On the idea that using UL fly rods demonstrates "expertise"

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turbineblade

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Some recent threads got me to thinking about this. I think there's an idea that a person using a 2-3 weight on a stream where others might typically use a 4-6 weight have somehow "figured things out" and are more skilled than these other people. Oddly, these rods didn't exist until very recently which would suggest that all old-time fly rodders just don't have a clue compared to the young idiots on the stream packing light rods.

I think some of it is trout-baggery, and a lack of experience fishing in conditions where 2-3 weights are literally useless junk....like fishing a massive, open river like the Potomac where winds and long casts are "normal" and not "rare". Trying to cast a 2-3 weight many days on the Potomac will make you look like you don't know how to cast to onlookers...plain and simple.

Fly line mass is useful and shouldn't be minimized just for the sake of someone thinking that 5 and 6-weights are "training wheels" for beginners or some other nonsense. :rolleyes:
 

comeonavs

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You know however to each their own.

If someone wants to flail away with a 1WT on the Potomac, that is their issue. Conversely if someone wants to use 10' 6wt on Glacier Creek in Rocky Mt Park with me, that is their choice.

I have a 1wt and many 3wts, I don't think it shows "expertise".

Many a day I pull in to the trailhead, get out of the truck and hear the Aspen leaves rustling and think "looks like the 1wt stays in the truck today"
 

spm

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Fly line mass is useful and shouldn't be minimized just for the sake of someone thinking that 5 and 6-weights are "training wheels" for beginners or some other nonsense. :rolleyes:
Agreed. All my fly rods are 5 and 6wt and I fish small streams. I don't feel over equipped at all. Having said that, I have just ordered a 3wt to see what the lightweight rods are all about. We'll see.

s.
 

randyflycaster

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I will not use ultra light rods. Landing a fish with these rods will result in a much longer fight - which is what some anglers want - but also increased mortality rates. I want any fish I catch to survive.

Randy
 

r reese

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I want some one to tell me why it takes longer to land a fish on a 2or 3 wt than a 5 6 or 7? 5 6 or 7 x tippet all break at the same point and I can turn a fih with a short light rod just fine!!!
 

petee

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I agree with randyflycaster. Just like using the right club in golf, use the right rod for the water you are fishing. Sure a UL is fine if you are fishing water with small fish. But, is it really worth it to say you caught an 18" fish on a 2 wt.? 10:1 the fight was too long and chances are the fish went belly up. And no just because they swim off doesn't mean they survived.

For the sake of this topic I am assuming we are talking trout. They seem to be the whimps of the fish world. A bass or panfish can be a different story, but there is no need to overwork a fish just to satisfy an ego.

Pete
 
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turbineblade

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For the record, I disagree (with respect) that light rods lengthen the fighting of fish excessively, or even at all really. That's never been a problem to me and is not a reason I would use to avoid using light rods. Plus, many if not most fisherman don't use the rod properly when fighting fish and they lengthen the fight regardless of what rod they're using.

I just object to the idea that using a 5-weight is "overkill" or is a stepping stone that an angler passes on the way to 1-2 weight rods.

To me, it's really all about fly line mass --that's where the utility comes from.

Heavier lines provide the angler with very stable casting loops, even in wind and with larger flies than light lines do...and in my opinion often reduce effort required and certainly permit casting to more fish in those conditions.
 

jgentile

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Size of water fishing
Size of patterns presenting
Style of patterns and rigging
Amount of wind facing.

That determines for me which rod. I don't nymph with my 3wt. I don't fish streamers with my 3wt. on waters I regularly fish. I personally would not fish the potomac (upper or lower) with UL.

I will however catch, turn, net and release an 18" trout as quickly as anyone here with my 3wt.

Didn't we already beat this dead horse?
 

mikel

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Using a fly rod at all indicates a snobbishness most people find unsavory. Let's all just talk about that.
 
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turbineblade

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I think that's a tired camel. :)

---------- Post added at 10:54 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:11 AM ----------

If Ard wants to lock this one, I'm cool with it.

Otherwise, I say we keep beating the tired camel. :eek:
 

Ard

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Heavier lines provide the angler with very stable casting loops, even in wind and with larger flies than light lines do...and in my opinion often reduce effort required and certainly permit casting to more fish in those conditions.
This is where I have arrived with Spey (2 handed) rods. While I see 5 & 6 weight rods and some even lighter springing up around the market and rivers like weeds in my flower beds............ I continue to fish heavy lined rods for all species. I absolutely enjoy catching a trout on my rods even a 16" trout. I'm not in this to "fight a fish" I'm out to catch them. If I wanted a fight I would remember for the rest of my life I could get one in any saloon around here I'm sure :D

Now before my friends who love their light rods get worked up and think I've turned on them let me qualify what I mean. I fish with my Orvis 3 weight bamboo rod every fall for rainbow trout but I do that in just 2 streams where the rod is a good fit. Every no & then I end up with a silver salmon on the streamer that weighs 5 - 7 pounds and things get a little dicey but I manage to handle the salmon and haven't had to break one off yet. I fish 10 pound leader even on that light rod because not all the trout are 10 - 14" there are always a few surprises.

I have some five weights from 6'3" to 7'6" that I use for trout also and even on medium size streams I sometimes get out sized by a rainbow just too wild to be quickly handled with a short light rod. Most of the fish are not too big and a 5 weight is fine but I now have an 11'6" 7 weight Hardy Swift for some smaller creeks where I've been shamed by a fish in the past.

Now, what I said about the light 2 hand rods; my heavy lines just work better for me. I'm talking 875 grain lines with 65' heads and another 65' of shooting line behind the belly. For slinging an Intruder or a big tube........... or one of those big tasty Sculpins across a river nothing says howdy like a big fat heavy bellied line. Think of these like a giant Skagit head. It's the same concept just bigger and when you do hook a fish, be it an 18" rainbow or a 25 pound king salmon you are ready because the heavy line is attached to a stout rod.

Catching a fish is exciting. Those first few seconds when the fish makes frenzied moves brought on by the confusion of being hooked are crucial to whether you will land the fish and whether you'll do so quickly. Those few seconds I believe are where and when the heavy rods pay out big time. Last July I hooked one of the biggest rainbows ever. I was using my 1968 Orvis Full Flex fiberglass rod, 6'6" 5 weight. I love that rod, I love the CFO IV that I use with it. However when that rainbow grabbed the Sculpin and rushed back toward the root jam and then dove, I couldn't stop it. It ended up tangled in about 6 feet of water where I could see it and it continued to go nuts until it broke the 10 pound Ultra Green leader and escaped.

That was a really nice fish, I don't know how big and never will but I don't think I've caught one like that yet. My rod was way too soft and a disc drag would have been good. Yeah, I was palming the reel but I gave out too much line and I didn't notice the submerged tree until the fish swam under it...........

I'm more prone to use heavy rods and lines unless I get on my little home creeks in late September & October for what should be little trout :)

Ard
 

shifty242

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Agreed.

<yawn>


Size of water fishing
Size of patterns presenting
Style of patterns and rigging
Amount of wind facing.

That determines for me which rod. I don't nymph with my 3wt. I don't fish streamers with my 3wt. on waters I regularly fish. I personally would not fish the potomac (upper or lower) with UL.

I will however catch, turn, net and release an 18" trout as quickly as anyone here with my 3wt.

Didn't we already beat this dead horse?
 

Ard

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I betcha that 3wt. got a lot of work when you lived in PA.
Oh yes indeed, it was my Slate Run rod as well as some other unmentioned spots. I had it made with 3 tips so I wouldn't ever be without its company. Here one must be careful where you put it to use. I fish streamers with every rod I own and that's how I sometimes end up into a salmon with the Flea....

Down East I used it for dry fly and streamers, it'll pitch a dry to a precise spot like a Fed X delivery :)
 

bear 007

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Alright, lets say your on the Potomac at first light,(I've never fished it)there's light fog and drizzle in the air(no wind), you see pods of fish rising to a caddis hatch all along the shore, what are you going to reach for, do you want those long distance casts or are you going to sneak up on those pods with your 3wt and drop an elk hair ever so gently in front, I know what I would do.

Having never fished the Potomac I don't know if this is even possible, I do know its quite common on the river up here.
 
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