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Old 03-11-2009, 03:22 PM
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Default Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

im goin to Ixtapa, mexico on saturday for spring break. i wanna take my rod down there to do a little fishing right off the beach but im not sure what flies to take. ive read a little and found that roosterfish are really hard to catch and that i could use streamers. any colors in particular? what about for jacks and houndfish? any other fish i should be targeting? im not familiar with any of these fish so any advice is welcome. thanks
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Old 03-11-2009, 03:23 PM
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Default Re: Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

just found this on a website, for anyone that doesn't know where ixtapa is. i didn't until i got in on this trip lol. on the pacific side of mexico.

Location

Ixtapa-Zihuatanejo is located southwest of Mexico City in the coastline of the State of Guerrero, in the area known as "The Golden Pacific" and "Mexico's Riviera".
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Old 03-11-2009, 05:26 PM
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Default Re: Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

Jack,

Roosters love splashy stuff on top. Crease flies, Bob’s Bangers, poppers etc. the faster the retrieve the better. If you see one chasing it, retrieve it right up to the sand. Deceivers, any color, and if you tie, make some Mexican flag colors for good luck. Other popular patterns are Abel anchovy type deals that imitate the anchovetas and stuff like Tabory Snake flies (think deceiver with a muddler minnow spun deer hair head) that imitate mullet. With your 8 weight I’d go with a 2/0, or 3/0 if you have a 10 weight.

Jacks- anything you throw.
Snook- same stuff for roosters

You’ll want a “shock tippet” on the end of your tippet section. You can buy SW leaders with shock tippets or make your own using a 12” section of 60lb clear Ande mono. If you have a SW tackle shop (doesn’t have to be a fly shop), you can usually buy the 60lb Ande (or Mason) by the yard, so get 20 yds or so. You may be able to find it down there, but don’t count on it. To attach the shock leader, tie a blood knot between your tippet and the Ande.

To tie the blood knot, double the tippet section, probably 16 or 20lb test, and tie a blood knot with the doubled tippet, and 60lb Ande.

To attach the fly to the Ande, use a 3 turn improved clinch, or Homer Rhodes loop (better). Tighten it with a pair of pliers and make sure the knot is snug, leaving a bit of a tag end.

I’d suggest tying a bunch up in advance and keeping them in individual zip lock bags. You can leave the fly attached and ready to go in the bag if you want. After you tie the blood knot to the shock leader, double the free end and tie a loop, You can easily attach the doubled loop of the tippet to the mid section of your SW leader with a loop to loop connection for quick changes if all heck is breaking loose. (You can make stronger more reliable leader connections with bimini twists, and slim beauty knots, but this is a quick and dirty way to rig.)

Other stuff- I’d take a long some other SW basics, size 1 clousers, size 2 crab patterns for prospecting from shore for random stuff, and use it without a shock tippet and heavily weighted half and halfs 3/0 if you go out in a boat and want to fish deep definitely with a shock tippet. From a boat you could hook anything from mahi to yellowtail tuna to snappers to….

I’d try to target the beach at low light, mornings and evenings, and scan the horizon for birds working and splashes.

Good luck, it sounds like a great trip. Looking forward to the hero shots in your trip report.
mark
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Old 03-11-2009, 06:20 PM
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Default Re: Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

I've heard there are plenty of Cero Mackerel to be had down there. Use a haywire bite guard.
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Old 03-11-2009, 08:56 PM
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Default Re: Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

wow peregrines thanks so much for all the help. theres a couple fly stores nearby that i can run to tomorrow to grab some flies. what colors would you suggest on the crease fly? what about on the bobs banger style poppers? i was thinking silver sided with blue uppers on the bodies because it looks the most like a bait fish, but like i said im totally new to all this. what do you think you would choose as your "go to" fly for the situation ill be in (this is for anyone to answer)

i dont tie (yet) so the mexican flag flies are out . are chart/white, tan/white, drk grn/white clousers/decievers at all useful in my situation?

ok im just trying to clear this up with you. what you were saying was buy the 60lb ande mono for shock tippet, then go ahead and tie a few flies to like 1ft sections of the ande and tie a loop in the other end of the ande. keep these in seperate baggies and then i can change out flies quickly using loop to loop connections?? sounds like a damn good idea to me lol

you mentioned "prospecting from the beach for random stuff", by this do you mean just casually wading out and casting in seemingly good locations for nothing specific, just seeing if i can get anything?
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Old 03-11-2009, 09:12 PM
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Default Re: Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

edit: just read a fishing report for the area, jacks are hitting pencil poppers pretty well. ill see if i can get my hands on some of them too i guess.

**** this means im gonna go drop another $20 or $30 on flies and i might only use these on one or two outings... this is a bad hobby
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Old 03-12-2009, 09:43 AM
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Default Re: Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

The owner The Tackle Box in San Antonio has been to Zihuatenejo and might be able to advise you on what works.
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Old 03-12-2009, 10:46 AM
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Default Re: Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jackh View Post
wow peregrines thanks so much for all the help. theres a couple fly stores nearby that i can run to tomorrow to grab some flies. what colors would you suggest on the crease fly? what about on the bobs banger style poppers? i was thinking silver sided with blue uppers on the bodies because it looks the most like a bait fish, but like i said im totally new to all this. what do you think you would choose as your "go to" fly for the situation ill be in (this is for anyone to answer)

i dont tie (yet) so the mexican flag flies are out . are chart/white, tan/white, drk grn/white clousers/decievers at all useful in my situation?

ok im just trying to clear this up with you. what you were saying was buy the 60lb ande mono for shock tippet, then go ahead and tie a few flies to like 1ft sections of the ande and tie a loop in the other end of the ande. keep these in seperate baggies and then i can change out flies quickly using loop to loop connections?? sounds like a damn good idea to me lol

you mentioned "prospecting from the beach for random stuff", by this do you mean just casually wading out and casting in seemingly good locations for nothing specific, just seeing if i can get anything?
Crease flies/ Bangers/Poppers- It doesn't matter much as far as color, but white with a blue back would be great. It'll mostly be the commotion on the surface that draws them.

Clousers- chart/white for sure, tan, white, would also be good, and anything else you can think of.

Deceivers, any color-- all white blue over white, olive over white, chartreuse, and then anything else that catches your eye- red/yellow etc.

For the shock leaders, I'd go one step further, tying the shock leader to the doubled tippet section, so that you have a shock rigged up to the tippet already, and put a loop of doubled line into the tippet to attach to a loop on the mid section of your leader. Then tie a fly to the end of the shock leader and put the whole thing in a baggie.

If you have a break off, it will probably be in the weakest link -- the tippet section. This way if you get a broken off by a hot fish, you can loop on a new tippet, with a shock and fly already attached and be good to go in 3 seconds instead of fumbling with knots while fish are busting in front of you.
Just make sure that the loops in tippet and mid section of the leader are big enough to slip a fly or popper through, and practice attaching the loops correctly so you can do it quickly. If you have a few different flies rigged up, it also makes changing them out very fast. (Seating the knots on a shock can be a bit difficult, so it's best to take your time and do it correctly, and trying to do it when a 60lb rooster is flashing colors and ripping through a baitball 20 feet in front of you is not the time to practice knots.)

Yes that's what I meant by prospecting--- sometimes the water may be too deep to see into, or the fish may be very hard to see. Polarized sunglasses glasses and a ball cap with brim will help to cut glare and help you see fish. but a lot of times "blind casting" will pay off-- something will shoot out and whack a fly-- it could be a snapper--- or anything really that comes out of nowhere and nails it.

Even if you don't see fish, cast to spots up current if there is a sweep along the beach, to edges of dark spots, to white spots, rocks, rips, along points. Low light is probably best, and incoming tides can also be good too, but it can happen any time. Also looks for birds working, circling frigate birds (often there's a rooster underneath), and scan the water on either side of you for busting fish that are crashing bait. It may be happening 50 yds to your left or right. A lot of times it may suddenly erupt without warning for a few minutes and then shut off, so it pays to be ready.

Good luck!!

mark
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Old 03-12-2009, 05:54 PM
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Default Re: Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

ok i think i catch your drift now. i drew out a picture, tell me if this is what you mean.

Click the image to open in full size.

i got 20yds of 60lb ande mono and 25 yds of 30lb flouro. i talked to a guy at a fly shop today that just got back from mexico, he used 30lb flouro as a leader with 40lb flouro as tippet. he said his leader the whole thing was only about 5 ft long. i figured i use a 3-4ft section of the flouro for a leader, then 1-2ft of ande at tippet. sound good?
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Old 03-12-2009, 07:15 PM
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Default Re: Jack Crevalle, Roosterfish, Houndfish etc, what do i use?

Close...

The shock tippet can be 6-12" long. I usually start with 12" so if you change flies you have something to work with. You'll need pliers to cut it, and maybe seat th knot depending on if you eat your wheaties. A pair of regular needle nosed will work.

For an 8 weight, I'd use a leader with a 4' butt section of 30lb, you can use the fluoro if you want, with a loop at the end, then a 3' section of 25lb test to a 2' length of 16 or 20lb mono or fluoro with a loop at one end for a quick attachment to the butt section of the leader at one end (using doubled line on the 16 or 20 lb to make the loop). And at the other end a blood knot using doubled 16 or 20lb to the Ande shock.

So it would be fly line to 4' of 30lb as the butt of the leader

then a midsection of 3' of 25lb test, with a blood knot to the 30lb butt section, and a loop on the end (make the loop big enough to pass a fly or popper through. You'll attach this to the tippet.

Tippet 2' of 16 or 20lb. (You'll double the line to make the knots at either end, so start off with 4' section so you end up with about 2'). Make a loop of the doubled tippet. You'll use this to attach to the loop in the mid section of your leader. At the other end, double the line again and tie a blood knot to 12" of the 80lb Ande. Tie a 3 turn clinch in the Ande to the fly.

So, in those zip locks you'd have a fly tied to 12" of 60lb Ande tied to a 2' section of 16 or 20lb tippet with a loop in the end.

So for the leader it would be:

4' 30lb butt - blood knot - 3' 25lb midsection - loop -

And then the tippet/shock/fly:

doubled loop - 2' of 16lb (or 20lb) tippet - doubled blood knot - 12" shock of 60lb Ande - 3 turn clinch - fly

This should layout the fly at the end of your cast.

Although the straight 30lb fluoro to shock will work, the reason I do this is that if a big fish hits and takes off, it may really scream some line out. If bad things happen and the fish breaks off, I'd want it to be at the 16 or 20lb tippet. I'm guessing that you have 20lb backing on your reel? If that's the case you might be out a whole fly line if the break occurs in the backing (probably at the knot to the fly line). I'd bet the guy in the shop you were talking to was either a gamblin' man or was using 50lb gel spun backing on his reel. (Because gel spun has a very small diameter, you can get double the yards at double the lb test of dacron or micron, but it's a pain to use.) He may also have been using a heavier weight rod- 10 weight reels are usually loaded with 30lb backing. Or he had a fast boat.

A good rule of thumb is to always have the weakest link in your leader/tippet, with a lb test less than the breaking strength of your fly line or backing. And that goes double for fish like roosters and other bruisers that can really smoke gear.

I hope this makes sense-- I wish I knew how to draw like you did, it'd be a lot clearer.

mark
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