Sloppy Tip on Fiberglass fly rods?

[foulhook3160]

Too be honest, I have little to none experience with fiberglass rods. So this problem I experienced may be due to inexperience and not due to rod design.

Went to the Smoky Mountains this past week and fished a small stream where most of the casts would be 10 to 15 feet, with a few over 20. I used an Orvis Superfine glass rod in a 7' 6" 4 weight (I know, great reviews) with a 4 weight DT line and a 7' leader. Although some of the casts were spot on, I would say 30 to 40 percent were off, just not as accurate as I would like. I would say that I was not nearly as accurate as I was with my graphite rods.

Is the lack of accuracy inherent in glass fly rods? Is it inherent in the Orvis Superfine glass rod? Is it a casting technique I need to learn? Thanks for your help.

 

[jayr]

I have that exact same rod. Mine is accurate as all get out. I also fish the Smokies on a regular basis.

What exact line do you have?

What exact leader are you using?

What fly(s) were you throwing? What size(s)?

 

[ddb]

Is that the only glass rod you use? If so, you may need to make sure to consistently slow down your stroke to get the rod loading the same each time.

Also a 7' leader seems to me prone to magnify any variations in your stroke. Have you tied the rod and line with a longer leader and had the same accuracy variations?

ddb

 

[trout trekker]

Is the lack of accuracy inherent in glass fly rods?

It probably feels like that's the case, if we're comparing it to one the modern fast action, high pixie dust* content rods. Wait until you get your first truly great grass rod....

*pixie dust: 3M powerlux aka sintrix.

Is it a casting technique I need to learn?

That's likely and a little unlearning too. Graphite offered a fast fix to getting started in F.F.. You don't see many shops pushing beginning anglers into glass rods. Glass can be a Zen kind of thing.

Dave

 

[planettrout]

This Winston Fiberglass 7 1/2', 5wt. "Stalker" was purchased in 1975 when the company was still in San Francisco. Everyone who fly fishes in my family started with this rod. Once one become familiar with the stroke, with a DT 4wt. line and 71/2' to 9' leader it will still place a dry fly right where it needs to be...

YouTube


PT/TB

 

[redietz]

I fish that exact rod (the Orvis Superfine 4 wt) and find it to be extremely accurate. Try slowing down your casting stroke.

 

[mike_r]

I too own and fish the SF 764 glass and because of its compliant tip, You can make the kind of short casts the OP describes. This is exactly why I bought the rod in the first place; small stream fishing! My suggestion is to simply spend some time yard casting the rod with the line/leader combo you intend to fish with and an appropriate sized yarn fly at targets laid out to simulate stream type distances. Slow down your stroke as many have suggested but don’t forget a brisk stop on the forward and back casts. Also a little squeeze of the handle on the forward stop will tighten up your loop. My SFG 764 will cast just a 12’ leader alone or out to 50’ with very controllable loops. It just takes time to get adjusted to the stroke it needs, but it will feel quite natural once you have allowed your mind and muscle memory to adopt to its cadence. It is actually a very “fast” tempo rod in the realm of fiberglass trout rods.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[foulhook3160]

Thanks for all the suggestions. Here is some more info on my set-up
7 foot 4x hand tied leader
SA mastery DH
14-12 dry flies with a 1-2 foot dropper with a size 18 midge.
I understand about slowing down the stroke, and really don't have a problem with the rod when you make a longer cast, say 20 to 30 feet.
BUT-on short casts, or when you do a roll cast I found it a bit lacking in accuracy, which I have not experienced with other rods. I will do some practicing and see how it goes.

 

[foulhook3160]

Planettrout-nice video, thanks for sharing. BTW the water in the video is like an ocean compared to some the small stream fishing I do.

 

[proheli]

In the end, a fly can only go where you’ve cast it.

That’s good news, because now it is just a matter of increasing understanding of what that noodle stick is doing. (I love my glass rod. I say noodle stick with love and affection. I want to say it is my favorite but I don’t have the courage yet.)

Glass can accentuate your casting errors. Your back stroke needs to come back perfectly straight, and this makes it easier for your front stroke to come through perfectly straight. With a stiff rod, when the line is not flying straight (180 back from or toward your target), it pulls the tip over - but only so far. The stiffness of the rod sort of self corrects your error. You get a line going a bit sideways with a soft rod and you pull the rod tip a half a foot out of its straight line path. Hell, the rod can be bending 4-5 feet down into the blank. You’ve got a whole sideways cast going at that moment. Who knows where the fly is going to go at this point.

 

[el jefe]

Glass rods will magnify your casting errors. The other side of that coin is that they will make you a better caster. You can't cheat with glass.

It's like golfers, who debate endlessly about cavity backs vs. blades. Graphite rods are over-sized cavity backs with lots of offset to compensate for slicing, a trampoline face to compensate for poor distance, and extreme perimeter weighting with tungsten-injected speed slots to compensate for every other kind of poor contact resulting from poor swing mechanics. And glass is the forged muscleback, the precision tool for use by artists, with instant, informative feedback and unparalleled feel when struck purely, kind of like the fish-on feel of glass rods.

 

[foulhook3160]

First thanks for all the help with casting tips. I can see where that can come into the equation. But maybe I was not clear, because most of my troubles with the glass rod is not loading the rod and making a 20 to 30 foot cast. My problems come into view when I need to make a 10-15 foot cast (or less), most of the time with vegetation over-head. A cast that drops into a basketball sized area and misses the numerous obstacles that can make up a small Smoky Mountain stream. The Orvis Superfine would do it, but not with the consistency of my graphite rods.

 

[von behr]

I would practice with that rod until you find the sweet spot. It is one of my favorite rods, but I do have to adjust my stroke when switching from a stiffer graphite rod. Orvis really created something special with their Superfine Glass rods.

 

[ia_trouter]

Keep practicing and perhaps experiment with a different line if the problem continues. I have a cheap Cabela's CGR and it casts accurately at appropriate ranges. Except the first few minutes of every trip always include a few blown up casts. The cause is always the same. Once I make a conscious effort to slow waaay down all is well for the rest of the day. There is no getting around it, you have to let a glass rod fully load for a good result. It's challenging to switch back and forth from graphite to glass. For me anyway.

 

[mka]

I would suggest trying a couple of different lines...a WF4F line. The Rio Gold works great for me on my SFG whether I’m hitting a small pocket close in or 25’ out. Unless your rod is damaged, I’m confident it’s not the stick’s fault...the s-glass on your SFG is superb taking a back seat to no glass rod.

It’s difficult to diagnose casting challenges on a forum...probably best to seek out a local pro (who likes glass) to check out your equipment and observe your casting techniques.

 

[Rip Tide]

I have in the neighborhood of 15 glass rods that I might use on a given day.
They're all different but one common truth is that if you over-power your cast it's not going to be accurate.

My slowest glass rod is a Lamiglass 4wt
Even though I've had that rod for 47 years it still takes me a good 10 minutes to adjust my stroke to the proper speed. But once I relax my cast, that slow action is most enjoyable
I think that you'll find that it's that simple.

 

[desmobob]

Glass rods will magnify your casting errors. The other side of that coin is that they will make you a better caster. You can't cheat with glass.

I feel the same way. I remember first trying a glass rod, watching all the wiggles and waves in my loops, and thinking the rod was pretty lame and the tip was all over the place. Then I realized it was me putting all the wiggles and waves into the cast. I made a conscious effort to slow and smooth my casting stroke and I fell in love with fiberglass.

I have that same Orvis 'glass rod and really enjoy it.

 

[trev]

posted in wrong thread/delete

 

[justahack]

I started out fly fishing with glass rods. Only recently have gotten back into fishing them, pretty regularly now. Even so, like other posters have commented, it still takes me a few ticks to get down to speed every time I do. I'll echo the other comments about glass magnifying casting errors and providing an opportunity to improve for those willing to play around and experiment. But the OP asked about short range needs, like 10-15 feet in tight overgrown quarters. I love bow and arrow casts for those situations. A 7.5' rod is already much of the way to where I want the fly in those cases, and hand-loading those little rods is a lot of fun. Almost as much fun as landing a fish on them.

foulhook3160, did you get any takers last week?

 

[Unknownflyman]

I find that my mood has the most to do with whether I`m going to fish glass on any given day, If I`m in a hard fishing fast mood, I`ll either cast modern glass or fish graphite. If I relax and slow down and really focus on that and then just fish after I hit that groove its magic with a glass rod.

I don't like some glass rods I just don't really bond with them and I do still like a good taper without too soft of a tip.