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Old 07-15-2011, 04:54 PM
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Default bass leader

Does anyone have a favorite leader formula for large size 4 bass bugs and poppers? I love fishing them on my 9wt but I can't quite geta good turn over with my current leaders. I want to tie one and thought about using 4ft of 40lb, 3ft of 30lb, and 2ft 20lb to the fly. Any thoughts or suggestions?
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Old 07-15-2011, 06:32 PM
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Default Re: bass leader

I've tied my own single strand leaders for many years. I also use some furled leaders, which are well worth having!

I make my leaders with Yozuri Hybrid.
36 inches of 60 lb (.031 dia.)
16 inches of 50 lb (.028 dia.)
14 inches of 30 lb (.023 dia.)
12 inches of 25 lb (.019 dia.)
12 to 18 inches 15 or 20 lb as tippet.

This makes a 7 1/2 to 8 ft leader, which has worked fine for me in most situations. I've used this same leader on my 8 wt & my 10 wt.

My big bass bugs are tied on 2/0 or 3/0 hooks!
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Old 07-15-2011, 06:55 PM
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Default Re: bass leader

Thanks Jim. Thats exactly what I was lookin for. If I wanted to throw a smaller fly like a cricket or damselfly would I just add some tippet to the 15lb? Maybe 12" of 10lb and then 12" of 6lb? Just think id like to have one basic leader that I can modify with tippet. I just fish for bass and panfish for now.
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Old 07-15-2011, 09:36 PM
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Default Re: bass leader

I don't usually do that, because I have other rods. If I was going to use smaller flies, I would use a lighter weight rod, like perhaps a 6 wt.

You would have to experiment some with the final lengths, but you sure could get it down smaller, and it would then be a longer leader. Longer may not be necessary, but as long as it's turning the fly over it should not be a problem.

Transferring the fly line energy is all you're doing with the leader. Generally, the heavier the line & bulkier or heavier the fly, the shorter & heavier the leader needed to turn the fly over.

When you use just one leader, there is usually some compromise. I can cast most flies with this formula, but if I have some problems, like with a heavily weighted fly I can shorten it and it will usually work just fine.

Go with a smaller or lighter fly, and lighter tippet, then that should not be problem either. There's room for making this leader longer & lighter in the tippet end.
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Old 07-15-2011, 10:34 PM
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Default Re: bass leader

hello,
for LMB, i use a seven foot furled leader and two feet of 15 lb. tippet. thats for throwing large divers,sliders,poppers etc. if im stripping a clouser or leech, probably 0X or 1X. i am a big fan of furled leaders if you cant tell


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Old 07-16-2011, 07:41 AM
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Default Re: bass leader

Caseywise, I started using them a few years ago, and have also become a fan.

They're a bit more expensive compared to single strand leaders, but they do work well & appear to be very durable. I bought several Blue Sky brand leaders for different rods, and so far am still using the first one I tied on. That's been about 4 years. I'm using mono leaders, and bought a few made with uni-thread for my 3 & 4 wt rods. Just have not used them yet.

I don't make my own, have not gotten into that yet, although I did buy a DVD on how to make them! Looks easy, but I do too many things now

Never enough time for everything!

I still use the single strand leaders too.

pond fishin, a furled leader would also be a great choice, perhaps one about 6 to 7 ft long, then all you have to do is add your tippets. Just be sure you get one that fits your rod weight, or even slightly heavier since you're throwing big flies. I think I paid about $5-6 each for the ones I bought. Been a good investment IMO!
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Old 07-16-2011, 01:07 PM
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Default Re: bass leader

I find this interesting , and have two really dumb questions.
What is a furled leader? And what is turning a fly over? I've heard of turning a fly over but thought the weight of the hook and the way the fly is made would do that.
Also, please correct me if I'm wrong, aren't most leaders fluorocarbon,which sinks fast? So wouldn't it make more sense to use or make mono leaders for poppers and floating flies?
I've only been fly fishing 3 weeks now, but have been fishing most of my life. I know many things will be different, but some will remain the same.
Thanks
Rick
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Old 07-16-2011, 03:05 PM
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Default Re: bass leader

First, furled leaders are made with a single long piece of line. They're made on a jig, in such a way that the result is a tapered leader. Hard to explain the process. Similar to a braided leader, or I guess a bull whip.

When a fly is cast, the energy transferred to the line & leader from the rod is what moves the fly,( again, sort of the bull whip affect) not the weight of the fly. Unlike other types of tackle, the fly just goes along for the ride. With spinning or baitcasting, the lure or other weight is what pulls the line from the reel when casting.

If the leader & tippet doesn't extend completely, allowing the fly to fall back on the leader or tippet, then the fly has not been "turned over". A properly designed leader & tippet will extend out completely in such a manner to allow the fly to end up where you want it, at the end of the fully extended tippet and without slapping down on the water like a rock at the end of the cast.

All leaders are not made from fluoro. They can be a number of materials, including mono, fluorocarbon, or with furled leaders, even types of thread. And yes, it only makes sense to use a material that works best with the type of fly being cast. However, it can be an advantage to use fluoro tippets, even with topwater flies. It's generally stiffer than mono, which helps with casting the larger flies (transferring energy) and because it sinks, won't leave an impression on the surface, which is not natural looking. Plus, fluoro is generally more abrasion resistant than most mono's and has less stretch.

I say generally, because with different polymers & copolymers, some may have similar characteristics to fluoro. Although, many use fluoro because of it's light refractive qualities. It's supposed to be the same as that of water, so it's supposed to be invisible in water. If you feel this is an advantage & gives you confidence in using it, then you should.

Above, I stated that I use Yozuri Hybrid to make leaders. It has a fluoro coating over a copolymer base. Supposed to give characteristics of both types of material. I like it because it's readily available, reasonably priced, is slightly stiffer than most mono's, the fluoro coating gives it better abrasion resistance than straight mono's, and over all it seems to have less stretch. But the biggest reason I use it is because it has worked well for me & I can use it on bait casting reels & spinning reels too, so I'm not buying many different lines.

Fly leaders & lines are as specialized as any other type of line. No one leader will work with all rods, lines, or flies. Some will work generally with many types of flies. For example, the leader I use for bass poppers can be used for many subsurface flies too. But, basically I only use it with a floating or sinktip line. When I go to a fast sinking line, I'll go with a different leader, usually a straight section of 15 to 20lb test about 3 to 4 feet long depending on the fly I'm using. The line sinks & pulls the fly down with it. If the leader is too long, the line will sink, but the fly may not get down as deep as the line, which defeats the purpose of using a sinking line.

It actually took me a long time to understand what leaders to use & when. Unfortunately everyone has their own preferences & opinions about leaders & tippets. But, it's really not that difficult. Once I found what worked for me, I've stuck with it. I see no reason to change what works.
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Old 07-16-2011, 07:37 PM
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Default Re: bass leader

Thanks Jim,
Sorry, Pond Fishin' I didn't mean to hijack your thread.
Is my Berkley Specialist tapered leader a furled leader?
I see what you mean about the fluoro being stiffer. I don't get the twisting as bad either.
Thanks
Rick
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Old 07-16-2011, 08:47 PM
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Default Re: bass leader

You're welcome! I only hope that I explained it well enough!

Quote:
Is my Berkley Specialist tapered leader a furled leader?
No, they're not furled, they're a single strand tapered leader made by using an extrusion process.

Here is a youtube video that I found that explains how a furled leader is made. This one does not use a jig. Most folks that make them use a jig that holds the line in place as they make them. With a jig, the line is wrapped around pegs placed in a specific manner, and twisted to get the desired result. A furled leader looks more like a rope when completed, except it's not all the same diameter.

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