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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 05-09-2013, 04:58 PM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

Quote:
Originally Posted by littledavid123 View Post
I don't know, but it appears he is making a good living off the anguish of the locals. Will be glad when the bottom dwellers who feed off these hyped up events finally have their fill! Only then will the government make the decision that should have been made a long time ago. Seriously does anybody really think Pebble Mine will get approval???

Dave
Are you inferring that the one man SAA is perpetrating a myth about the Pebble Mine? Wow, that would be some sort of scam! And to call him a "bottom dweller" that is feeding off "hyped up events" seems a bit harsh. How about that list of thousands of organizations, are they all bottom feeders as well? If the group behind Pebble Mine was so certain of an inevitable outcome why haven't they gone away? I don't see how the government is to blame here. Sure I wish "they" would make a ruling as well, but that would be without any solid evidence and just another step toward US communism.
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Old 05-09-2013, 06:27 PM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

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Originally Posted by dean_mt View Post
Are you inferring that the one man SAA is perpetrating a myth about the Pebble Mine? Wow, that would be some sort of scam! And to call him a "bottom dweller" that is feeding off "hyped up events" seems a bit harsh. How about that list of thousands of organizations, are they all bottom feeders as well? If the group behind Pebble Mine was so certain of an inevitable outcome why haven't they gone away? I don't see how the government is to blame here. Sure I wish "they" would make a ruling as well, but that would be without any solid evidence and just another step toward US communism.
Perpetrating a myth...no, feeding off the fear of others...yes. If the governemnt is going to base their decision on "solid evidence" what practical purpose do these donation based groups serve. Looking at the last ACF 900 filings (year 2010) they had a $5.9 million stock portfolio. I would like to see the dollar figure this group actually spent on solid independent technical data in support of Bristol Bay and what their stock portfolio is worth today.

Dave
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Old 05-09-2013, 06:37 PM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

Quote:
Originally Posted by littledavid123 View Post
I don't know, but it appears he is making a good living off the anguish of the locals. Will be glad when the bottom dwellers who feed off these hyped up events finally have their fill! Only then will the government make the decision that should have been made a long time ago. Seriously does anybody really think Pebble Mine will get approval???

Dave

I think there is still an even chance that this mine could happen, especially if all of us that don't support it become complacent and start entertaining the thought that it won't. And lately it seems there are many more coming aboard and letting their voices be heard.

Now, to call the front man of this organization that does a huge amount of footwork and spends a great deal of his time working to keep others informed of the latest on Pebble Mine a "Bottom dweller", and calling the potential disaster in the making, a "Hyped up event", is a bit short sighted and uncalled for in my humble opinion.
I guess your point is that he must be profiting from this "hyped up event"? Even if he has profited for some of his work from the donations, I have no issue with it because a man's gotta eat. To make a little coin for doing something you believe in....shouldn't we all be so lucky.

Before insinuating that the man could be up to no good, it's a good idea to find some proof, then I'll listen.

I'm glad he's on the ground to keep the information coming, because the chances of this "hyped up event" becoming a huge disaster are fairly high and history will bear witness to this. Take a look back and see the destruction/mess left behind even when there are no major catastrophic events.
https://www.google.com/search?q=pics...w=1920&bih=919

Mountaintop Removal Coal Mining: Damage Since 1984 [Satellite Photos]

And Heaven forbid....a link from TIME.
A New Study Shows How Mountaintop Removal Mining Can Badly Damage Nearby Streams | TIME.com

The Bristol Bay area is far too pristine and beautiful to risk taking a chance on, even if the mine was a success, the wilderness area and watershed would be visually scarred forever. Lord knows the mining company's aren't going to restore the area, once they have what they want, they're gone and past history proves this once again.

As far as I'm concerned Northern Dynasty Minerals(a Canadian based company) & Anglo American (a London based company) can go pound sand!


It continues to amaze me that many of those who hunt, fish, camp, and otherwise take advantage of natures finest offerings are willing to take such chances.
Yes, I know the old worn out argument that there are many things that are derived from mining or drilling that are used to make our daily lives more convenient, or used in the manufacturing of our fly rods and fly lines, even our waders, yada, yada, yada......but what the hell good are these things if we don't have
clean water and air, or places to use these things.

Hopefully time will improve the techniques and methods used to harvest the needed materials and that potential disaster and destruction will no longer be a concern.

There is a time & place for most everything, but now is not the time, and Bristol Bay is not the place for this mine.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 05-09-2013, 09:55 PM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

Quote:
Originally Posted by littledavid123 View Post
Perpetrating a myth...no, feeding off the fear of others...yes. If the governemnt is going to base their decision on "solid evidence" what practical purpose do these donation based groups serve. Looking at the last ACF 900 filings (year 2010) they had a $5.9 million stock portfolio. I would like to see the dollar figure this group actually spent on solid independent technical data in support of Bristol Bay and what their stock portfolio is worth today.

Dave
Dave, a group like this is feeding of the fear of a reality. history tells the story of the mining industry's role, and those of us that oppose this mine - and many others - fear history repeating itself, as it has over and over. I have known a lot of these one man crusaders, my hometown is filthy with them. And I'll tell you none of them are getting rich!

Closer to my home and even closer to your future home there are gold deposits, in the upper Blackfoot drainage, a magnificent and fabled river. There was a constant fear of that mine being developed, a giant cyanide heap leach mine on the banks of the headwaters. It was a very real threat years ago then gold prices bottomed out. Then when they went back up 15 years ago and another group proposed to mine it again. It took the will of activists to get an initiative on the ballot in Montana to ban cyanide heap leach mining in the state. And then the great people of Montana voted in favor of banning that process of pulling gold from the Earth. The slogan was "The Blackfoot River is more precious than gold" and I still stand by that. The activist that put work in didn't make money and they didn't want to but they won a huge battle in state built on mining. A small victory in the grand scale of things but everyone from the ranchers in the valley to outfitters and elk hunters and fishing guides to me have benefited. To hell with gold rings! The Blackfoot River and its bull trout and cutthroats, elk and cows, they are all more precious than gold.

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Old 05-10-2013, 12:15 AM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

Whether you believe that Pebble Mine will destroy wilderness, fish, and jobs or you don't think enough study has been done to know the impact, the result should be the same: stop the mine. If necessary study has in fact not been done then giving it the go ahead would be irresponsible.
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Old 05-10-2013, 02:55 AM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

The discussion here is not controversial at all. The thread was posted by our forum owners for the benefit of those members who might agree with the thinking that The Pebble Project is a bad idea.

If there are a room full of like minded people and someone walks in and flatly disagrees with the group; where is the controversy?

I don't particularly care for Hip Hop music. What I don't do is to go looking for a group of kids listening to it and tell them how bad it is. That could cause controversy, I drive by and listen to my own music.

In other words, if you think this thread is BS. then do not post on it. Let the misguided souls banter among themselves please. I don't intend to close the thread and I am not planning on blowing my stack over this topic.
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Old 05-10-2013, 09:07 PM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

Quote:
Originally Posted by littledavid123 View Post

Seriously does anybody really think Pebble Mine will get approval???

Dave
Yes. Not now, not tomorrow, maybe not in this decade (first feed was always targeted around 2018)... but it will go ahead. They always do (eventually).

All this hype over the past 5 years or so is just meant to wear you (us) down... drain the good people of their hard-earned cash and burn us out on fighting.

Blue chip stocks rule the world unfortunately. Best thing that can happen is the gold market crashes (along with silver, copper, molybdenum, lead/zinc, etc.), then the feasibility study flips upside down and Pebble goes back in the file cabinet. Of course this would mean that the global economy is in utter chaos... can't have it all I guess.
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Old 05-10-2013, 10:49 PM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

Joe, still don't think it will happen if their is truly a chance of destroying the ecosystem. We havn't permitted a new oil refinery in 30 years nor a nuclear faciliity, not to keen on the nuclear but a few oil refineries would help lower costs. Hard to know what the truth is when we are surrounded by so much emotion, so as Dan said I will patiently wait for the official EPA report.

I don't say this to be provocative, but who is draining us of our cash?

Dave
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Old 05-10-2013, 11:34 PM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

Wow! Hoping for the collapse of the world economy as a good thing. The only places I have heard that as a good thing are CPUSA, Socialist International, Carol Browners almamater, and well all of the socialist/communist outfits. Who cares if it causes starvation, misery, civil wars, death and destruction and the risk of all out thermonuclear war, as long as we stop that damn mine.
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Old 05-10-2013, 11:38 PM
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Default Re: Alaskans to D.C.: Stop Pebble Mine From Destroying 14,000 American Jobs

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Originally Posted by littledavid123 View Post

I don't say this to be provocative, but who is draining us of our cash?

Dave
Those that would be fighting on your (our) behalf.

Don't get me wrong, they mean well and honestly fight the good fight. The problem (as always) when "fighting the man" is that those doing the fighting rely heavily on charitable donations and asking people to give 'til it hurts. Meanwhile, the opposition just waits and watches while precious ($$$) resources are spent trying to stop something that they really have no need to develop for many years down the road. A project the size of Pebble takes about twenty years to fully develop from test drilling to first feed. The good citizens are contributing to the cause (now) and marching and protesting, and at the same time the mine developers are years away from doing anything on their own behalf... in fact they may not have any real plans to develop the property themselves. It's just as likely that they would sell it off for others to develop.

Food for thought; 14,000 local jobs rely on that Bristol Bay fishery... and that's a pretty impressive number that generates much fanfare. Conversely a large chunk of the global economy and 100% of civilized society's life style (worldwide) rely on mining.

The funny part is, the power to stop Pebble Mine (or any mine) is well within the power of the people, and they wouldn't have to do much at all. Just cut off the demand, and those that are currently willing to spend and lend $4 billion to make the supply would be forced to fold up the tents. So the question is, how many of us are willing to give up all of our possessions that rely on the extraction of precious and/or base metals?

Just take a look around from exactly where you're sitting right now... how many things in your sight were "grown" and how many were mined?

Shame on all of us for our insatiable dependency on material possessions. We have only ourselves to blame for Pebble.
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