Would you offer help?

woodrivertroutbum · Feb 13, 2013

Hey guys, I am curious if you would offer help or not in this situation.

I am currently an arborist by trade. More specifically, I contract climb for several companies. Because of this, I can work a 3 day week and get by. I am glad I don't have to do it 5+ days a week because I don't want to burn myself out but I wouldn't mind doing something else during the week.

Well, my local fly shop is about a minute up the road from me and is owned by an older gentlemen with some health issues. The shop was recently closed for 2 weeks unexpectedly and we found out later that he was in the hospital.

I am almost positive he doesn't have any family members that would be able to run, or help him in the shop which means he will be closed a lot more than normal, only opening when he is feeling well enough to do so. It sucks when it is not open because it is so convenient, but more importantly I just hate to see his business suffer that he has had for so long. I actually stopped by the other day after the storm and shoveled the 2 feet of snow off the steps and to where he parks. I want to help him as much as possible, even if he doesn't know it was me that did it.

Anyways, I would like to offer to help him out at the shop but feel uncomfortable about doing it. I feel like it isn't my place to offer, but I also know that he doesn't have anyone else. In all honesty, I don't even want anything for it. I wouldn't turn down store credit, but that isn't why I want to do it.

So, I wouldn't expect anyone to do it for free, but what do you think about offering? How would you go about it? Thanks!

williamhj · Feb 13, 2013

That is a kind and generous instinct. I think it is worth a shot. Tell him you love fishing and enjoy his shop and know he needs some help running the place. You'd enoy it and could just talk fishing which is fun. A good neighborly thing to do. If he wants to pay you work something out. Might remind him of how we use to be better at taking care of our neighbors.

Guest1 · Feb 13, 2013

Maybe the way to do it is just ask him for a part time job. Tell him you don't need a lot of hours, but just thought it would be fun. That way he does not see it as charity which a lot of older people just hate taking.

stuie675 · Feb 13, 2013

If he is like most fly fishermen, I bet he would love it especially because I bet that shop is his pride and joy and to see someone else want to see it survive would also be an awesome thing.

okuma · Feb 13, 2013

You're thoughts are great and not to take away, but let's look at it from his side(I think). How well does he know you? Are you close friends or does he know your family...stuff like that. I have a friend who had a shop locally. We were close. If I ever ran the place for him, it was on very short termed. Not that he didn't trust me (we fished together constantly). He was just that business minded. I feel things may work out. But if not, at least we know you have a huge caring heart!

littledavid123 · Feb 13, 2013

Think Dan is on the right track with this one, offering charity may turn him off.

Dave

Rip Tide · Feb 13, 2013

My buddy works at a shop one day a week.
I'm sure that he doesn't make much, but I don't think that he does it for the money. More just to be involved.
He does all their rod repairs and the income from that is all his. Plus he gets an employee discount and some manufacturers samples..... (like a free TFO 9wt)
...it doesn't have to be about the money

brian miville · Feb 13, 2013

williamhj said:
That is a kind and generous instinct. I think it is worth a shot. Tell him you love fishing and enjoy his shop and know he needs some help running the place. You'd enoy it and could just talk fishing which is fun. A good neighborly thing to do. If he wants to pay you work something out. Might remind him of how we use to be better at taking care of our neighbors.

It saddens me, in this age in which social media has the ability to bring us as a society closer together, that it appears we have become less civilized. I still see a glimmer of hope that good things can happen without the need for personal gain to come into it. It gives me so much joy when I DO see selfless acts happen. "So good on you" woodrivertroutbum! I agree maybe approaching him from the start with a "hey, I would be happy to help if you like. Pay me, don't pay me, I leave it up to you decide what your conscious can handle."

mcnerney · Feb 13, 2013

Dan is probably right, but either way (as William said) it is very kind and generous to offer to give him a helping hand.

fredaevans · Feb 13, 2013

brian miville said:
It saddens me, in this age in which social media has the ability to bring us as a society closer together, that it appears we have become less civilized. I still see a glimmer of hope that good things can happen without the need for personal gain to come into it. It gives me so much joy when I DO see selfless acts happen. "So good on you" woodrivertroutbum! I agree maybe approaching him from the start with a "hey, I would be happy to help if you like. Pay me, don't pay me, I leave it up to you decide what your conscious can handle."

Five Star Thread going here. And I fully agree with Brian's comments above.

As you live close, and I'll assume you shop in this store, nothing to loose by asking if you can help out until fellow regains his health. Only three answers: Yes, No and lets talk about it.

fae

joebloe · Feb 13, 2013

Offering help is the right thing to do -

rockriver · Feb 13, 2013

I'd offer to do it for the experience and something else to do. If he offers some payment, discuss it; but, I doubt that he makes enough to pay someone to help out.

trout trekker · Feb 13, 2013

Yes, if it's in your heart offer your help.

As Okuma stated, it really does come down to his comfort with you. Please don’t take it as a slight if he says no. It’s a really tough thing for some of us, to hand over the keys to anyone else.

Many years ago a fly shop owner that was in the area had an accident and ended up in traction for an extended period of time. I ran his one man shop fulltime ( banking, A/P, ordering, booking travel and guides, etc, etc.) until he could return, without compensation.
We’d known each for years and even though I was with another fly shop at the time, there was a trust and confidence factor at work. It’s also a testament to the way small business owners would help each other out. I had to be away from my position during his recovery, which required the cooperation of my current shops partners.

The comical side of it was, a few of the customers that came in while I was behind his counter, nearly soiled themselves. They were the guys who’d hang out around my current shop and would, on occasion, go on and on, about how they’d never walk into that shop.

Sometimes I hit post, before finishing a thought...
Which brings us to another possibility. Might there be another shop in the area that could lend it’s help ( experienced retail staff ) to keep his operation running. If that fails, you might suggest contacting his product reps ( through the various lines he carries - Call Scott, Sage, Umpqua, etc. ) for help or suggestions. Directly after a large natural disaster, our reps called in to check on us and some showed up ready to chip in, almost before any of the first responders to the area did.
Even if the reps themselves can’t be there, they often know of retired or part time experienced fly shop staffers in their sales area, that might be available.

TT

kwb · Feb 13, 2013

I have grown up around older guys, now help run the Family auto salvage business that my Grandpa started 60 years ago now. When I was a young lad I always hung around my Grandpa and his Friends in the auto dealer/salvage industry, most of which owned their own businesses...

Here is what I have learned about older guys in my experiences both growing up and in a business nature...

Guys in that age group came from a time when people were obviously different in many ways, they were much more respectful and guys obviously talked about personal things a lot less than many guys likely would be willing to these days and they are generally a lot "tougher" or at least try to be more so than many younger guys do today. So I would leave asking him personal questions about his health out of it, but there is no issue with mentioning you know he has had health issues and is why he was closed.

If I was you, I would simply go in there and start a conversation with him, ask him about his past as a fly shop owner, obviously you are interested so it should be a fun conversation for you. Tell him about yourself and then just straight up tell him that you know he has been closed lately due to some health issues, straight up express interest in a part time gig, not just to help him out, but as a learning experience too, which I am assuming you are genuinely interested in learning about the fly shop business or you wouldn't be pondering all this.

I personally would tell him you would do it for nothing until you prove yourself to him, maybe just start out helping there on days he is there too. You have to make him comfortable...

Guys from that era really respect ones desire to learn and those who aren't afraid to work, you clearly aren't looking for something for nothing and he will see that. My guess is, it will be the beginning to a good relationship...

Don't beat around the bush, just be honest and forward...

stlskyline · Feb 13, 2013

Go ahead and ask. Start a conversation and see how it progresses. If he accepts your assistance; you will more than likely pick up a few tricks he has learned over the years, hear some great stories and probably meet more FF pals at the shop. As I can tell by your post; it's not about the money. In today's society most people are afraid to ask and even more afraid to offer. No matter the answer you tried.

jaybo41 · Feb 13, 2013

kwb said:
I have grown up around older guys, now help run the Family auto salvage business that my Grandpa started 60 years ago now. When I was a young lad I always hung around my Grandpa and his Friends in the auto dealer/salvage industry, most of which owned their own businesses...

Here is what I have learned about older guys in my experiences both growing up and in a business nature...

Guys in that age group came from a time when people were obviously different in many ways, they were much more respectful and guys obviously talked about personal things a lot less than many guys likely would be willing to these days and they are generally a lot "tougher" or at least try to be more so than many younger guys do today. So I would leave asking him personal questions about his health out of it, but there is no issue with mentioning you know he has had health issues and is why he was closed.

If I was you, I would simply go in there and start a conversation with him, ask him about his past as a fly shop owner, obviously you are interested so it should be a fun conversation for you. Tell him about yourself and then just straight up tell him that you know he has been closed lately due to some health issues, straight up express interest in a part time gig, not just to help him out, but as a learning experience too, which I am assuming you are genuinely interested in learning about the fly shop business or you wouldn't be pondering all this.

I personally would tell him you would do it for nothing until you prove yourself to him, maybe just start out helping there on days he is there too. You have to make him comfortable...

Guys from that era really respect ones desire to learn and those who aren't afraid to work, you clearly aren't looking for something for nothing and he will see that. My guess is, it will be the beginning to a good relationship...

Don't beat around the bush, just be honest and forward...

This is an excellent post as have been the others. Since it's obviously in your heart, you really have nothing to loose by offering a helping hand. I like kwb's idea of offering to do it for nothing until you've proven yourself and he's comfortable with you. Let him know how much you appreciate his shop and the service he's provided you through the years. If he says NO, keep going back to do your business and treat him no differently than you had prior to asking. I'd bet if you show a genuine interest--by all means it seems that you have that--he might just take you up on the offer once he's comfortable. Whenever that may be. 5 Star post for sure, sending some rep your way too.

williamhj · Feb 13, 2013

X2 for the learning. I have a local guy I helped out when he had a health crisis. Not to the level you are offering but did some grunt work on stuff he was building. He offered to pay me and I told him I did it to learn. Its something I'm interested in and doing it for him gave me experience without buying the raw materials myself. A good win win. It made sense to him and was about friendship and shared interest rather than charity. I learned from his expertise rather than him needing my help. Perhaps this approach could work.

nick k · Feb 13, 2013

Yeah I would start out by offering to help him on the days that he is there, and maybe tell him you aren't looking for any pay or anything in return. After a while of helping him when he is present, you can probably tell him that you know he doesn't have anyone to help when hes in the hospital and you can offer to do so. Hopefully by this time he trusts you enough to agree or even asks you before that.

Either way, I think it is best to start out by doing it only when he is there so he becomes comfortable with you and the idea. And make it clear that you don't want anything in return, or else he may think your planning to swindle him somehow.

woodrivertroutbum · Feb 13, 2013

Wow. Thank you guys so much for the support and feedback! I agree 100% with working with him on days he is there to start, I would want to know how he wants his shop run before I worked it myself. His house is actually right behind the shop as well so maybe that would help him feel comfortable since he could check in whenever he wanted.

I will be back when I have a little more time to reply to more of your questions and concerns. Again, thank you guys for the support as well as sharing your concerns. This is by far the best forum I have ever been a part of and I have been a part of a LOT of them for all kinds of hobbies.

45fisher · Feb 13, 2013

Diver Dan said:
Maybe the way to do it is just ask him for a part time job. Tell him you don't need a lot of hours, but just thought it would be fun. That way he does not see it as charity which a lot of older people just hate taking.

Dan's,
Got the right idea. Gives the guy an out and gives him plenty of options.

Larry

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