Thanks Thanks:  1
Likes Likes:  61
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 25
  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Albuquerque
    Posts
    1,073

    Default Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    Great news...Winston's Bamboo Shop is back in production! Link below:

    Winston Bamboo Is Back! | Winston Fly Rods
    MIKE ADAIR - Exploring New Mexico landscapes through fly fishing, golf, and art.
    @mka133

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Pinedale, WY
    Posts
    20,278
    Blog Entries
    50

    Default Re: Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    Mike

    That is awesome news!
    Larry


  3. Likes mka, hairwing530 liked this post
  4. #3

    Default Re: Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    It should be noted that the Winston bamboo rods are not the same rods or built by the same rod builders that made Winston bamboo famous. That would no be Sweetgrass Rods which is the company that Glenn Brackett founded when Tom Morgan and Glenn Brackett sold Winston and they left over a change in the direction of Winston in 2005.

    Tom Morgan then started Tom Morgan Rodsmiths but his MS progressed to the point he could no longer make rods. Tom Morgan Rodsmiths was then sold. This leaves Glenn Brackett to carry on the tradition of the original Winston bamboo lineage at Sweetgrass Rods.

    The Tradition Continues

    Sweetgrass bamboo-rod manufacturer moves to Butte | Business | missoulian.com

    Local Knowledge: Cane is Cool - Big Sky Journal


    "Brackett, Winston's master rod builder, along with fellow craftsmen Jeff Walker, Jerry Kustich and Wayne Maca, announced earlier this month that they intend to resign at the end of January following a dispute with (Winston) management over the direction of the bamboo shop."

    Fly rod fued | Lifestyles | tdn.com

    End of an era - Longtime craftsmen of fly rods leaving Winston Rod Co. over changes, clashes with management | Local | missoulian.com

    A piece of history is gone - Fly Life Magazine

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB117409073615340150
    Regards,

    Silver



    "Discovery consists of seeing what everybody has seen and thinking what nobody has thought"..........Szent-Gyorgy

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    226
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    [QUOTE=silver creek;1301478]It should be noted that the Winston bamboo rods are not the same rods or built by the same rod builders that made Winston bamboo famous. That would no be Sweetgrass Rods which is the company that Glenn Brackett founded when Tom Morgan and Glenn Brackett sold Winston and they left over a change in the direction of Winston in 2005.


    Mostly correct, actually Tom Sold the company(Winston) to David in 1991, with an 18 month contract to stay on and mentor the new owner group. After those 18 months, Tom left the Winston Building and Twin Bridges for good in 1993, his health began to decline and his MS got pretty aggressive, he met Gerri and they moved to Bozeman and opened TMR (Tom Morgan Rodsmiths) on a very limited scale at first, the end of 1995. By mid 1996 it was pretty functional and setup enough to take orders. Glenn meanwhile, stayed on at Winston long after the sale, running the bamboo operations for them, until the highly publicized dispute erupted, he finished the 2005 year and left Winston in January of 2006 with Jerry Kustich to partner up and move down the road to open Sweetgrass in March 2006. Ironically, Glenn and Jerry sold their Sweetgrass building to Winston when they moved their operations to Butte, Winston used that building until it burned down in 2017. Jerry is now more removed "semi retired" and doesn't spend much time in MT anymore. Glenn is working toward retirement and has been mentoring a few guys for the last couple years, it wouldn't surprise me at all if he retires soon (like in a year or two), I think he hoped for his son Bruce to be interested in taking over, but I'm not sure the interest is there. Perhaps Jamie will be the next owner of Sweetgrass, but who knows for sure.

    In any event, the newly reopened Winston Bamboo shop will obviously not be run by Glenn as it was for so many years, it is likely they did however, probably re-hire (or kept on payroll for the last few years while rebuilding) some previous shop employees that did learn from Glenn back in the day. And, if one of those previous guys wasn't put in charge and isn't running the new shop, Winston also probably brought in someone of bamboo substance from elsewhere to head the shop operations. I'm sure either way, they will likely be quality rods in the expected Winston Boo fashion, but to Silver's point, they have not been since 2006, nor will they be now, the highly desired rods that were produced by the legendary boo guru Glenn Brackett. I'm very saddened, but I'm afraid those days are nearing an end, regardless of what brand name will be on the rods.
    Last edited by cooutlaw; 02-06-2019 at 12:35 AM.

  6. #5

    Default Re: Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    I am not a Boo Boy though my roots are in cane. I don't fish any of Glenn's rods though I have enormous respect and admiration for him as a person and artesian. Jerry and I were just hanging out and catching up recently at the Edison Show...there were plenty of today's top cane makers in attendance including the maestro, Per Brandon.

    The old Winston back ally shop that cooutlaw and I both recall with fondness became the Bamboo Shop once the new factory (minus any architectural relevance or sensitivity to local history) was opened by new ownership. The dispute that precipitated Glenn and the entire cane building staff to depart and form Sweetgrass, followed by graphite designer Sam Druckman stating, "I did not join Winston NOT to work with the great Glenn Brackett", also led to the termination of my tolerance for a company, storied though it may be, decaying into mediocre tapers and shoddy blank and finish workmanship.

    On Glenn's advice I ceased criticism of them years ago and just ignored their pathetic efforts with salt intended rods and also-ran trout rods. However, with highly intelligent, experienced and creative thinking Jim Murphy joining and ascending the ranks at Winston, the company and my attention developed an up-swing. Finally they are producing some interesting new rods with AIR, AIR Salt and Pure. If they continue on a path including upgrading their technology, bringing in a material science expert and, eventually, after Annette's retirement, a Rod Designer, they could regain their former elite relevance.

    But not in bamboo. Rods are a result of their designer-builder, not brand. This is true of graphite and even more so of cane. It is not a matter of owning taper measurements, this is hand crafting and Glenn is the repository of Winston Bamboo...hence the reputation of Sweetgrass. So, if one wants a Winston cane rod, its name is Sweetgrass, if one wants a graphite they way they were, their name is TMRodsmiths and if one favors a post Morgan- Brackett B-type graphite they can be found still being made (I think) by Freestone (despite Sam Druckman's passing).

    I do have renewed optimism though that with luck, money and bringing in outside skilled personnel, "Winston" is on the cusp of revival and has again begun to produce rods deserving of their green paint. They do have to loose their globular epoxy wrap finish though and revert to the way old Winston developed its reputation for quality finish work.

  7. Likes cooutlaw, hairwing530 liked this post
  8. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    226
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    I've stated a few times, my loyalty exists in a two fold format;

    1) I'm loyal to people that I respect, for their humility, kindness, character, integrity, and expertise, in Winston's case my loyalty was to Tom Morgan and the staff that I felt were industry leaders, innovators, and focused on producing the very best products available at that time. Arguably, they did produce some of, if not the best, specialized products for fly fishing in that era. The IM6 series rod designs were classics, purpose specific rods, that earned their place in history, and cemented the fact that great design skills and top tier manufacturing execution are the earmarks of a legacy. Rods built 28-45 years ago, that are still as much joy to fish today as they were then.

    2) I'm loyal to performance. Products that are of heirloom like, higher quality, than others, perform better, and are designed and produced by obvious innovators and experts in that product arena. Vehicles, Tools, Guns, Clothing, Boats, Sporting Goods, are some of the hundreds of product categories we can see this in. Glenn Brackett and Tom Morgan are/were this to fly rods, in Bamboo and Graphite.

    Because of my above personal biases, I too, (even being a Winston Loyalist) felt Winston went through a period of "meh" fly rod offerings. Shy of the WT (continuing on the former IM6 designs), there wasn't really a Winston model offered from 1993 to about 2012 that garnered my interest. I owned none of those models. In more recent years, and now current day however, I am once again intrigued, and have been able to find some later models that I find worthy, I think configurations that have always fallen into Winston's wheelhouse are once again beginning to hold merit and are compelling and competitive offerings. I sense an upswing and rebirth of sorts at Winston, I hope my sense is true. It appears the industry is certainly willing to embrace it.
    Last edited by cooutlaw; 02-06-2019 at 01:07 PM.

  9. Likes sweetandsalt, hairwing530 liked this post
  10. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Hudsonville, Michigan
    Posts
    1,767
    Blog Entries
    17

    Default Re: Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    I'm glad they are back but 3K for a fly rod not quite in my budget.

    Denny

  11. Likes cooutlaw, hairwing530 liked this post
  12. #8

    Default Re: Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    As has become the usual, cooutlaw and I are essentially in agreement...though I am less a Loyalist than he is. OK, to people and creativity, yes, to a Brand, no. And I'm not suggesting that ALL post Morgan graphite's from Winston are bad rods, several in their core smaller water, shorter, lighter line weight configurations are quit nice. They feel like formulamaticly "designed by committee" though rather than the conceptual vison of a master rod designer. And what is with the Boron? Winston enjoys an enviable cadre of loyal aficionados and have capitalized on their traditon. Me, they are going to have to win back as other rod makers have bypassed them by leaps and bounds going back to at least the early 1990's, I think earlier.

  13. Likes hairwing530, cooutlaw liked this post
  14. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    226
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    [QUOTE=sweetandsalt;1301852]As has become the usual, cooutlaw and I are essentially in agreement...though I am less a Loyalist than he is. OK, to people and creativity, yes, to a Brand, no. And I'm not suggesting that ALL post Morgan graphite's from Winston are bad rods, several in their core smaller water, shorter, lighter line weight configurations are quit nice. They feel like formulamaticly "designed by committee" though rather than the conceptual vison of a master rod designer. And what is with the Boron? Winston enjoys an enviable cadre of loyal aficionados and have capitalized on their traditon. Me, they are going to have to win back as other rod makers have bypassed them by leaps and bounds going back to at least the early 1990's, I think earlier.[/QUOTE

    Without debate, even among any brands loyal following, all makers have had successes and flops in models, and individual configurations within those models over the years. No one brand has ever produced exceptional rods throughout every series and every configuration they ever produced. It likely would be an impossible achievement for any company to ever accomplish. Especially with varying angler tastes and industry politics, one can always find an eager nay-sayer for anything on the planet.

    Obviously many manufacturers have seen both sides of the coin, and vision has played a huge component in that...To S&S's point, Sage players like Green, had a different vision, perhaps inspired by different geography, water being fished, angling styles, etc. As did Scott, Loomis, Hardy, (insert 6 more brands here), The RPL from Sage was a vision in the mid 1980's that S&S is likely referring to, a faster action, power reserve, alternative to most more traditional action options available at that time, technology being played with and advanced, we see the evolution of that start in yet designs still today. Winston (Tom Morgan) meanwhile, at the time, held conviction to remain steadfast to his preferences and to those that appreciated his specific purpose designs, (and obviously continued with same vision at TMR). Different paths, neither one right nor wrong, just alternative visions, producing different rods. Both excellent, I owned both.

    The rod Technology race became quite prolific from the 1990's forward, some manufacturers had great talent, lengthy experience, as well as, both vision and deep pockets at their disposal, while others were handicapped in one category or another. In racing, the formula is often simple- speed costs, how fast do you want to go? Without resources for talent, infrastructure, engineering, process development, many makers grasp at unknowns, materials, taper designs, etc. in hopes of garnering advancement and keeping enough market share to survive until the sun came out and they could again flourish with inspired, cutting edge, products. Again, regardless of technology employed, all makers still saw some wins, and, some flops, as they do today and likely will until the end of time.

    With this, the only significant resource influence I would question capable of abating a design by committee theory, is intellectual property, perhaps the most very valuable asset a company can have, in fly rods that might be a maker owning years of schematics, mandrels, and taper designs, that were proven to be winners, and then if that manufacturer was to take those tapers and apply new materials, resins, etc. and adjust the materials and slight taper modification to embrace the mathematical recovery and flex profile differences needed to replicate modern day versions of those historically proven designs by a previous visionary, that maker might have finally followed a historically proven successful design and rebirthed it with a modern facelift. Using these designs would not require new engineering, nor extensive R&D and materials scientist to insure performance, as these designs would be already proven to perform for many decades. Perhaps the same recipe for success that we see in Scotts new GS as well. Proven legacy taper, slightly modified with new materials science. What would we call this rod? Perhaps Pure? Perhaps a 2019 IM6? Perhaps this rod was designed 50 years ago rather than by committee. Perhaps, some long term employee knew where to look in the files for a proven successful winning design.

    Point being, S&S is correct, measureable improvement counts, especially in advancement of performance, change is good, transition sucks. How that improvement happens to come to light, maybe of less consequence of importance, many great things in this world came about by accident. Bartschi, perhaps a genius designer in his own right, took a great rod and made it better in G2 and now GS, both homeruns, from a proven legacy design. A better cake without changing the batter. Maybe others will see success in the same strategy.

    It would be interesting to see the schematics of the taper designs between an RPL/LL Graphite II,III,IV, Z, and an X too (my X's feel like very familiar designs). Or the Loomis evolution of models vs taper similarities.

    I think any company has the ability to win back consumers, it takes change of attitude, change of vision, and maybe leadership that says we will stay true to what we were best known for, and be the very best version of ourselves we can be, and that sometimes starts with going back to what worked all along.

    As a blind man once said, I've seen many changes over the years and it looks like many more are coming into view.

    I am an advocate of great rods that perform in a superior manner, whether they be designed by the highest acclaimed longest running visionary of rod design in the world, or, by the worlds smartest 8th grader, either one equally deserves the accolades for creating a great product. Let's hope it also is accompanied with world class build quality and then further, let's hope the 8th grader has admirable character and integrity.
    Last edited by cooutlaw; 02-06-2019 at 03:57 PM.

  15. Likes hairwing530 liked this post
  16. #10

    Default Re: Winston Bamboo Shop is Open!

    I donít get as deep in the woods as S&S or Cooutlaw. Of the first three nice rods I owned, two were Winston rods, one graphite and one bamboo. There is something magical about my Winston original graphite 8í6Ē five weight. The other rod was a Sage RP.

    Sometime in the early 90ís, I do not remember the year, but there was a large Russell Chatham painting hanging in the shop, I spent a day touring the shop and casting rods. I was looking to buy a 4 and a 6. I walked away with neither rod as I found the rods uninspiring. I was quite disappointed. Winstonís failure led to my long love affair with Sage rods.

    Last summer I cast a few of the modern Winston 5 weights. Again, I found the rods to be functional, but not memorable.

    Iím in the market for a shorter 4 weight. Based on what Iíve read here and other outlets, Iím going to cast the Air and Pure rods in 8í by 4 configurations along with the Scott GS 8í4Ē by 4. May the best rod win.

  17. Likes cooutlaw, sweetandsalt, hairwing530 liked this post
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Winston Kairos 9í 5wt Fly Fishing Rod -TCO FLY SHOP
    By Ebay USA in forum Fly Rods for sale
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-18-2018, 09:10 AM
  2. Winston 9' 6" 9wt BL5 Fly Rod 5 Piece - TCO Fly Shop
    By Ebay USA in forum Fly Rods for sale
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 01-23-2018, 02:20 PM
  3. Winston IM6 9' 6 Weight 3 Piece Fly Rod - TCO Fly Shop
    By Ebay USA in forum Fly Rods for sale
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-13-2017, 08:20 AM
  4. WINSTON BL5 590-5 Fly Rod 9' 5wt. 5pc. *TCO FLY SHOP*
    By Ebay Canada in forum Fly Rods for sale
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-02-2013, 03:00 PM
  5. WINSTON BIIMX 890-4 Fly Rod 9' 8wt. 4pc *TCO FLY SHOP*
    By Ebay Canada in forum Fly Rods for sale
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-18-2013, 04:51 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •