Second post on this topic. I caught Tim Rajeff's casting demonstration at the NJ Fly Show last weekend. He used it as an intro to basic casting; then proceeded to effortlessly launch a fly over 100 ft at the indoor casting pool The truth is that in demonstrating the importance of wrist snap and a crisp finish at the end of the stroke, he picked up a fly line and cast it with his arms (no rod involved) about 50 ft. into a hula hoop floating in the pool. I was impressed; as were the other 50+ onlookers. If Steve is better than Tim, then he can't be that much better. Great casting and a great demonstration - absolutely effortless. I think he used an Echo2 7 wt. rod (chuckle).