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Rip Tide 08-28-2013 08:30 AM

Warranty system
 
An interesting editorial on how rod warranties are hurting the industry.

Opinion Editorial: Rod Warranties…

fredaevans 08-28-2013 08:45 AM

Re: Warranty system
 
I'll be the first to 'step up and Agree to Disagree.' Do some go WELL beyond 'what's reasonable?' LL Bean comes to mind/Non-fishing would be REI. Most rod manufacturers charge you for a repair unless the rod had a real 'blank failure.' (Damned infrequent)

No idea from rod to rod but I've seen as low as fifty bucks to as high as one hundred fifty (plus postage). That aside, the cost of potential rod repairs is factored into the retail price ... there is no free lunch.:shades:

mridenour 08-28-2013 08:59 AM

Re: Warranty system
 
What rod companies honor the warranty on a second-hand purchased rod?

I have never seen anyone break their rod on purpose...except to make it fit into the garbage can. I'm sure there are people that do. Just like there are people that abuse any good thing.

Without a warranty, a manufacturer isn't held accountable for the quality of the product they produce. If a bad one slips through to the consumer, no big deal. Blame the consumer and make him eat it. There is a breaking point where they can no longer get away with that behavior but I don't trust manufacturers to just be trusted to do the right thing any more than I do the consumer. If you charge people for the best and want lots of money for it, prove it. Stand behind your product.


I don't believe warranties drive the cost of rods up, I think the high price charged for rods necessitates warranties. Of course, maybe I am just an idiot and don't know what I am talking about. :confused:

Rip Tide 08-28-2013 09:10 AM

Re: Warranty system
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mridenour (Post 586203)
.

Without a warranty, a manufacturer isn't held accountable for the quality of the product they produce. If a bad one slips through to the consumer, no big deal. Blame the consumer and make him eat it. There is a breaking point where they can no longer get away with that behavior but I don't trust manufacturers to just be trusted to do the right thing any more than I do the consumer. If you charge people for the best and want lots of money for it, prove it. Stand behind your product.


I don't believe warranties drive the cost of rods up, I think the high price charged for rods necessitates warranties. Of course, maybe I am just an idiot and don't know what I am talking about. :confused:

When you buy a fly rod, you're actually paying extra to cover the percentage of rods that will need to be replaced by warranties.
They can't do it any other way. Like Fred says... there's no free lunch

I've broken rods 3 different times on the first day of use and had to have them replaced.
A manufacturer covering a defective product is a whole lot different than a life time warranty.

fredaevans 08-28-2013 09:14 AM

Re: Warranty system
 
Mike, a second buyer (skip this "I didn't send in the War-card" **** when you purchase a 'used rod') will repair a rod, if possible.

In the 'Real World' I strongly suspect all of these get tossed into "The Round File." What would be the point of having Staff to enter all that extraneous information into your data base?

Exceptions? So yes, but most of these would be 'low volume' custom/semi-custom rod builders. Boo's, Winston, Meizer, etc., as most of these rods were 'one offs' even if it was a standard build from their rod line-up.

jaybo41 08-28-2013 10:27 AM

Re: Warranty system
 
I read that as well and also disagree with much of it. This article in my opinion is the other end of the extreme. I believe that if there were changes that needed to be made, the solution is somewhere in-between. I'm not a shop owner or employee but a consumer, so I may not be as qualified to offer an opinion on that end.

I certainly understand that fly shops are struggling and certainly believe in supporting them. I don't believe that doing away with Lifetime Warranty with repair/replace option is a way around the 2nd hand markets, or custom rod builders, or small batch builders for that matter. If I'm buying a new flagship model, I want to know that I can keep it around for a while, have the option to have it repaired or replaced and don't mind paying a premium for it. If a flagship model has a lesser warranty, in my mind, there isn't much difference in that than an imported rod other than the Made in USA price tag and a few more $$'s. Note that I prefer to buy US or UK made tackle but don't have issues with quality gear of any origin or those that prefer it.

Orvis is as close to a tiered structure as I can think of. Loomis offers replacement/repair for the lifetime of the rod. Sage & Winston are Lifetime to the original owner of the rod. You can get repair work done if you're not the original owner, but it will cost you. What's the problem with that? Warranty service is different for a reason. Some companies that have the means to do so offer repair--but that comes with a cost. Others who feel it's easier to replace the rod, get you fishing and give an angler a new rod is cheaper in the long haul and better for business. There are advantages of each depending on prerogative. In both situations, there will be folks that as fred mentioned--toss the warranty in the round file and do not act on it. The manufacturers are hedging their bets that some consumers will do this.

Defective rods are an entirely different issue, I'd expect resolution of some sort with any company.

Perhaps one thing a shop could offer is a replacement/repair service done IN SHOP or sent to a repair center. Much like Best Buy does with their electronics, warranty is good for X number of years. You have the option of buying an extended warranty from manufacturer or the option to take the product to Best Buy to have repaired/replaced.

I'd have to believe there's a limited market for a fly rod that you can expect 1-3 years of service from and then toss out when it breaks. If everything was "disposable" at least for me, it would devalue anything other than the lower end offerings from these premium manufacturers. At that point, I'd look at building my own rods or buying more imports.

Rip Tide 08-28-2013 10:42 AM

Re: Warranty system
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jaybo41 (Post 586240)
Perhaps one thing a shop could offer is a replacement/repair service done IN SHOP or sent to a repair center. Much like Best Buy does with their electronics, warranty is good for X number of years. You have the option of buying an extended warranty from manufacturer or the option to take the product to Best Buy to have repaired/replaced.

Some companies already do that.
I remember my buddy telling me how easy it was to become an "authorized" GLoomis repairman. (just say yes :shades:)
He repairs dozens of rods a month that are brought into the shop where he works P/T

cochise 08-28-2013 10:59 AM

Re: Warranty system
 
It really isn't a warranty anymore. Its a you get to pay 50$ (sage) plus your time and shipping to have it repaired. Arguably about 70$ worth.

Was the graphite spun correctly, did you hit your tip section with a cone-head on a brisk forward cast only to have it break on the next hook-up.

Did the dog step on it and create a small fracture that when casted did not react but when a hook is set the rod folds?

Too many darn---Hmmms. The rod companies needed to do something so they Jacked their prices, made this warranty smoke screen and then cover their costs and then some by replacing at a fairly hefty price based on what it truly costs to manufacture said rod.

I remember back in the day...you broke your rod...you were done. We were SO MUCH MORE CAREFUL with our equipment. The one bad thing the warranty has done is made people more careless at taking truly good care of their toys.

I have used Sages warranty so many times I can't count. Its a nice service and Sadly I know guys who break their butt section on purpose after breaking their tip so they can get the whole rod replaced. These behaviors hurt the industry.

Unless you are loaded who wants to throw down 700 bones on a rod and shut in the car door and have Nothing left for your troubles.

The expense is out of hand, rods are ridiculously priced for what you get and I see it only getting worse.

I think more than anything I got caught up in having the nicest, best, most expensive rods...I play a lot of tennis and like with fly fishing I have decided to use lesser cost equipment...It hasn't hindered my abilities, it has maybe made me a better caster and tennis player.

Folks with a lot of coin it really doesn't matter. Folks on a tight budget it really matters. Disconnect.

Shoot, I was fishing the other day with a hopper and a leader and my arm. I only got a bullfrog but it worked.

mridenour 08-28-2013 11:07 AM

Re: Warranty system
 
Yeah, I really don't know first-hand about these high-dollar rods. I fish with a TFO BVK and a Lamson Guru and am happy to have them. I would rather pay for gas to get me to a fishing location than to buy a lot of equipment and not be able to afford to leave the house.

At the same time I hear people say that expensive rods aren't worth the money and others say they are worth every penny. It can get pretty confusing for a guy. I think I just have to focus on spending my money wisely and getting good at using what I have and can afford, warranty or not.

Rod-envy is an evil thing!

nir 08-28-2013 01:10 PM

Re: Warranty system
 
I read this article thinking about how our society produces cheap electronics and gadget trends that encourage people to either change when broken (appliances come to mind) or replace even if in good condition because something new better comes out every 6 months (cell phones, iPads). Consume consume consume! (this article comes to mind : Friday Rant: Why Has the Longevity and Quality of Household Appliances Gone Down the Tube? : Enterprise Irregulars)

I think this is a load of **** that only produces waste on an unmanageable scale!

It's actually refreshing that the fly fishing industry produces quality products and companies stand behind them for the lifetime that they should work. The fee that companies charge for repairs is most of the time very reasonnable if not too low.

This article seemed more like a retailer angry because if it were just him, we would be buying a new rod every two years and he would make more money.

Thats just my opinion though! hehe


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