Commercial fishing .... 1 in 5 get tossed back to die.

[fredaevans]

Nine Fisheries Responsible for Marine Life Waste

 

[GrtLksMarlin]

Actually, the number is much, much higher. The IGFA routinely posts bycatch data due to various fishing methods, I'll try and look up some of it to post or link to here.

B.E.F.

EDIT:
as an example, this tidbit about banning surface long-lines in the gulf of Mexico:
Data from NOAA’s southeast Fisheries Science Center shows that from 2007 to 2009, 51% of the Gulf surface longline catch was discarded, and 65% of those discards were thrown back dead. This fishing gear also injures and kills approximately 80 types of marine wildlife including imperiled billfish species like blue and white marlin as well as bluefin tuna.

S.Africa:
When NOAA compared bycatch data from before (1997-1999) and after the closure (2001-2003), it revealed that implementing area closures produced significant reductions in bycatch killing. Sailfish had a reduction in bycatch mortality of -77,6%, pelagic sharks -55,9%, blue marlin -50,3%, white marlin -47,5%, dolphin -47,2%, juvenile swordfish -39,5%, large coastal sharks -27,9% and sea turtles -27,9%.

These findings are especially relevant, says the IGFA, when considering that by far the single biggest source of mortality for marlin is bycatch from commercial longlines. For example, in 2004, US longliners killed 34 metric tons of blue marlin and 27 metric tons of white marlin. In contrast, that same year, US recreational anglers landed only 115 blue marlin and 31 white marlin.


The NOAA bycatch report for 2011 (this is very detailed and extremely confusing): http://www.nmfs.noaa.gov/by_catch/bycatch_nationalreport.htm


I'll look through some of my old newsletters in that the by catch numbers are much easier to understand (ex. (made up) For every 1,200 tons of Mackerel Caught, 2,800 tons of Salmon bycatch was discarded killed).

What you have to understand is, long-lines, gill-nets and so on capture all sorts of species and due to the strain on the fish tend to kill them and make them vulnerable to predation while on the line and after....If they are there to just say catch Swordfish, and 80% of the catch (not unreasonable) are other species like Tuna, Marlin, Salmon, Shark, etc., they are considered bycatch and brutally unhooked (many swallowing the bait) and tossed over the side, often after laying on the deck for some time.....Because, they are there to catch Swordfish.

B.E.F.

 

[itchmesir]

Maybe the whole c&r while shopping for your fish at the market is not the best plan... Whether it's farm raised fish or commercially netted you're supporting both industries as a whole... Maybe keep a couple trout and eat them instead of going to the store for your salmon... Brookies have the same omegas as salmon. Plus you're supporting your Dnr with the purchase of a trout stamp... Which will help put back into the environment... Not some big wig corporation... Learn to know where your food is coming from other than isle 12.

“You can’t waste your life making money, and then go back and try to buy your life back.”

 

[Flywgn]

Maybe the whole c&r while shopping for your fish at the market is not the best plan... Whether it's farm raised fish or commercially netted you're supporting both industries as a whole... Maybe keep a couple trout and eat them instead of going to the store for your salmon... Brookies have the same omegas as salmon. Plus you're supporting your Dnr with the purchase of a trout stamp... Which will help put back into the environment... Not some big wig corporation... Learn to know where your food is coming from other than isle 12.

Interesting.

We have a tail water fishery not far from us on the Big Wood River and the trout from there are delicious, with salmon-colored flesh. Recently, we had some friends who had flown out to ski at Sun Valley. They came down for lunch one day and my wife had prepared a dip from one the trout. After one or two crackers and trout-dip, one of our guests commented, "That's absolutely super salmon dip." We set him straight, but he had a hard time believing us.

Allen R

 

[ia_trouter]

Maybe the whole c&r while shopping for your fish at the market is not the best plan... Whether it's farm raised fish or commercially netted you're supporting both industries as a whole... Maybe keep a couple trout and eat them instead of going to the store for your salmon... Brookies have the same omegas as salmon. Plus you're supporting your Dnr with the purchase of a trout stamp... Which will help put back into the environment... Not some big wig corporation... Learn to know where your food is coming from other than isle 12.

“You can’t waste your life making money, and then go back and try to buy your life back.”

Several points of interest in your post Itch.

Are you sure small biz commercial fisherman are not doing the same thing?

Harvesting some of my catch does seem to make more sense in the larger scheme of things if it keeps me from buying from the market. Especially since my trout catch is hatchery raised. If you can help me with the matter of "I wish they tasted as good as cat food", then I'll be onboard with your plan.

Only half kidding with that last comment as I know you are a professional chef. I won't be grilling stocker trout again as that was a complete fail.

 

[fredaevans]

GSM makes/posts some very interesting info above, none of which I have the slightest doubt.

Ever wonder why our 'Nuke Subs' stay so deep when on patrol? Stealth is obvious, long line fishing nets in the North Pacific is the other reason. Very long time back at this point but the 'Boomer Boats' (at that point) had to come to the surface, at least the transmission gear on top of the 'Sail,' to "flash traffic.'

One hit an 1,800 foot net and all hell broke loose....:icon_roll

Took several days to cut all that crud off the ship as it sat dead in the water on the surface. I suspect the Russian's had a field day photoing that, and probably learned from our lesson.

 

[itchmesir]

Several points of interest in your post Itch.

Are you sure small biz commercial fisherman are not doing the same thing?

Harvesting some of my catch does seem to make more sense in the larger scheme of things if it keeps me from buying from the market. Especially since my trout catch is hatchery raised. If you can help me with the matter of "I wish they tasted as good as cat food", then I'll be onboard with your plan.

Only half kidding with that last comment as I know you are a professional chef. I won't be grilling stocker trout again as that was a complete fail.

What I meant is whether it's small scale operations, fish farms, or big giant fishing boats hauling in 10,000s of feet worth of netting daily it's all reported to the same agencies in the end... Showing there's support/demand for what they are doing it... Harvesting your own fish doesn't get reported to anything but your belly

Lemon, butter, cracked pepper... Wrap in tinfoil and bake/grill... Makes trout taste great... Also bonk them right away and get them on ice or in a cold creel... Letting them live on a stinger will just build up lactic acid... Will effect the flavor of the meat

“You can’t waste your life making money, and then go back and try to buy your life back.”

 

[Liphookedau]

The Figures aren't surprising as anyone whose seen a Trawler operating will have noticed what is Dumped back into The Oceans also what isn't mentioned is The Long Lines & Nets left behind all around The World which continue to catch Fish.
Probably The worst of all is When The Fishermen are only after The Fins.
They just Cut The Fins Off & Dump The rest of The Fish mainly without Killing it.
Brian

 

[fredaevans]

The Figures aren't surprising as anyone whose seen a Trawler operating will have noticed what is Dumped back into The Oceans also what isn't mentioned is The Long Lines & Nets left behind all around The World which continue to catch Fish.
Probably The worst of all is When The Fishermen are only after The Fins.
They just Cut The Fins Off & Dump The rest of The Fish mainly without Killing it.
Brian

One wonders about 'Shark Fin Soup,' one guess as to how that got into the Pot.:yikes:

 

[royalcoach]

I worked as a Federal Fisheries Observer in Alaska for 5 years after graduating college. I saw it all and then some.

Each fishery had a by-catch quota and a targeted species quota that would mark the end of the fishing in that fishery. It was usually the rock sole flathead sole fisheries that ended with the by-catch quota being met before the sole quota catch..... and that by-catch was mostly halibut.... with a small percentage being crab.

I worked on one vessel during a sole fishery when the sole were filled with roe.
The vessel was hammering the halibut and was primarily responsible for closing the fishery a week early. The captain would ask me to look the other way when 20 tons of halibut would come up in the net .... and at one point tried to bribe me not to report the halibut numbers.

Not uncommon to see Factory trawlers stripping roe and tossing the fish back to sea.....

.....Trawlers targeting what they thought was a school of Pollock ending up being a school of salmon caught killed and tossed back.

.....Trawlers targeting what they thought was rock sole or flathead sole ending up being halibut caught killed and tossed back.

.... Trawlers targeting sole and pacific cod and coming up with the entire ocean sea-floor in the nets....

Never will forget the first trawler I worked on ... it was a 125' vessel ... 5 crew. That first bag of fish that they brought up was at least 80 metric tons.
I couldn't believe it.

I ate a lot of fresh fish back in those days .... and absolutely loved it

 

[GrtLksMarlin]

Okay, from some old IGFA/International Angler magazines, in the "Did you Know" section (odd, but my favorite part). Random factoids, dates not noted by me:

• The USA discards 1 million tonnes of fish for the 3.7 tonnes of fish landed annually.
• The Gulf of Mexico shrimp fishery has nearly 5lbs. of bycatch for every 1 pound of fish harvested.
• The south Atlantic shrimp fishery has nearly 3lbs. of bycatch for every pound of shrimp harvested.
• The N.E. groundfish fishery has nearly 2lbs. of bycatch for every pound of fish harvested.
• Percentage of commercial quota taken in the Gulf of Mexico for small costal sharks as of March-2004 (3 months into year) = 227% EXCLUDING dead discards.
• Reported commercial landings of blue Marlin in Ghana in 2003 - 2.2 million lbs..
• Av. amount of shrimp consumed annually by Americans, 3.7lb. Number of fish killed to catch 3.7lb. of shrimp, about 400.
• Amount of Blue & White Marlin landed in Atlantic by longlines - 7 million lbs.
• Estimated dead Swordfish discards by U.S. longliners in 2002 -528,000lbs.
• Number of striped Marlin taken by two Mexican longliners in nine months in Magdalena Bay - 11,743
• All tackle record for Atlantic Bluefin Tuna 1,496lb.. ABFT increase in size 7-10% per month (using 8% in one year 2#-2.16-2.33-2.51-2.72-2.93-3.17-3.42-3.70-3.99-4.31-4.66#, at 100#-108-116.6-125.9-136.0-146.9-158.7-171.4-185.1-199.9-215.9-233.2#). A mature ABFT = approx. 525# and will be under 15y.o. and typically live to 50y.o............Size at which 55% of ABFT are caught - 3.7#.
• Estimated annual amount of discarded bycatch by worlds commercial fishing fleet..........53.4 BILLION pounds.
• IF each bycatch species weighed ONLY 1/4lb. and was 6" long (though most substancially larger), the number of times the annual bycatch would reach the moon would be 38.2......... BTW, the moon is 238,900 miles away, so IOW the annual bycatch with a 6" lgth. each equals 9,125,280 miles......The circumference of the Earth is only 24,901 miles, so the bycatch at 6" lgth. would wrap around the Earth 366.5 times.

B.E.F.

 

[chechem]

Okay, from some old IGFA/International Angler magazines, in the "Did you Know" section (odd, but my favorite part). Random factoids, dates not noted by me:

• The USA discards 1 million tonnes of fish for the 3.7 tonnes of fish landed annually.
• The Gulf of Mexico shrimp fishery has nearly 5lbs. of bycatch for every 1 pound of fish harvested.
• The south Atlantic shrimp fishery has nearly 3lbs. of bycatch for every pound of shrimp harvested.
• The N.E. groundfish fishery has nearly 2lbs. of bycatch for every pound of fish harvested.
• Percentage of commercial quota taken in the Gulf of Mexico for small costal sharks as of March-2004 (3 months into year) = 227% EXCLUDING dead discards.
  ...

• 
  
  The irony of this is that shrimp bycatch supports the coastal shark populations of the Gulf of Mexico. Indeed, shrimp trawling is terribly wasteful and inefficient. Hardly worthy of criticism now, however; gas prices and pond-raised shrimp have about eliminated the Gulf shrimp fleet.

 

[GrtLksMarlin]

The irony of this is that shrimp bycatch supports the coastal shark populations of the Gulf of Mexico. Indeed, shrimp trawling is terribly wasteful and inefficient. Hardly worthy of criticism now, however; gas prices and pond-raised shrimp have about eliminated the Gulf shrimp fleet.

Well, though we were speaking of "bycatch", if you look at the data in those same "Did you Know" sections (remember, the IGFA is about research and data collection....and only uses records as a tool to aquire it and promote ethical fishing)....Sport fishing generated revenue vastly outweighs the community dollars generated by commercial fishing.

However, the tough trick is setting things up so that revenue gets into the hands of those displaced work wise......More so, as bad as bycatch numbers are, fact of the matter is the small percentage of kept catch is ALL needed and used by the people of our world.

That is why the IGFA (though it seems otherwise) rarely takes a political stand on any of these issues the world over. They simply collect as much data about sport and commercial fishing as they can, then share it with anyone and everyone, and that's that.

That said, in that they want to protect sportfishermans abilities to do so first and foremost, they also realize that all of the kept catch and more is needed, and on top of that realize that jobs/livelyhoods must be equitably maintained for commercial fisherman.

So what do you do?

Using the data you can see that current fishing methods are not efficient. If say 80% of the work and effort is wasted, then the commercial fisherman are working 5x harder then they should have to for the same payout.......This sort of data if truly utilized well can help to improve the percentage of kept-bycatch numbers. Therefor, if the method improves yield, to keep up with the productivity you need workers...etc. etc..

Preservation (keeping everything untouched) serves no one, and in fact due to the imbalances we have caused already might lead to a total collapse. Conservation, the efficient, conservative and ethical use of resources really does serve everyone. More so, it insures if well planned an improvement on the current conditions.

With well thought out conservation, everyone wins.

B.E.F.

 

[chechem]

Well, though we were speaking of "bycatch", if you look at the data in those same "Did you Know" sections (remember, the IGFA is about research and data collection....

With well thought out conservation, everyone wins.

B.E.F.

Well-written and well-considered statements. Indeed, conservation is one of the keys.

BUT, the real problem is population size. Human populations are rapidly outdistancing resources. How can we deal with that? No idea.

Concerning the real issues here, let me add that I've worked on a shrimp boat (during graduate school) and have published about bycatch. Shrimping by trawl is a dinosaur, so it's hardly a concern. But even the new fishing techniques, such as purse seines for Bluefin Tuna, have led to new problems. They're too efficient; tuna populations are endangered as a result. And that's for suchi, not to feed the masses. So too are shark fins (at $100m per bowl of soup) sold for Asian weddings, not protein to feed the hungry.

Commercial fishing has solved the efficiency problems, but in so doing has eliminated the fisheries. Greed is still king.

 

[GrtLksMarlin]

.........But even the new fishing techniques, such as purse seines for Bluefin Tuna, have led to new problems. They're too efficient; tuna populations are endangered as a result. And that's for suchi, not to feed the masses. So too are shark fins (at $100m per bowl of soup) sold for Asian weddings, not protein to feed the hungry.

Commercial fishing has solved the efficiency problems, but in so doing has eliminated the fisheries. Greed is still king.

Consider this which i posted above.....Also consider bycatch..

All tackle record for Atlantic Bluefin Tuna 1,496lb.. ABFT increase in size 7-10% per month (using 8% in one year 2#-2.16-2.33-2.51-2.72-2.93-3.17-3.42-3.70-3.99-4.31-4.66#, at 100#-108-116.6-125.9-136.0-146.9-158.7-171.4-185.1-199.9-215.9-233.2#). A mature ABFT = approx. 525# and will be under 15y.o. and typically live to 50y.o............Size at which 55% of ABFT are caught - 3.7#.

They have not actually solved efficiency problems. In fact they are actually LESS efficient. All they have really done is find an easier quicker way of getting the tonnage they're allowed.

Think about it, and just faking in some numbers here AND realize I am vastly oversimplifying it.......If a single haul yields 20 short tons of fish (40,000#), and 75% is bycatch leaving 10,000#. Right off the bat 75% of the haul work was wasted, yet then add to that the amount of work to sort (which is the bulk of the actual work so lets say 90% of it)......So a perfect haul means 4x the yield and zero actual work....Roughly lets say 5% of the effort for the same end result.

That said, consider the 10,000#/25% yield haul, 90% effort for sort.

If the fish average 4#, that means 2,500 fish to process......However, if the fish average 150#, that means only 67 fish to process for an equivalent yield, and zero percent effort to sort.

In the end, it is simply easier, not really more efficient.....It's easier to haul everything in, sort it out dumping the bycatch taking up 90% of the effort, process 37.5x more carcasses and in the end get the same 10,000# worth......What is it easier than simply taking the time to figure out how to haul in JUST 67 150# BFT?

Now lets look at the real impact.....





Lets say all of the catch weighs 4# each......

• 2,500 Tuna are taken out of the total available vs. just 67.
• 7,500 fish are wasted. May not be Tuna, but it's fish, and the numbers for fish used for other things other than a direct food product is roughly 80%....Whole seperate groups fish for those, why?
• 7,500 fish as you note go to feed the bellies of scavengers and top line predators of which neither is really a cost effective food source.
• 7,500 fish are removed from Tuna food source stocks.
• The predators (sharks) and scavengers increase in numbers. Predation of Tuna increases depleting total numbers further.
• When predators such as shark recoil from the balance due to over population then subsequent crash, Tuna also a predator, then species such as Squid move in and devastate the fishery with numbers.
• etc.

Besides being inefficient, simply easier, Tuna stocks are rapidly depleted from over fishing (volume vs. size), lack of food sources, predation, and so on......all for lets say all toll 10x the actual work.

Efficiency means taking the least number of fish, and doing the least amount of peripheral damage, while doing the least amount of work.

IOW, someone taking the time to figure out a better way to do the same thing....not just an easier way. Essentially, the Tuna fisherman are putting themselves out of work to "get theirs now asap".

So everyone can win, or everyone can lose...Those making excuses just not willing to try in that there is ALWAYS a good way to achieve a goal....But you have to look for it.

B.E.F.

 

[chechem]

Consider this which i posted above.....Also consider bycatch..

...

Efficiency means taking the least number of fish, and doing the least amount of peripheral damage, while doing the least amount of work.

IOW, someone taking the time to figure out a better way to do the same thing....not just an easier way. Essentially, the Tuna fisherman are putting themselves out of work to "get theirs now asap".

So everyone can win, or everyone can lose...Those making excuses just not willing to try in that there is ALWAYS a good way to achieve a goal....But you have to look for it.

B.E.F.

All excellent points, and my apologies for not citing your comments thoroughly.

BTW, my comments on efficiency concerned broad-scale changes in fishing, over the past 100 years. Traditional tuna fisheries in the Mediterranean didn't have airplanes or purse seines. By those limitations, perhaps it was sustainable. But they still were taking tuna during spawning events, which is a doomed-fishery technique.

I agree with the efficiency-of-handling argument you made. But with the increase in value of sushi tuna, labor costs hardly matter.

Thanks for the discussion. :thmbup:

 

[GrtLksMarlin]

Well thanks for the kind words and nice discussion.....and if you've not seen it you might like this bit of history:

[ame="http://youtu.be/u5dOLiF9fjk"]Tuna Fishing and Canning: "The Fighting Tuna" Del Monte - YouTube[/ame]


With that, you no doubt know more about commercial fishing then i do. I simply have some data and superficial knowledge on it to go by, and then try to apply some logic to it using the numbers.

Don't get me wrong, the Tuna boats will tell me I just don't get it on the one side, and naturally the Vegans will tell me the same on the other. Yet using your experience what if you could:

• Develop nets that take only the "ideal" size of Tuna to get the optimum size for the least amount of work, letting as much bycatch as possible slip through, yet avoid the best breeding sizes?
• Develop methods much like old time crop rotation. IOW, only opening a season in specific areas for one year to optimize growth rates, fishing other species for a few years, then hit it again when the time is right.....If this was done with all species, and they were rotated optimizing size and reproduction, where might it lead?
• Develop fishing boats and industries that make use of an entire haul, not just what they specifically target.
• Promote fishing for detrimental species which still make great food stuffs. As an example, why do we eat bait size calimari in resturants instead of the big strips like off of Humboldt Squid in the Sea of Cortez? They taste great, lots of volume and an exploded population.....Trouble is they fish for these things with hook and line instead of really hauling them in, waste the heads (fertilizer maybe?), and don't promote them.

Using that Squid example, if someone would just push and promote them right on the American public they would literally eat them up....Same thing with the Chinese. They're a MASSIVE spreading plague of good meat! Finally, no one I know of is really efficiently fishing for them....and how many millionairs were made in Cod, Tuna, Salmon, Swordfish and so on simply because they made it happen.

A LOT of possibilities that I don't have the knowledge or really the drive at this stage in my life to do anything with.....But someone might

B.E.F.