I bought a 6-foot Cabelas Prime (one piece) 3-wt when they had a big price cut; I figured a short 3-wt would be good for a little creek that I fish in, and a chance to try a glass rod (other than my ancient 9-wt Wonderod). I put a good Rio DT line on it (another new thing to try). Practicing in the yard, I put a hula-hoop out about 40 feet, but I can't reach it with that setup (I easily can with a CGR 7-foot 5-wt). With the 6-footer, maybe I'm getting out about 30 feet with not such great accuracy (admittedly it was a windy day). Anyway, I am not a great caster but I wonder what I should expect with a rod this short?
Short rod - realistic expectations?
- Thread starter gpwhitejr
- Start date
pnc
Well-known member
Casting woes...... Not familiar with the rod. But every rod I have that size will throw at least twice what your getting.. Have them tor same reason, small waters. In use casts over 30', might be 40'.
Does the line yoir throwing include leader ? Yes or no, don't let it stop you from using. If waters are small.
Have idea that different rod action might be throwing you. Can you describe cast ? Or what line is doing in air ? Waving, falling, so forth.
......... pc
Does the line yoir throwing include leader ? Yes or no, don't let it stop you from using. If waters are small.
Have idea that different rod action might be throwing you. Can you describe cast ? Or what line is doing in air ? Waving, falling, so forth.
......... pc
silver creek
Well-known member
Were you casting against the wind? If so, not to worry.
I only tried it one day, and it was a bit windy. I had a woolly bugger (with the hook cut off) on a pretty long leader (probably 10 feet). The line was kind of blowing around. I'll try again on a calm day with a shorter leader and a tiny fly. I just wondered what one expects with a rod this short. I have gotten close (but no cigar yet) to casting the whole line with my 6-wt Aetos, so maybe a goal of doing the same with the short light fiberglass is unrealistic. Not that I need to, in the little stream 20 feet is probably be as long as it needs to go.
silver creek
Well-known member
Second question. Were you double hauling?
ts47
Well-known member
I may not know what I’m talking about. Please take this with a grain of salt... Why would you want to cast a soft action, 6 foot, 3wt fiberglass fly rod out to 40 feet? In my waters, I can’t imagine ever needing to cast to 30 feet.
Edit: If you want a real answer, I would reach out to itchmesir. He’s very familiar with that line of rods.
Edit: If you want a real answer, I would reach out to itchmesir. He’s very familiar with that line of rods.
knotjoe
Well-known member
Take it to the creek and try the system when it's wet. No kidding here, some streamers are pretty draggy in the air when dry. Same for flylines through the rod guides, a bit of water to slick 'em and stuff starts flying quite nicely.
When in doubt or wondering about turnover energy, try a small beadhead which has some momentum and natural turnover of it's own. You'll see what the line and rod combo potential is in terms of distance this way.
Sounds like a fun rod, I own a 6' 2wt (carbon) married to a TFO BVK 0 reel and it's a near weightless sweetie for creek chubbing the local flows in low water season.
silver creek
Well-known member
I missed the part where the OP said he was casting a wooly bugger. I think the problem is NOT the 6 foot rod length but the 3 wt line. Unless the bugger is a micro bugger, a 3 wt line is not going to cast a regular sized WB well at all. So I think you ought to try casting a size 14 dry fly or nymph and not a wooly bugger.
My opinion is actually that a wet bugger will be harder to cast with that 3 wt short rod.
brownbass
Well-known member
I was cast a 7 1/2 foot medium action three weight rod on a really small creek using a double taper SA Trout. I can't remember the last time I had to cast thirty feet. On a creek, I seldom fish I uplined to a four weight RIO Gold because it is more open and the wind was a consideration. It made a world of difference in the distance I was able to cast and the control I had trying to lay a fly in a pocket across the creek 40-45 feet away.
Bill
Bill
zjory
Well-known member
Gave me a good laugh
ts47
Well-known member
Silver is right on the bugger. I think you’re going to find that That rod is designed for smaller flies and fishing from 0 to maybe 30 feet at the outside. It’s a really nice rod for this purpose too. The Cabelas Primes and CGRs are well thought of rods. You won’t find a nicer rod without spending a lot more money.
Thanks for all the tips. This is such a good forum because of the members!
Today I did a different experiment:
-The leader. I took another look and that leader was closer to 12 feet with a long 5x tippet. So I put on a short (about 6 feet) leader.
-The fly. Y'all are right, it was a huge fluffy woolly bugger (the only fly in my box without a hook, except for a 2/0 Clouser that would have been disastrous). So I tied on a tiny piece of red Christmas ribbon instead.
-The wind. A bit less windy today.
-The fiberglass action. I forced myself to be more patient with the backcast.
And voilà, no problem hitting the hula hoop at around 40 feet, and a max distance of maybe close to 50 (just practicing for about 10 minutes, as it is 35 degrees out). I think this rod will be perfect for the little stream that will mainly involve hitting pools at 20-30 feet.
By the way, I don't really need to cast for huge distances. But I figure if one is able to reliably make long casts with reasonable accuracy, that means the person has halfway decent casting skill.
Today I did a different experiment:
-The leader. I took another look and that leader was closer to 12 feet with a long 5x tippet. So I put on a short (about 6 feet) leader.
-The fly. Y'all are right, it was a huge fluffy woolly bugger (the only fly in my box without a hook, except for a 2/0 Clouser that would have been disastrous). So I tied on a tiny piece of red Christmas ribbon instead.
-The wind. A bit less windy today.
-The fiberglass action. I forced myself to be more patient with the backcast.
And voilà, no problem hitting the hula hoop at around 40 feet, and a max distance of maybe close to 50 (just practicing for about 10 minutes, as it is 35 degrees out). I think this rod will be perfect for the little stream that will mainly involve hitting pools at 20-30 feet.
By the way, I don't really need to cast for huge distances. But I figure if one is able to reliably make long casts with reasonable accuracy, that means the person has halfway decent casting skill.
dreihl9896
Well-known member
I too have been pondering this question, though I have no need to reach 40 feet in the waters I'm thinking of. Since they've been announced, I've been debating between the 6'6" #3 Dart and F Series for my tight water special. I'd like something significantly shorter than the 7'9" carbon fiber rod I had been fishing in these environments. However, some of the early impressions posted for the Scott F Series, list the 5'8" #3 F Series as the best #3 in the lineup. I hadn't really considered going that short, but if it is practical and fun to fish with, a 4 piece rod of that length would make a great little pack rod. I'm wondering from those with experience fishing super short fiber glass, what the practical fishing limitations are? Distance and mending are the obvious ones that come to mind, but they don't overly concern me as on these streams, I mainly work inside of 20 feet. Will they still roll cast when necessary? What other limitations do I need to consider when going this short?
I almost quoted Todd from page one but kept on reading although I agree with what he said fully.
For years I wanted a fly rod for small streams in the mountains of Central Pennsylvania. When I finally got the right rod it was a custom build from the Orvis rod shop and it was 6'6" long. It will cast a 3 or 4 but is best suited to a DT 3 line. I wanted an ultra slow action rod so my choice was bamboo, it is capable of what I call slow motion casting. Due to the slow line speeds you can achieve with the rod you can control the back cast as well as the forward cast. You can direct the line into small windows in the foliage both front and rear thus you can fish spots nearly impossible with a longer faster rod.
I think where we run into misunderstandings regarding short rods and what we call "small streams" is due in part to our being on line and not face to face in the same part of the country. What a guy in one area of this big country calls a small stream may be quite different from what I call a small stream.
In those mountains of PA. I doubt I ever made a cast longer than 30 feet on any small stream. There simply was no room to unfurl a 50 foot cast there. I did however witness some people fish upper Slate Run one day who approached the fishing by walking directly up the center of the stream and blasting long casts upstream. What I didn't see was anyone catch a fish doing that. I'm not saying that it can't be done but I would suggest you are going to catch one fish to the dozen of a careful angler working with a short rod and acting like he's fishing a small stream.
I did a lot of sneaking, a lot of looking and spotting feeding fish. I spent plenty of time moving into range slowly and staying hidden so my little small stream rod could do it's job. I've never tried to cast into a Hula Hoop or a tea cup but over time you can develop an uncanny talent for placing a fly directly where you are looking. The desire to make long casts has been around since I got my first fly rod and way before that. I went through it but I didn't have anyone to tell me or teach me any different. Today we have platforms like this forum where people can ask questions and others can provide answers and opinions. That is light years ahead of they way things were when I was young.
After saying all that my answer or opinion is to stick to using a short light rod for close encounters of the fishing kind. You can fish streamers with one and I do it with my cane rod. You fish going downstream and you use short flip style roll casts to place the fly to the opposite side then swing it across the currents. Once you get the hang of that you can become deadly accurate it is as well. I can comfortably fish feather wings up to size 6 and 4 using my little bamboo flea so I'd guess a fiberglass will do the same.
Remember, it's a short soft rod meant for close up presentations not for blasting line out to great lengths. Find the comfort zone for the outfit then practice on the small streams not in the yard. Oh, wearing camouflage is helpful and if you find a good creek don't tell anyone.
For years I wanted a fly rod for small streams in the mountains of Central Pennsylvania. When I finally got the right rod it was a custom build from the Orvis rod shop and it was 6'6" long. It will cast a 3 or 4 but is best suited to a DT 3 line. I wanted an ultra slow action rod so my choice was bamboo, it is capable of what I call slow motion casting. Due to the slow line speeds you can achieve with the rod you can control the back cast as well as the forward cast. You can direct the line into small windows in the foliage both front and rear thus you can fish spots nearly impossible with a longer faster rod.
I think where we run into misunderstandings regarding short rods and what we call "small streams" is due in part to our being on line and not face to face in the same part of the country. What a guy in one area of this big country calls a small stream may be quite different from what I call a small stream.
In those mountains of PA. I doubt I ever made a cast longer than 30 feet on any small stream. There simply was no room to unfurl a 50 foot cast there. I did however witness some people fish upper Slate Run one day who approached the fishing by walking directly up the center of the stream and blasting long casts upstream. What I didn't see was anyone catch a fish doing that. I'm not saying that it can't be done but I would suggest you are going to catch one fish to the dozen of a careful angler working with a short rod and acting like he's fishing a small stream.
I did a lot of sneaking, a lot of looking and spotting feeding fish. I spent plenty of time moving into range slowly and staying hidden so my little small stream rod could do it's job. I've never tried to cast into a Hula Hoop or a tea cup but over time you can develop an uncanny talent for placing a fly directly where you are looking. The desire to make long casts has been around since I got my first fly rod and way before that. I went through it but I didn't have anyone to tell me or teach me any different. Today we have platforms like this forum where people can ask questions and others can provide answers and opinions. That is light years ahead of they way things were when I was young.
After saying all that my answer or opinion is to stick to using a short light rod for close encounters of the fishing kind. You can fish streamers with one and I do it with my cane rod. You fish going downstream and you use short flip style roll casts to place the fly to the opposite side then swing it across the currents. Once you get the hang of that you can become deadly accurate it is as well. I can comfortably fish feather wings up to size 6 and 4 using my little bamboo flea so I'd guess a fiberglass will do the same.
Remember, it's a short soft rod meant for close up presentations not for blasting line out to great lengths. Find the comfort zone for the outfit then practice on the small streams not in the yard. Oh, wearing camouflage is helpful and if you find a good creek don't tell anyone.
ia_trouter
Senior Member
I really love my short Cabela's rods. The only thing they really got right in fly fishing IMO. I can't even imagine why I would choose to grab one for anything but little water. Especially if I was casting a bugger like the OP. A bad 9ft 5WT will outperform for longer casts.
sparsegraystubble
Well-known member
Long ago, in a galaxy far far away (okay 1971 in central PA) my main trout rod for Spring Creek, Big Fishing Creek, Penn’s Creek and others was a 6 foot 5 wt. Fenwick glass rod. I never had an issue with distance, wind or fly size within reason. It even roll cast reasonably well.
The only real drawback was limited ability to mend or get line off the water when fishing a weighted nymph. But I will say that I really don’t like fishing anything lighter than a 4 wt. And these days the shortest rod I own is 8 Feet long.
I’m sure I caught fish on casts of more than 60 feet with that old glass rod. Not that I had any business or real need to cast that far, but back then I only had hip boots instead of waders and that sometimes forced some stupid casts.
I think I sold that rod for $20 to help pay for my first venture into graphite. Now I have seen some of those rods on eBay for around $150. I think I bought mine for $35 new.
Don
The only real drawback was limited ability to mend or get line off the water when fishing a weighted nymph. But I will say that I really don’t like fishing anything lighter than a 4 wt. And these days the shortest rod I own is 8 Feet long.
I’m sure I caught fish on casts of more than 60 feet with that old glass rod. Not that I had any business or real need to cast that far, but back then I only had hip boots instead of waders and that sometimes forced some stupid casts.
I think I sold that rod for $20 to help pay for my first venture into graphite. Now I have seen some of those rods on eBay for around $150. I think I bought mine for $35 new.
Don
dreihl9896
Well-known member
Well I bit, and a 5’8” 3 wt showed up on my doorstep yesterday. Tomorrow I’ll be seeking out a twiggy stretch of water to experience what it’s able to do and to see first hand what limitations it has. All in the name of research, of course.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
dreihl9896
Well-known member
I had intended to follow up on my last post after a couple of outings with the new sub 6’ glass I added to my quiver (while subtracting from my quiver in other areas in order to finance this new toy), but though I’m having a ball, I still haven’t formulated a reel firm opinion on how practical such a rod is. In fact, after the first 30 minutes or so with it, I was quickly coming to the conclusion that it wasn’t practical at all. I was happy to let my fishing partner fish on ahead because it was less embarrassing to wildly flail away covering his sloppy seconds than to have a witness to said flailing. I bounced my fly off the back of my hat multiple times, roll casts were going nowhere, hook sets were missed, and I was convinced I had sold off a couple pretty decent, practical fishing tools to finance a novelty clown stick.
I think a big part of the issue though is simply that longer graphite rods had been enabling a certain amount of sloppiness in my game. If I hadn’t let my D loop properly form, or allowed it to straighten out behind me, there was enough length and power to send my rig in the right direction, more or less, though maybe not as artfully as when things are all lined up correctly. I often get lazy stripping in my slack, but longer rods have often been able to pick up enough of that slack to still move the hook enough to set it. Once I started concentrating on these, as well as getting a feel for the rods action, I started to feel better about things. After another trip out, I was feeling even better about my purchase.
I know I’ve read that glass is more forgiving than graphite, but I’m not sure that any rod below 6’ can be called forgiving. After putting a few hours in with this one though, I am to the point where it is fun to fish it, and it’s lack of forgiveness just might make me a better angler overall.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I think a big part of the issue though is simply that longer graphite rods had been enabling a certain amount of sloppiness in my game. If I hadn’t let my D loop properly form, or allowed it to straighten out behind me, there was enough length and power to send my rig in the right direction, more or less, though maybe not as artfully as when things are all lined up correctly. I often get lazy stripping in my slack, but longer rods have often been able to pick up enough of that slack to still move the hook enough to set it. Once I started concentrating on these, as well as getting a feel for the rods action, I started to feel better about things. After another trip out, I was feeling even better about my purchase.
I know I’ve read that glass is more forgiving than graphite, but I’m not sure that any rod below 6’ can be called forgiving. After putting a few hours in with this one though, I am to the point where it is fun to fish it, and it’s lack of forgiveness just might make me a better angler overall.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Last edited:
el jefe
Well-known member
Dreihl, glad to hear you are figuring out the rod, and coming to enjoy it. That is a short rod, but length aside, glass sure makes a fun rod when done right, and Scott does it right. I have two glass rods in my inventory at the moment, and when I sit there and daydream about fly fishing, it is with a glass rod in my hand.