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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2012, 10:50 AM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

.

Just a request, because I am new to tying many of these.

Could someone offer a comparison between the BiVisible, and Griffith's Gnat?

Thanks all.
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Old 12-02-2012, 11:35 AM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

I don't fish trout but I too, use a lot of old flies. Wooly Worms and the old Blonde series of streamers to name a couple. I also like McGinty Bees for BG. And yes some of mine are many, many years old. Darn bugs got most of em though. Keep'em coming!
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Old 12-02-2012, 01:12 PM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

Quote:
Originally Posted by ditz View Post
I don't fish trout but I too, use a lot of old flies. Wooly Worms and the old Blonde series of streamers to name a couple. I also like McGinty Bees for BG. And yes some of mine are many, many years old. Darn bugs got most of em though. Keep'em coming!
I don't tie the Bi visibile but just as the name implies, there are two colors of hackle used. Generally a brownish color and then white. I've seen them mostly tied half brown, half white. I've seen some wrapped only with hackle and some wrapped with peacock then hackled.

Griffith's gnats are peacock hurl hackled with grizzly when I tie them.

Nice post and very nice ties Ard. Something tells me tying those Quill Gordons for the swap had something to do with the nostalgia brought forth with your post on these flies.
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Old 12-02-2012, 02:46 PM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

Quote:
Originally Posted by noreaster View Post
Would putting down some super glue on the wing base help keep them in place better?
Hi Phil, & thanks to all the replies on these.

First; I always put a dab of regular lacquer cement to the wing bases and it does help. I will look through the dry flies for the other burnt wing patterns. I used to make them with the wings tied tilted back over the body (just like real may Flies) and only use one turn of hackle on the fly. These were supposed to look like a dead may fly laying flat on its side. They are kinda hard to see because they lay right in the surface film but they were good for back eddy fishing.

Everyone has stood there watching a big back eddy with the foam swirling on the surface and most have thought the same as I; that there just must be a nice fish hanging out in the slow currents there. Not all the time but maybe 35 - 40% of the time I found a fish and some were surprisingly nice ones and I thought up the dead fly tie after looking at all the debris floating in back eddy's. Not all the dead flies had the classic 'spent wing' look, many were on their side with both wings stuck together.

When I fished some streams and did not raise anything by gently dappling the swirling waters of the back eddy's (with the many currents you should get close as possible and try to have only leader on the water) I often switched to a feather wing streamer if I really had a hunch about the spot. On one creek in Colorado after having switched to a streamer (The Answer) I caught 3 really nice browns from the current edge of one back eddy. They were hanging right at the outside edge where the main current swept past.

All of this hearkens my thoughts to the many posts we have asking whether or not to tie your own flies. Once a fellow gets past all the hustle & bustle of fly fishing it often comes down to 'What can I figure out for myself'. Having the ability to create your own dead may fly or your own baby brown trout streamer like The Answer is priceless. You can slip away into your own little world and answer the challenges that you may encounter there with the tools and solutions that you developed for your own uses. Once you get there; gone are worries about who will catch more fish or will I get the biggest. There's just you, the stream and a faint almost obscure dimension known as time.

I guess I kinda rambled there............ Yeah, I would glue the wings Phil

And, if you read all of that and thought, 'what the heck is he talking about, The Answer'? The pictures below are of the streamer dry in the vise and another one wet.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

This is an old picture scanned into digital image, one of the many trout that ate that streamer

Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:04 PM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

Another great addition to your initial post Ard. That's one of the things I really have come to appreciate about tying my own flies. Outside of the obvious advantages to make tweaks or develop your own pattern, the comment you made about slipping into your own little world really resonates with me. When winter sets in and I am thinking of fishing in the spring with Chi, I sit down at the bench, and as I'm tying the flies, think about the streams I'll be fishing: those beautiful spring creeks I've come to love, the brown trout they hold, the gorgeous surroundings, and the companionship of having a fishing bud for many years. Whatever is going on in the world at that time is absolutely meaningless.

The other thing about your post that struck me is the difference of the Answer's appearance when dry, and then when wet. It's very difficult to look at that fly in either picture and determine which I like more. Another brilliant tie! I've enjoyed seeing your salmon flies but must admit that I have a sweet spot for the trout flies you've been posting lately. Thanks for that.

By the way, is that a CFO that I see in the picture with the brown?
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:33 PM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

Hi jason,

The streamer always looked sort of crude when they were being made. I had never seen a fly just like it but had borrowed the painted wing quills from Dr. Lew Oatman. Oatman was quite a tier of featherwings and he originated the 'Oatman's Brook Trout Minnow'. I'll bet I've tied 50 of them over the years and used them almost exclusively fishing Slate Run and The Hammersley Fork along with many other last bastions of the Native brook trouts in PA. The trout tore up the brook minnow so bad that I had to be sure to use real foil tinsel because the mylar stuff that began to appear around 1980 would be the first thing to go. The fly continued to work with the tinsel broken and the floss body trailing along in the current but sometimes if the fish were plentiful all those wild trout teeth would take even the most carefully constructed fly apart. Thats why my brown trout minnow had copper wire cross ribed on the body, to keep things together & help them to sink a little.

Yep, that's my old CFO III on a PM-10 #5 rod
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2012, 04:12 PM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyreels View Post
Hi Phil, & thanks to all the replies on these.

First; I always put a dab of regular lacquer cement to the wing bases and it does help. I will look through the dry flies for the other burnt wing patterns. I used to make them with the wings tied tilted back over the body (just like real may Flies) and only use one turn of hackle on the fly. These were supposed to look like a dead may fly laying flat on its side. They are kinda hard to see because they lay right in the surface film but they were good for back eddy fishing.

Everyone has stood there watching a big back eddy with the foam swirling on the surface and most have thought the same as I; that there just must be a nice fish hanging out in the slow currents there. Not all the time but maybe 35 - 40% of the time I found a fish and some were surprisingly nice ones and I thought up the dead fly tie after looking at all the debris floating in back eddy's. Not all the dead flies had the classic 'spent wing' look, many were on their side with both wings stuck together.

When I fished some streams and did not raise anything by gently dappling the swirling waters of the back eddy's (with the many currents you should get close as possible and try to have only leader on the water) I often switched to a feather wing streamer if I really had a hunch about the spot. On one creek in Colorado after having switched to a streamer (The Answer) I caught 3 really nice browns from the current edge of one back eddy. They were hanging right at the outside edge where the main current swept past.

All of this hearkens my thoughts to the many posts we have asking whether or not to tie your own flies. Once a fellow gets past all the hustle & bustle of fly fishing it often comes down to 'What can I figure out for myself'. Having the ability to create your own dead may fly or your own baby brown trout streamer like The Answer is priceless. You can slip away into your own little world and answer the challenges that you may encounter there with the tools and solutions that you developed for your own uses. Once you get there; gone are worries about who will catch more fish or will I get the biggest. There's just you, the stream and a faint almost obscure dimension known as time.

I guess I kinda rambled there............ Yeah, I would glue the wings Phil

And, if you read all of that and thought, 'what the heck is he talking about, The Answer'? The pictures below are of the streamer dry in the vise and another one wet.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

This is an old picture scanned into digital image, one of the many trout that ate that streamer

Click the image to open in full size.
That is awesome!!!
What a cool streamer fly that is.
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Old 12-05-2012, 12:31 PM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

As I've been sick for two days...I stayed at home...and had time to tie two vintage flies.I tried to tie them in the oldschool way I mean with some old indian capes.
the"Paysanne"(peasant) is a very simple fly made with two hackles (usually dun and brown)You turn them as far as the curve and make a knot...the two hackle tips are the tail...
Click the image to open in full size.
the French Tricolore...was created long ago by Henri Bresson (the Vesoul Wizzard) easy to tie with hackles of three different colors.It floats high,is visible,great on overgrown sections for it doesn't get stuck in trees and bushes as easily as other flies...and still catches fish
Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 12-05-2012, 12:58 PM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

Quote:
Originally Posted by brucerducer View Post
.

Just a request, because I am new to tying many of these.

Could someone offer a comparison between the BiVisible, and Griffith's Gnat?

Thanks all.
Bivisibles are big -- sizes 10, 12, 14 typically -- and are nothing but a body of densely wrapped palmer hackle and a tail. They are called "bivisible" because they use two colors -- a darker color for most of the body (most often brown, grizzly, ginger, blue dun, or badger) and then 3-5 turns of white at the eye for visibility on the water. Although invented as a generic attractor dry fly, they are often skated as a caddis imitation. They look much like the ones that jpbfly posted just above, but with a few turns of white near the eye. Ray Bergman was especially fond of Badger Bivisibles. He felt the darker stripe near the stem of a badger hackle gave a good impression of the bug's abdomen when wound palmer-style.

Griffith's Gnats, as the name suggests, are much smaller -- sizes 18, 20, 22 typically -- and have a body of peacock herl with a grizzly palmer hackle wound more sparsely through it as a rib. They are an impressionistic imitation of "smut" (tiny flies of various types), often midges or tricos or BWO's. A size 16 or 18 Griffith's Gnat can be a good imitation of a midge cluster, for example, and is easier to see on the water than a smaller, more realistic imitation of a single midge.
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Old 12-05-2012, 02:27 PM
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Default Re: Vintage Flies ;

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyreels View Post
Hi Phil, & thanks to all the replies on these.

First; I always put a dab of regular lacquer cement to the wing bases and it does help. I will look through the dry flies for the other burnt wing patterns. I used to make them with the wings tied tilted back over the body (just like real may Flies) and only use one turn of hackle on the fly. These were supposed to look like a dead may fly laying flat on its side. They are kinda hard to see because they lay right in the surface film but they were good for back eddy fishing.

Everyone has stood there watching a big back eddy with the foam swirling on the surface and most have thought the same as I; that there just must be a nice fish hanging out in the slow currents there. Not all the time but maybe 35 - 40% of the time I found a fish and some were surprisingly nice ones and I thought up the dead fly tie after looking at all the debris floating in back eddy's. Not all the dead flies had the classic 'spent wing' look, many were on their side with both wings stuck together.

When I fished some streams and did not raise anything by gently dappling the swirling waters of the back eddy's (with the many currents you should get close as possible and try to have only leader on the water) I often switched to a feather wing streamer if I really had a hunch about the spot. On one creek in Colorado after having switched to a streamer (The Answer) I caught 3 really nice browns from the current edge of one back eddy. They were hanging right at the outside edge where the main current swept past.

All of this hearkens my thoughts to the many posts we have asking whether or not to tie your own flies. Once a fellow gets past all the hustle & bustle of fly fishing it often comes down to 'What can I figure out for myself'. Having the ability to create your own dead may fly or your own baby brown trout streamer like The Answer is priceless. You can slip away into your own little world and answer the challenges that you may encounter there with the tools and solutions that you developed for your own uses. Once you get there; gone are worries about who will catch more fish or will I get the biggest. There's just you, the stream and a faint almost obscure dimension known as time.

I guess I kinda rambled there............ Yeah, I would glue the wings Phil

And, if you read all of that and thought, 'what the heck is he talking about, The Answer'? The pictures below are of the streamer dry in the vise and another one wet.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

This is an old picture scanned into digital image, one of the many trout that ate that streamer


Click the image to open in full size.

Speaking about "Vintage" do you still have the rod & reel Ard?
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