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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 10-10-2013, 07:31 AM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

Random, that style (and other similar) is what I am asking if I can simplify for now. That is just too much going on for me on a small hook until I get better.

fq13, that post made me laugh. Not sure I will get time for hunting this year but have friends who are going to give me a few feathers. I have plenty of pheasant and peacock to get started. If I do hunt, your next comment will likely be "That's not a partridge udummy, you shot a crow and a pelican"

I'll keep at it. Tying everyday is helping.
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Old 10-10-2013, 08:29 AM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

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Originally Posted by ia_trouter View Post
Savin a fortune. My new Renzetti vise arrived yesterday. I should save more money a lot faster on the new vise. I took my daughter flyfishing for the first time Sunday. If I take her more often perhaps I will save money. That girl can flat catch walnut trees.
Man, if I knew about fly fishing during the period my daughter thought it was cool to be with dad, I could have saved thousands!! All she ever needed to do was stick a hook in the water and BAM! a bluegill. Then BAM! a bass. Then BAM! BAM! BAM!

This was all using a worm. No way would she put one of those on but I didn't mind doing it. There were days when i couldn't even attempt to fish as she kept pulling them in too fast. I was in awe so often when we went fishing. I am sure she would have been even better at fly fishing.

I know this is a little off topic but go with her as much as you can. Heck, give her the big ones--she might surprise you and catch fish on them!!
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Old 10-10-2013, 08:35 AM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

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Originally Posted by ia_trouter View Post
Random, that style (and other similar) is what I am asking if I can simplify for now. That is just too much going on for me on a small hook until I get better.
Wont hurt to try a few. Worst case is you fish them and decide to give 'em the razor later.

Hit the key points of the fly. With PTN's just do the tail, body and thorax. (Without the copper wire rib in the body, the life expectancy of the fly greatly diminishes). CJ's just do the bead, tail, body and thorax. After you Get CJ's down, then worry about bead head PTN's.

I've fished a lot on nymphs that I have forgotten to tie something into or inadvertently cut something off of just generally botched. Sometimes it matters, sometimes it doesn't and sometimes I think the refusals were more about my bad presentation.

One thing I learned about fishing flies I botched is that it makes me really work on my presentations.
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:14 AM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

Random, I have added the wire in, just skipping the wing cases for now, as I end up with a mess. I need to fish these. Catching fish seems to validate the process and inspires to continue improving on a particular pattern.

busbus-I agree and fish with my daughter as often as I can. Memories with my father have lasted me a lifetime so I'm not missing the opportunity. Flyfishing with her is tough though. She is 17 so she isn't too receptive of advice from Dad. Smartest thing I did was take Craigthor (new forum member) along this week. He is very patient, or perhaps she picked up on the fact that he knows WTH he is talking about.
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:26 AM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

ia trouter,

In one of the old books I read, forget which one, there were a lot of references to tying "nymphs-in-the-round".

Basically it came down to weighted nymphs in faster water with the nymph tied so it look as though you were seeing it from the bottom no mater which side you looked from: - tail+body+thorax = nymph-in-the-round.

In a lot of ways, they are half way to a soft hackle. They were tied like this under the assumption that nymph tumbling through faster water would not be upright most of the time and the trick was to tie in the key elements of the fly of the trout would key in on it.

This was one of the stepping stones that turned me in to a predominantly soft hackle fisher.

So, no wing case + no legs/gills = no big deal for the most part.
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Old 10-10-2013, 10:45 AM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

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Originally Posted by ia_trouter View Post
busbus-I agree and fish with my daughter as often as I can. Memories with my father have lasted me a lifetime so I'm not missing the opportunity. Flyfishing with her is tough though. She is 17 so she isn't too receptive of advice from Dad. Smartest thing I did was take Craigthor (new forum member) along this week. He is very patient, or perhaps she picked up on the fact that he knows WTH he is talking about.
My daughter was around 16 when she decided it wasn't "cool" to fish with dad any more. Be glad you got a couple more years out of her.

On the other hand, my son was devastated whenever he was pretty young because he killed a really small fish--I think the hook hanging out of its eye had an affect on him! (But he does have Asperger's Syndrome, so this was not unusual.) Just this past summer, whenever he was home for the summer from college, he went fishing with me three or four times. I even got him to swing a fly rod. He is fairly uncoordinated but he figured out how to cast quickly. Heck, he casts better with a fly rod then with a spinning rod. He caught twice as many fish in those three or four days than he caught his whole life prior to that.

So maybe they come back around. Keep plugging!

As far as them taking advice, well, you are on your own. I have also found that I can say something to either of them 1,000 times and they will ignore me. Somebody else says it and a light comes on . Go figure.
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Old 10-10-2013, 02:42 PM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

I guess it depends on your water and the population of fish there, but in my home streams I don't have to be very exact. One of my go-to flies here is a brown hackle fiber tail, peacock herl body, a wrap of wire or flash to help with durability, and then a short, in-the-round, collar of the webby, marabou-ish fibers from the base of a hackle feather. I tie them in facing forward, in four bunches (top, bottom, and each side), then flop them back and tie over them.

Super simple, super easy. I do them in 12's and 14's with a wire underwrap mostly, and the trout seem to like them just fine. If you put in a little tuft of white fiber on the top and tie it with red thread, you've got a Prince analog that's easier than the real thing.
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Old 10-10-2013, 06:32 PM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

Why not just learn to tie a pheasant tail nymph properly?

The techniques you will learn will help you with future patterns you will want to tie

Tie it in steps. If it's not looking right, undo it and tie it over until you get it right

Just a thought
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Old 10-10-2013, 07:16 PM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

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Why not just learn to tie a pheasant tail nymph properly?

The techniques you will learn will help you with future patterns you will want to tie

Tie it in steps. If it's not looking right, undo it and tie it over until you get it right

Just a thought
After a few dozen failed attempts at a "proper" PT Nymph I launched this thread. I may be less talented than average but I am giving it my best shot to tie flies that might catch fish, even if I can't tie the top shelf version just yet.

Last edited by ia_trouter; 10-10-2013 at 08:22 PM.
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Old 10-10-2013, 08:11 PM
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Default Re: Tying Nymphs, how fancy do they really need to be?

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Originally Posted by ia_trouter View Post
After a few dozen failed attempts at a "proper" PT Nymph I launched this thread. I may be less talented than average but I am giving it my best shot to tie flies that might catch fish, even I can't tie the top shelf version just yet.
The object is to catch fish, not reproduce a classic pattern. Yes, tying those might help your tying technique. But use them as a guide as to what sorts of things work, not must haves. Think of it like cooking. You don't want to see recipes from classic French or Italian cooking as things you have to reproduce exactly. You instead look at them for ideas as to what types of flavor combinations work, and what cooking techniques are best suited to each. Then you go to the store, buy what looks fresh and have at it, combining ingredients that make sense to you and taste good. That's the point.
Nothing wrong with the classics, they're classics for a reason, but they weren't when some guy first tied them. Think "Ok, I need to imitate a small green and white minnow, or a caddis nymph, what do I have that will do that? And then go from there. At least that's how I look at it. YMMV.
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