Rod Epoxy Effected by Rain...????

FrankB2

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The two Sage rods I fish the most get milky epoxy spots after being hit by rain:


I know epoxy is susceptible to UV rays and breakdown, and was wondering if this is what's happening. The spots go away quickly once the rod drys off. I called Sage, and they said they'd re-wrap the rods if I wanted, but I use these suckers.
 

FrankB2

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Those spots are on the epoxy that they run over the label. It's also on the epoxy that covers the wraps, but I didn't take a pic of that. The epoxy doesn't get soft enough to dig a thumb nail into, so I told the Sage rep that I'd wait until/if it ever became more than a temporary cosmetic problem.
 

sweetandsalt

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As you know, Frank, epoxy (if that is the resin Sage is using) is a 2 part mix that can be tempermental to the precise amount of hardner used. Your image (OK, it is out of focus) looks like moisture UNDER the finish. This can not be a good thing. It may well be your rod needs to be factory stripped and re-wrapped. I suggest re-photographing this penomina in good light on several sections of the rod and contacting Sage again. You may need to use an older rod for a little while while this is resolved correctly. Rods are supposed to be waterproof (please forgive me for being a little tounge in cheek). Perhaps Sage will provide a loaner rod while yours is in for service? (more humor).
 

FrankB2

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Hi S&S, I took that picture with my cell phone while waiting for the rain to stop. The moisture looks like it's under the finish to me as well, but this only happens when it rains, and that's the part I don't get. I can dunk a rod, and not get that milkiness, but a few rain drops is another story. I'll email the picnto Sage, and see what they say. Maybe they can send out a loaner ONE. :D
 

Rip Tide

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:rain:

Whoa... it's the acid (rain) man

You know what John Lennon would say..
“I am the eggman! They are the eggmen! I am the Walrus, goo goo g'joob!”
 

FrankB2

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Hi Rip,
That thought crossed my mind, and it's why I don't catch rain drops on my tongue. :eek: I wipe down my rods, reels, and lines with a wet cloth after each trip (fishing trip :D ), and only rain makes the milky spots seen in the picture.
 

williamhj

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Does it happen in when it's humid and raining but the rod is kept out of the rain? I also wonder if there was some moisture on the decal and first layer of finish that was trapped under the second layer.
 

FrankB2

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It only happens when the rain actually hits the rod, and effects the epoxied areas along the length of the rod. Actually, we were fishing last Spring, and it began to drizzle. I noticed the milky spots after about five minutes, but only on the top of the rod. There have been times when I've laid the rods in an inch or two of water for a pic, and this doesn't happen. I could get scientific, and put a few sections in a tub of water.....
 

burk48237

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As you know, Frank, epoxy (if that is the resin Sage is using) is a 2 part mix that can be tempermental to the precise amount of hardner used. Your image (OK, it is out of focus) looks like moisture UNDER the finish. This can not be a good thing. It may well be your rod needs to be factory stripped and re-wrapped. I suggest re-photographing this penomina in good light on several sections of the rod and contacting Sage again. You may need to use an older rod for a little while while this is resolved correctly. Rods are supposed to be waterproof (please forgive me for being a little tounge in cheek). Perhaps Sage will provide a loaner rod while yours is in for service? (more humor).
I agree. I use to build rods and there are three issues with epoxy. One, it wasn't mixed correctly and it doesn't work as advertised, either never setting (not enough resin) or losing flexibility (not enough hardener). The never setting issue is rare on commercial rods.

Two, it isn't applied evenly in multiple light coats after the color preservative has fully dried. If it's applied in one big coat, (common on mass produced rods) it may not impregnate the threads fully and moisture can get under the epoxy. This shouldn't happen on a low production fly rod like a Sage and in there defense its rare.

Three, It doesn't dry evenly or consistently. If the finish is really thick and allowed to dry without rotating in a dust free dryer room it can lump or get dabri in it (dust particles) which contaminate it. Its a bit like drying the paint job on a car or musical instrument.

One of the things that adds a lot to the cost of Hardys SW Sintrex rods (Proaxis) is that they have a base thread wrap under each guide to protect the blank. And all of those wraps have to be completely finished and dried before the guides are wrapped. The blanks are otherwise so flexible that under stress without the guide wrap the guide feet were puncturing and blowing up the blanks during testing.
 

theboz

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Frank that is WHACKED! Rain making spots on your rod! Dude make them replace its a FLY ROD not a piece of paper. If it doesn't happen to $20 rods it definitely should not be happening to $600 rods.I don't care how strong the acid rain is out of Philly! Get a new one! Not a refinish a New One!

---------- Post added at 09:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:06 PM ----------

If the paint don't peel on my Ford Explorer it shouldn't peel on my Jaguar!
 
L

Liphookedau

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Frank,something is out of whack,as stated seems like problems with the Epoxy,after all Rip might be right,it's something you want to get sorted out quickly.
Good Luck.
Brian
 

burk48237

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One other note in fairness to Sage. This problem can also arise when you store a rod wet. When you get home from a trip don't leave a wet rod in a wet rod bag in a wet rod tube. This could cause the problem your alluding too. I've seen cork mildew and fine nickel sliver reel seat components tarnish after only about a week of wet storage. Do yourself a favor and wipe off your rods with a soft cloth dry and let rod bags dry a tubes air out before any storage.
 

ak allen

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Frank that is WHACKED! Rain making spots on your rod! Dude make them replace its a FLY ROD not a piece of paper. If it doesn't happen to $20 rods it definitely should not be happening to $600 rods.I don't care how strong the acid rain is out of Philly! Get a new one! Not a refinish a New One!

---------- Post added at 09:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:06 PM ----------

If the paint don't peel on my Ford Explorer it shouldn't peel on my Jaguar!
Agreed, they should replace it! I work hard for my money, and if I buy a product it should work as advertised. Water spots on a fly rod.... that dog just ain't gonna hunt!
 

FrankB2

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One other note in fairness to Sage. This problem can also arise when you store a rod wet. When you get home from a trip don't leave a wet rod in a wet rod bag in a wet rod tube. This could cause the problem your alluding too. I've seen cork mildew and fine nickel sliver reel seat components tarnish after only about a week of wet storage. Do yourself a favor and wipe off your rods with a soft cloth dry and let rod bags dry a tubes air out before any storage.
Good point, but I'm meticulous about allowing rods to dry outside of a tube or bag overnight. I wipe them down after the end of a fishing trip before putting temporarily transporting them in a tube to get them home. The bags are left to hang in case they gathered any moisture, and the caps are left of tubes until the next morning. I have an OCD thing when it comes to gear. :D

I am going to get scientific. I'm going to lay a wet towel over the section shown in the picture, and see what happens. If it doesn't get milky, I'll add a bit of lemon juice to a towel, and see what that does.
 

Frank Whiton

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Hi FrankB2,

I would not add the lemon juice. If you do something to the finish beside this problem then you might void the warranty. I would leave it up to Sage to figure out.

Acid rain sounds like a good reason.

Frank
 

rapid eddy

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I'll be watching closely for the outcome of this one. Tell Sage that Eddy has some $20 rods that dont do that but then again we have clear rivers and streams and no acid rain here in Missouri.
Eddy
 
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