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Old 03-03-2011, 03:05 PM
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Default Tying Hooks

I finished the clubs beginner's class and I've been tying like crazy as time allows between work, taking my mother to doctors appointment's, etc. and loving it. I've been using Charlie Craven's website and really like the way he uses the same 4 strands of pheasant tall for the tail, abdomen, and legs on the pheasant tail nymph in my inexperienced opinion its easier and just makes the most sense.

Well in Charlie's recipe for the pheasant tail nymph he uses a TMC 100SP-BL or size #14-20 pheasant tail and smaller than that he just uses the standard TMC 100 which if I remember right is a standard length dry fly hook with that is 1X stout and is barbless. As I've mentioned, before I have a tendency to be frugal always looking for the best bang for my buck. Especially with this new addiction, because I'm spending money right and left. Matter of fact I just purchased some capes from Conranch and Collins and before that I bought 3 premium saddles from Hook and Hackle. I wish I'd heard of Conranch and Collins, before I bought those from H and H, though the H and H premiums are very nice.

What other hooks either TMC, Daiichi, etc. are there out there that are the same, but not barbless (I can straighten barbs myself)?

Also when looking at a wall of hooks I find it gets kind of overwhelming, How do you choose what is best for what? For instance how do you know if 1X stout is best for what you are tying?

Why is a TMC 100SP-BL better for pheasant tail nymphs than a TMC 100?

What hooks do you all use for your size 14-20 pheasant tail nymphs?

Do you all know if Allen & CO has anything that is equal or close enough to TMC 100SP-BL #14-20, but not necessarily barbless. The fact is I like to give Justin as much of my business as I can.

I'm going to need to buy nymph, dry fly, bugger, wet fly hooks again pretty soon, because I don't have enough different sizes in some hooks and others I just don't have and some I'm going run out of fairly soon.
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Last edited by FlyBum; 03-03-2011 at 06:44 PM.
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Old 03-03-2011, 05:34 PM
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Default Re: Tying Hooks

Tom: Sounds like you have the fly tying addiction bad and need to go into rehab!

I didn't know the answer to your TMC 100SP-BL questions so I looked it up on the TMC web site. Here is what they say about that hook, hope that will help. TIEMCO LTD.

I would send a PM to Justin at Allen Fly Fishing and ask him about his hooks.

Another option for getting a little discount on fly hooks is to look on EBay.

I like to use a TMC 3769 or 5262 hook.

Larry
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Old 03-03-2011, 06:38 PM
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Default Re: Tying Hooks

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnerney View Post
Tom: Sounds like you have the fly tying addiction bad and need to go into rehab!
My name is Tom and I am a FlyFishingandFlyTyingAholic. My story is quite sad as I started 20 or so years ago, but after one trout season I was able to quit without much trouble, but this time the bugs got me and I'm afraid after only a few weeks of fly tying I'm hooked for life.
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Old 03-03-2011, 07:11 PM
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Default Re: Tying Hooks

Hi Tom,

I can't offer to solve your dilemma but decided to write a half page of drivel anyway. You may be taking this hook thing too seriously (my opinion) and it sounds like you are actually confused. You gotta remember that I am sort of an old school type with tying flies and I did grow up in Pennsylvania fishing & tying all sort of flies. Back in the 'good old days' the tying index's I used always had recommendations for the hook along with the pattern. Of course there was almost always only one brand referred to and that was Mustad hooks.

Today there are hooks for sale that I in all likelihood have never even heard of and I can see how this could muddy the waters when looking for a good hook. It took until about 1996 for me to need more hooks because I had purchased them by the box for so long in the past. When I started seeing the Tiemco dry fly hooks I liked them because they seemed to have a longer shank than the old Mustad's and so I could tie what amounted to a size 14 dry on a size 16 hook and so on. For me this was desirable and the hooks are sharp. I have some Daiichi that I bought for specialty ties and still have a pile of Mustad and Partridge irons in standard single salmon.

It all comes down to what you are tying, I would take a look through the 'Share Patterns' threads here and when I found things I liked the look of I would use what the tier had used. If the recipe is not posted send the poster a PM and find out what brand the hook is. As far as stressing over the cost of nymph and dry fly hooks if you just buy packs of 25 they are pretty painless when compared to filling up the pickup truck these days right? When you find the brands you like for certain patterns that is when you spring for a pack of 100 or 50 depending on needs.

Look at the bright side, I tie a lot of flies on Partridge Salmon hooks and when I had used up all of the old stock I found out that they are now selling for $14 for a pack of 25. Single Salmon from Daiichi or Tiemco are $8.95 for a 10 pack All in all there are more expensive things to get involved in and it is good that you are frugal. The frugality will enable you to afford to fill up the ride for a trip to the river

Ard
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Old 03-03-2011, 08:07 PM
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Default Re: Tying Hooks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyreels View Post
I can't offer to solve your dilemma but decided to write a half page of drivel anyway.
Howdy Ard:

Coming in here to solve my addiction issues is like a drug addict asking his pusher for for help to quit. LOL

Ya I could be a little confused, but I at least have been looking at the recipes and buying the hooks the that the recipe calls for the most part. However some flies I'm now tying I've fished and therefore purchased for years, so I know what sizes hooks I need and have a pretty good idea how many I want to tie, for instance I'm tying a truck load of pheasant tail nymphs, because I fish those on nearly every trip. However, I fish those in sizes 14-20, but only have size 14-16 in the TMC 100 hooks I've been tying them on. After looking on Tiemco's website I think I'm going to start tying them on the TMC 3769 equivalent hooks that Justin sells, because his prices are unbeatable and the length is nearly the same as the hooks Charlie Craven's recipe calls for, but instead of only being 1X its 2x heavy.

By the way I want to thank Larry for sharing that he uses the TMC 3769.
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Old 03-04-2011, 01:03 AM
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Default Re: Tying Hooks

Charlie Craven's site, and his book patterns are good recipes to follow. I'm more like Ard and will deviate from the precise hook in a pattern. My mentor, who has tied for 60+ years, still follows every recipe to a "T" including the exact hook (or equivelant in a different brand).
If you wanted to stock a minmum amount of hooks that would tie the most flies here's my list:
TMC100 12-14-16-18 dry's
TMC3761 12-14-16-18 nymph's 1XL hook
TMC2457 12-14-16-18 curved scud hooks

With the 1XL nymph hook you can tie bead heads; almost any nymph that calls for standard length; even streamers look OK.
Your question about what hook I use to tie PTN's= TMC3761. I tie mostly bead head PTN's.
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Old 03-04-2011, 11:41 AM
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Default Re: Tying Hooks

if it's for a wet/nymph and you're rolling it on the bottom, there's no drawback to using a 2xh rather than a 1xh that I can think of.

For one thing, the 2xh will be of a stouter wire, which is beneficial in hook setting and is a REAL benefit if you hook into a heavier fish.

As others have said, there is no exact prescription to follow here. If you see a hook mentioned for a pattern and you don't have it, find out the characteristics of the hook, see what you have that's similar and/or in the same 'range'... and use it.

I tie a great majority of my dry flies on a TMC 102Y these days, primarily because I LIKE THE HOOK- it has a wider gape, comes in 'odd sizes', which allows you to tie your fly a half-size smaller than the hook and provides you a half-size more of hook setting ability.

For smaller sizes, I prefer the Daiichi 1220/1222 "Darrel Martin" hook- the shape of the shank, slight offest bend and again, the wider gape make this hook ideal for me.

I also use the TMC200R for all my Stimulators, Hoppers, and wait for it... Trudes. I like the look it gives the patterns and yep, it's a given, the WIDER GAPE.

These are personal prefernces and I'm willing to bet everyone here has them about the hooks and materials they use. One of the COOLEST things about fly tying (and I've been doing it for 46 years now) is the rules are flexible, you can make em up as you go along... ands when you sit with and watch other tyers, it's amazing how many times you'll say things like:

"Hey- what was that you just did there?"
"Huh! I never thought of doing that like that!"
"Wow- where'd you find THAT stuff?"

=)
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Old 03-04-2011, 12:04 PM
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Default Re: Tying Hooks

"Also when looking at a wall of hooks I find it gets kind of overwhelming, How do you choose what is best for what? For instance how do you know if 1X stout is best for what you are tying?"

Hi Tom,

You are right that it is overwhelming with how many hooks are out there. When it gets really confusing is how to order a bulk order of hooks to have a good supply. Then you have to consider the length, weight and size of a bunch of hooks that you are not sure what you may use in the future. We have had nothing but good reports with the hooks that Justin is selling. I like Tiemco hooks but it seems that there are a bunch of hooks out there that work as well and are way cheaper.

A few guidelines I use when buying hooks for a particular fly. I first determine how I want to fish the fly. A fast sinker with no weight or split shot I want a really heavy hook. I always use an extra heavy hook for egg patterns. On other fast sinkers I might want to weight the fly so I won't use as heavy of a hook. A dry fly that I want to float high in the water I want the lightest hook possible. If I want a dry fly to sit a little lower in the water I might use a slightly heavier dry fly hook.

So what I am saying is that the fly you tie and how you are going to fish it, may determine your hook selection. I don't know how I would buy a zillion hooks at one time and not end up with hooks you may never use.

Frank
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Old 03-13-2011, 08:33 PM
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Default Re: Tying Hooks

My favorite hooks are Daiichi, Gamakatsu, or some Mustads. I also like Dai-Riki for small hooks. I like Allen hooks so far. I need to order some streamer hooks from him in the future. I prefer my hooks sharp out of the box if at all possible. I hate whittling on dull hooks. A lot of the old Mustads and stuff I have are good hooks, just not sharp. I have a friend who likes Togen hooks. But I have not tried them.
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