Filling the 9 Weight Slot

[steveid]

I haven’t been around much the past few months. I’ve been off doing other things, and working. Exactly one year ago I was in Belize getting my first taste of the flats, and my lunar calendar is reminding me of that. I’ve got the itch to get on the salt, and I’ve got it bad. Thankfully work has me in Florida this week and I will get a day to target reds at the end of the trip.

I’ve got an opening at 9 weight that I absolutely must fill. I won’t have it for this trip, but I want this rod as my primary Permit stick.

Anybody here have experience with a Sage Igniter or Salt HD 9 weight? I’m leaning about 90-10 towards the Igniter, but love polling the audience here for opinions. I have an Igniter 7 and a Salt HD 10, and I like both. But, they are a bit far apart to really compare head to head. I spoke with a Sage ambassador whose opinion I’ve always valued and has been great for recommendations prior, and he all but pointed me at the Igniter.

My other question is regarding lines. Be recommended Flats Pro for both rods, but also spoke highly of Rio Permit and it’s unique taper. Anybody here have a preference between the two, or significant experience with Permit? I’m using Flats Pro in 3 different weights right now, and thought about Permit as a change of pace. But, Flats Pro was the line of choice for my guy on 9 weights.

Whichever stick I get will be getting a Hatch Finatic Gen 2. I really like the Hatch reels, and their employees are cool.

Hope all is well with everyone here. It feels good to be spending some time back on the site. I’m ready to get winter out of the way and get some quality time spent on the water.

 

[osseous]

How's your casting? Be honest! And cast the X, and the Meridian and Air Salt- along with the two rods you listed! Best time to be choosing a new salt water stick in history. Some awesome rods out there now.

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[sweetandsalt]

I've been happily fishing RIO Permit on my SALT#9. Here is the deal though, Permit like newer Flats Pro is a full size heavy...just what SALT wants but not Igniter. Fresh water Igniter likes Gold and the Igniter #7 I enjoyed testing at Edison likes RIO DC Bonefish...too heavy Permit or Flats Pro would overload it. Now the technology of the new Direct Core lines is terrific; I intend to replace my Permit with FP on SALT. I've also cast excellent X#8 with both lines and it was awful with FP and lovely with Bonefish...even though the Sage man I cast with had recommended the FP. For counterpointt and fine tuning I have been fishing SA Amplitude Bonefish (210 gr.) on my true weight preferring Stickman T8 and prior to fishing it in Florida next month am going to replace the Amplitude with RIO Flats Pro...with a 210 gr. 7-weight.

So, your S HD#10 with FP is a defacto 11-weight and your Igniter #7 is what it says and one of the absolute best too with RIO Bonefish. Adding a fine #9 makes total sense and the candidates I would recommend are (envelop please); Loomis Asquith/NRX, Igniter, T&T Exocett, Douglas SKY and include for comparison Winston's new AIR Salt and Scott's Meridian.

 

[bonefish41]

Permit rod; where and how; skiff or wading? My latest tech rod is 11wt Method but my Permit sticks are TCX 9 and 10 and I have not played with any of the modern latest tech fly me to Mars technology sticks...my old sticks are like my old 28 Superposed, 16 Model 12 Skeet, 12 Perazzi Field. IMHO if I was to get a new dedicated 9wt Permit stick for all seasons, all conditions...it would be a 9wt Loom CC GLX. I don't fish Loom 'cause I like to roll my own blanks.

 

[steveid]

How's your casting? Be honest! And cast the X, and the Meridian and Air Salt- along with the two rods you listed! Best time to be choosing a new salt water stick in history. Some awesome rods out there now.

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Casting is getting better and better, and I’m looking for more advanced instruction. Ultimately, time on the water advances me far more quickly than time on the lawn. Lots of guys can throw a great line on the lawn when there isn’t a moving target creating a sense of urgency, but it’s different when the Belizian guide is yelling “11 O’CLOCK! DROP IT! DROP IT! DROP IT!”

I have an X 896 that I like, but I don’t look at the X series as Permit rods. I’ve never stood on a calm Permit flat, and instant power is a must in my next rod.

Scott Meridian would probably be a fine rod, but it’s been out a while and I would expect it may get an upgrade soon. I also don’t love the unsanded blanks on Scott rods. It’s a great way to reduce manufacturing costs (which may or may not get passed on to the consumer), but it makes them look unfinished to me.

Winston rods haven’t drawn me in yet. I’ll cast one if given the opportunity. Orvis H3 does interest me. I cast the 9 weight and liked it, but I was unsure what line it had on it. Cast the 8 weight a week later and thought it was garbage, but again the salesman didn’t know what line was on it.

 

[steveid]

I've been happily fishing RIO Permit on my SALT#9. Here is the deal though, Permit like newer Flats Pro is a full size heavy...just what SALT wants but not Igniter. Fresh water Igniter likes Gold and the Igniter #7 I enjoyed testing at Edison likes RIO DC Bonefish...too heavy Permit or Flats Pro would overload it. Now the technology of the new Direct Core lines is terrific; I intend to replace my Permit with FP on SALT. I've also cast excellent X#8 with both lines and it was awful with FP and lovely with Bonefish...even though the Sage man I cast with had recommended the FP. For counterpointt and fine tuning I have been fishing SA Amplitude Bonefish (210 gr.) on my true weight preferring Stickman T8 and prior to fishing it in Florida next month am going to replace the Amplitude with RIO Flats Pro...with a 210 gr. 7-weight.

So, your S HD#10 with FP is a defacto 11-weight and your Igniter #7 is what it says and one of the absolute best too with RIO Bonefish. Adding a fine #9 makes total sense and the candidates I would recommend are (envelop please); Loomis Asquith/NRX, Igniter, T&T Exocett, Douglas SKY and include for comparison Winston's new AIR Salt and Scott's Meridian.

Richard Post was very high on Flats Pro paired with the Igniter #9 in his rod series review. He also states elsewhere that he loves the taper of Rio Permit. May have to try both if I go with the Igniter. I don’t get the feeling that it would overload the Igniter. I have Flats Pro 7 and 8 and I will try them on my Igniter 7, but ultimately I plan to fish that rod with DC Bonefish 7.

 

[steveid]

Permit rod; where and how; skiff or wading? My latest tech rod is 11wt Method but my Permit sticks are TCX 9 and 10 and I have not played with any of the modern latest tech fly me to Mars technology sticks...my old sticks are like my old 28 Superposed, 16 Model 12 Skeet, 12 Perazzi Field. IMHO if I was to get a new dedicated 9wt Permit stick for all seasons, all conditions...it would be a 9wt Loom CC GLX. I don't fish Loom 'cause I like to roll my own blanks.

We have similar taste in shotguns... although I primarily use Beretta’s for both wing and clays.

I don’t have a finalized destination at this point. I’m sure Belize will happen again. Scorpion Atoll is one I would love to do, but it’s likely this rod would end up in Belize, CXI or fishing for other species before I get a crack at Scorpion.

 

[willyf]

Scott Meridian would probably be a fine rod, but it’s been out a while and I would expect it may get an upgrade soon. I also don’t love the unsanded blanks on Scott rods. It’s a great way to reduce manufacturing costs (which may or may not get passed on to the consumer), but it makes them look unfinished to me.

Scott seems to be on a slightly slower upgrade cycle--and they seem to do one rod line a year. They released the Radian in 2013 and haven't announced a replacement yet. The Meridian was released in 2015, so I'm guessing the line has at least 2.5 more years. I love the unsanded look. I fish the 908 Meridian a ton, and love it. My 9-weight is an Orvis Helios, though I just snagged a used once Douglas Sky 9 for $300, and I should get to give it a try this week in Biscayne Bay.

As for lines, I really like the SA Grand Slam for throwing heavy flies in heavy wind. The SA Bonefish couldn't hold up to the Aruba winds with the heavy flies I was throwing, but the Grand Slam had no problem. I might go for the smooth version, though I haven't fished it. The texture on the Amplitude tore up my hands pretty badly.

 

[bonefish41]

W: "...and I should get to give it a try this week in Biscayne Bay." Weather looks good this week Biscayne...wed-friday under 10 wind swinging south...great time for big fish...quick shots on darker bottoms but the opportunity for big bonefish and permit. It's a home run place but lots of foul balls and strike out for the fly rod...if perchance your guide sand balls or chums cut shrimp over a white spot don't eschew...you still have to make an accurate cast and fish the fly. The fish of Biscayne will show themselves once maybe twice but that's it then you get the fly to the fish where you think it moved/moving and if you see a school moving with nervous/wake water for a time and your guide says nothing don't cast but ask is that a school of mullet...Biscayne may not have the ambiance of Atolls but it has big fish...hard to catch on a fly rod

 

[dynaflow]

Permit rod; where and how; skiff or wading? My latest tech rod is 11wt Method but my Permit sticks are TCX 9 and 10 and I have not played with any of the modern latest tech fly me to Mars technology sticks...my old sticks are like my old 28 Superposed, 16 Model 12 Skeet, 12 Perazzi Field. IMHO if I was to get a new dedicated 9wt Permit stick for all seasons, all conditions...it would be a 9wt Loom CC GLX. I don't fish Loom 'cause I like to roll my own blanks.

While of course they'll do the job,rods have come some distance since the Loomis CC GLX and we're spoiled for choice really,with the best rods already mentioned.The Igniter is a classier Method and marries well with any of the lines discussed(Rio Permit,DirectCore Bonefish,S.A.Amplitude).Folks recommend the DirectCore Flats Pro because it's a line weight up which can be handy in the wind.Scott's Meridian is a winner in any weight and hasn't aged a day since its inception,and I'd choose a Salt HD over the original version as I reckon it's the rod they meant to make in the first place,but it's the stiffest of this company along with the Method.

 

[willyf]

W: "...and I should get to give it a try this week in Biscayne Bay." Weather looks good this week Biscayne...wed-friday under 10 wind swinging south...great time for big fish...quick shots on darker bottoms but the opportunity for big bonefish and permit. It's a home run place but lots of foul balls and strike out for the fly rod...if perchance your guide sand balls or chums cut shrimp over a white spot don't eschew...you still have to make an accurate cast and fish the fly. The fish of Biscayne will show themselves once maybe twice but that's it then you get the fly to the fish where you think it moved/moving and if you see a school moving with nervous/wake water for a time and your guide says nothing don't cast but ask is that a school of mullet...Biscayne may not have the ambiance of Atolls but it has big fish...hard to catch on a fly rod

Oh I hit it last year. True fish of a lifetime. I was making perfect shots at fish and getting no love (some bad ones too). But I was fishing well with little to show for it. It was blowing pretty hard and Carl Ball, the guide, saw a huge mud way upwind from us. He poled all the way there and finally told me to cast as far as I could. Just as I was making my final forward cast, the fish popped up much closer. He told me to drop the cast but I was way over the top of the school. I just waited and let the fly sink—when I took my first strip, there was a fish on. The fight was a little over five minutes and not all that indicative of what was about to end up in the net.

A 13 lb (weighed in the net on a boga) and 28.5 inches to the fork (32 total) giant of a bonefish. Sheer luck on my part and a lot of hard work on Carl’s. I obviously can’t hope for a repeat, but I think we’re going to have a very good two days (especially bc my Dad will be my fishing partner) if that forecast holds.

He’s had a couple Grand Slams this week on spinning gear, so maybe that’s in the cards?

I usually fish an 8 for bones, but my line got messed up and this fish was caught on the Helios 909 with a Rio bonefish line, I think. Always nice to have good backup gear. This trip will decide if the Helios remains my top 9 or if the Sky pushes it down to backup duty. The Meridian 8 is still my top choice for most flats situations.

 

[osseous]

I would recommend taking the Igniter and the Salt HD out with the standard and one size heavy lines from the company you favor- Rio or Sci Anglers. Throw to a target at various distances with each, and try to determine which combo allows you to do it with the least amount of effort, and the greatest consistency. The right combo will probably reveal itself- and from what you've said, you favor Sage. If you're gonna drop this kind of coin on a rod, buy the one that blows your skirt up!~

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[WNCtroutstalker]

I’ve never stood on a calm Permit flat, and instant power is a must in my next rod.

I've had one saltwater outing in my life and so I'm far from an expert, but I needed a 9 wt for a recent trip and after casting a bunch of rods I settled on a NRX. I was thrilled with how it performed on the trip, very powerful yet smooth and balanced. It sounds like you're a Sage guy, but if you are open to other brands I'd suggest casting a NRX. Certainly not the "latest and greatest", but if it's not broke.... Good luck in your search.

 

[steveid]

Picked up the Igniter last week. Trying to decide on a reel for it. Leaning towards a Hatch 7+ right now. I have both the 7+ and the 9+ From Hatch, and I imagine the 7 will be a bit better match.

I spoke with Richard Post at Telluride Angler about 9 weights for a good 20 minutes. Good guy who loves talking rods. He did a good
job of not leaning too hard at any one rod, but his tone changed when talking about the Igniter. It wasn’t a big surprise, his rod by Rod Igniter review spoke highly of the 9 weight, but I still wanted to hear it from the horse’s mouth and apart from an recency bias he may have had when writing the article after the trade show.

I’m going to pair it with Rio Flats Pro, a like I have in 7 and 8 weight and casts extremely well on my Igniter 7 weight. I was tempted to go with Rio Permit, but Richard has a very high opinion of Flats Pro paired with this #9, and of it performs like it does on my 7 weight, I’ll be in business.

Now, to get on the water... There’s a possible trip in Holbox, or something on the Flats in Cancun in September. This would be an excellent rod for the juvenile tarpon in Holbox. We will be in Cancun for a wedding. I’m trying to talk the wife into flying to Belize from there so that I can get after some Permit.

Work has me busy for a couple weeks, but I’ll try to give a report once I have cast this rod a bit.

 

[steveid]

Picked up the Igniter last week. Trying to decide on a reel for it. Leaning towards a Hatch 7+ right now. I have both the 7+ and the 9+ From Hatch, and I imagine the 7 will be a bit better match.

I spoke with Richard Post at Telluride Angler about 9 weights for a good 20 minutes. Good guy who loves talking rods. He did a good
job of not leaning too hard at any one rod, but his tone changed when talking about the Igniter. It wasn’t a big surprise, his rod by Rod Igniter review spoke highly of the 9 weight, but I still wanted to hear it from the horse’s mouth and apart from an recency bias he may have had when writing the article after the trade show.

I’m going to pair it with Rio Flats Pro, a like I have in 7 and 8 weight and casts extremely well on my Igniter 7 weight. I was tempted to go with Rio Permit, but Richard has a very high opinion of Flats Pro paired with this #9, and of it performs like it does on my 7 weight, I’ll be in business.

Now, to get on the water... There’s a possible trip in Holbox, or something on the Flats in Cancun in September. This would be an excellent rod for the juvenile tarpon in Holbox. We will be in Cancun for a wedding. I’m trying to talk the wife into flying to Belize from there so that I can get after some Permit.

Work has me busy for a couple weeks, but I’ll try to give a report once I have cast this rod a bit.

 

[Ard]

I considered trying the Igniter in 15 foot for a 600 - 650 line but balked because I have an X rod 14 foot and really like it.

About reels; I bought the Spectrum Max in Squid Ink finish for the X rod but they make one to match the Igniter rods finish. The reels are a pleasure to use, they are light and have smooth drags which I've been able to test pretty well here. I like matched combos and the Spectrum Max is the nicest reel sage has offered yet IMO.

 

[brokeoff]

I know you already grabbed the Igniter, but I'll add my $.02 anyway.

I went looking for permit sticks about two years ago. Basically, I tried to find the consistently successful permit guys and see what they were using. What I found was that guys use tons of different rods. A couple down in the Keys that hold at two IFGA permit records use 909 Method and 909 Zephrus. Two rods that couldn't be more dissimilar. The guy who wrote A Passion for Permit prefers G Loomis Rods. Did anyone see Jeff Currier's MONSTER Bahamian permit on the 7 wt Winston? How about Jose Ucan boating four permit in the Del Brown with an Exocett. Or the countless anglers who prefer the Meridian. The guide I have used in the Keys, a person I regard very highly on this subject, uses Hardys and is thinking about grabbing some Helios.

I've finally settled on two rods after cycling through a bunch. The Method 909 and the Exocett 909. I feel more in control and better connected to a sz 2 merkin with the Exocett from about 30 - 50 ft. I feel more in control and better connected to a sz 2 clouser with the Method from about 50 - 70 ft.

 

[osseous]

I have a 9wt Igniter on the way as well- and chose the Flats Pro. I'll be pairing it with the CCF X2 8/10. It will hold about a mile of 40lb Hollow Ace backing. My largest permit was on an 8wt- 200 yds of 20 lb dacron and a 10 lb bonefish leader, and a sz 4 Clouser. I was fishing Bones at the time and took the shot. That fish took me down to about 3 turns of backing... and a giant lump in my throat. Taped 44" to the tip of the tail. Though I'll likely never see a fish like that in my lifetime, I damned sure won't ever run low on backing when fishing the salt.

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[steveid]

I've finally settled on two rods after cycling through a bunch. The Method 909 and the Exocett 909. I feel more in control and better connected to a sz 2 merkin with the Exocett from about 30 - 50 ft. I feel more in control and better connected to a sz 2 clouser with the Method from about 50 - 70 ft.

Probably the exact way more of us should assess rods. Now, to get the fish to get in proper range when you have the proper rod in your hand.

I suppose if faced with your scenario, my primary rod would be the one that wins out when the casting scenarios are flipped.

 

[steveid]

I have a 9wt Igniter on the way as well- and chose the Flats Pro. I'll be pairing it with the CCF X2 8/10. It will hold about a mile of 40lb Hollow Ace backing. My largest permit was on an 8wt- 200 yds of 20 lb dacron and a 10 lb bonefish leader, and a sz 4 Clouser. I was fishing Bones at the time and took the shot. That fish took me down to about 3 turns of backing... and a giant lump in my throat. Taped 44" to the tip of the tail. Though I'll likely never see a fish like that in my lifetime, I damned sure won't ever run low on backing when fishing the salt.

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I’m pretty set on the Hatch 7+, grey with translucent red paint fill, and might go with Power Pro braid. According to them, 100lb is the same diameter as 20lb Dacron. I don’t want to go any smaller than that. They also make it in a deep red color that will match the whole outfit.