick".

The Chop
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Old 02-14-2010, 09:28 PM
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Default Re: Regarding Traditional Methods

Welcome to the Group Doc!!!

I have tried for two years to get this fella to come forward and here you are!

You need to do an intro because the guys here will be pleased to know ya!

Ard

---------- Post added at 06:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:24 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lambchop View Post
Having suffered through 26 years of walking the high road with Ard back here in PA, I have to say that it ain't the catchin' it's the fishin' that matters. I say "high road" not to disparage those who choose to use other, and many times more effective, methods, but to relate the highroad as a personal standard. Set your personal highroad and stay true to it.
As we liked to say back in the day, "If all I want to do is put fish in the creel there are always quarter sticks, that'll bring 'em to hand tight quick".

The Chop
I wanted to keep this out there, this is an old friend!
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Old 02-14-2010, 09:43 PM
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Default Re: Regarding Traditional Methods

It's an honor to meet you Mr Lambchop
I was big fan back in the day when I would watch you on Capt Kangaroo and the Shari Lewis Show
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Old 02-15-2010, 10:21 AM
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Default Re: Regarding Traditional Methods

Great post Ard...Here's my $0.02 worth on this subject; as long as the style of fishing the fly you choose is legal it's fine. There are things that aren't OK; adding any sort of scent to your fly is not flyfishing by my standards. Is it legal? My guess is probably in most places.

If a person chooses to fish with an indicator when nymphing, so what; it's his choice. It's no different then fishing a dry and dropper when you think of it. It's simply a device to control the depth of your trailing nymph. I guess I could put a hook in my indicator and call it a dry fly.

I'm not trying to say anyone is wrong, I'm simply saying to each his own; as long as it's not illegal.

Dan
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