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  1. #41
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Albuquerque, NM

    Default Re: Fast actioned rods and over weighted lines

    Quote Originally Posted by bevanwj View Post
    Having trouble casting that fast action fly rod? These may help...

    OK, I looked. That was a good one!

  2. #42
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Portland and Maupin, Oregon

    Default Re: Fast actioned rods and over weighted lines

    Quote Originally Posted by el jefe View Post
    OK, I looked. That was a good one!
    Nice, but I prefer Patagonia...
    Keep 'em wet!

  3. #43
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Scottsdale, AZ

    Default Re: Fast actioned rods and over weighted lines

    A few months ago I posed the question: How do you know if someone exclusively fishes dry flies? Answer: Don't worry, they will tell you.

    To that, I would like to add the corollary: How do you know if someone casts dry flies with a really stiff rod and a true weight line fly line, sixty feet into a gale force wind, and catches monster fish? Yup, the same answer as above.
    -Rick Allen

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  5. Default Re: Fast actioned rods and over weighted lines

    How To Choose the Right Fly Line Weight


    Let me begin by saying that rod manufacturers design rods for the average person to use under average conditions. So unfortunately, most fly fishermen use only one weight of line on their favorite rod.

    Written on the rod blank or handle is a code number which indicates the line that the rod manufacturer suggests is best for most customers; i.e., 6 line. To most fly anglers, this means that they should use nothing but a 6 weight line with this rod. But to get the full potential from different fishing situations, you may want to consider using several line sizes on your rod — perhaps varying as much as two line sizes from the one suggested on the rod.

    Manufacturers know your rod may be used in a host of fishing situations, but they can’t judge your casting style and fishing skills. So when they place a recommended line number on your rod, it is implied that it’s for average fishing conditions. First, understand that you’re not going to damage a fly rod using fly line a little lighter or heavier than is recommended. Certainly, at times, the rod will fish better if different line sizes are used.

    Match line weight to conditions
    Let me cite several examples of when you might want to use various line weights on the same rod for different fishing conditions you may encounter.

    First, if you fish a swift, tumbling mountain brook, you can use a rather short leader with a dry fly. A leader of 7-1/2 feet in length would probably do the best job. But if you fish for trout with the same outfit and dry fly on a calm spring creek, beaver pond or quiet lake, that short leader could prevent you from catching many fish. While many fishermen automatically know that on calmer water they have to use longer leaders, many of them don’t really probe any deeper into “why” they need a longer leader.

    It isn’t the leader’s length that’s so important. In calm water, what frightens the trout is the line falling to the surface. The longer the leader, the farther away from the fly is the splashdown of the line.

    But with a longer leader, the more difficult it is to cast and there is a reduction in accuracy. Thus, a 9-foot leader is more accurate and easier to turn over than a 15-footer. Considering this, plus the fact that the splashdown of the line is what is frightening the trout, there is a simple solution. Use a fly line one size lighter than the rod manufacturer recommends. Jim Green, who has designed fly rods for years and is a superb angler, mentioned to me more than three decades ago that he almost always used a line one size lighter when fishing dry flies where the trout were spooky or the water was calm. I tried it and have routinely followed his advice. So, for example, if you are using a six weight rod, you can drop down to a five weight line with no problem. In fact, in very delicate fishing conditions, I often drop down two sizes in line weights. There is a reason.

    Weight and speed need to vary
    Fly rods are designed to cast a particular weight of line — with a good bit of line speed. If you drop down a line size, you benefit in two ways. One, the line is going to alight on the water softer than a heavier line. Two, because it is not as heavy, it doesn’t develop as much line speed. A line traveling at high speed often comes to the water with a heavier impact than one that is moving slower. Even with a line two sizes lighter, you can still cast a dry fly or nymph far more distance than what is called for in delicate trout fishing situations. So you don’t hamper yourself at all by using a line lighter than the rod suggests. Best of all, you can now use a shorter leader, since impact on the surface has been lessened.

    There is a second situation where a lighter than normal line will help you if you are a fairly good caster. The wind is blowing and you need to reach out to a distant target. Many try to solve this common problem by using a line one size heavier. The usual thinking is that a heavier line allows them to throw more weight and, they hope, get more distance. Actually, going to a heavier line means that they complicate the problem.

    On a cast, the line unrolls toward the target in a loop form. The larger the loop, the more energy is thrown in a direction that is not at the target. When fishermen overload a fly rod with a line heavier than the manufacturer calls for, they cause the rod to flex more deeply, which creates larger loops on longer casts. Overloading the rod wastes casting energy by not directing it at the target.

    If you switch to a lighter line, you may not have enough weight outside the rod tip to cause the rod to load or flex properly — if you hold the normal amount of line outside the rod during casting. But if you extend this lighter line about 10 feet or a little more outside the rod than you normally would for this cast under calm conditions, you can cast a greater distance into the wind. By extending the additional amount of lighter line outside the rod, you cause it to flex as if you were false casting the normal length of the recommended line size.

    Since the rod is now flexing properly, it will deliver tight loops, but the lighter line is thinner. This means that there will be less air resistance encountered on the cast.

    If you are forced to cast a longer distance into the wind, switch to one size lighter line and extend a little more line outside the rod tip than you normally would. This means, of course, that you need to be able to handle a longer line during false casting. But the line that is lighter than the rod calls for will let you cast farther into the breeze.

    Heavier line is often necessary
    There are situations where using a line heavier than the rod calls for will also aid in casting and catching fish, such as when fishing small streams for trout. Where pools are short and casts are restricted in distance, a heavier line can be just the right answer. For example, on many brook trout streams, the pool may be only 10 or 15 feet long and you are forced to use a leader that is at least 7-1/2 feet long. That means that only a few feet of your fly line — the weight that loads or flexes the rod — is outside the rod tip. When fishing where distance is very short and only a few feet of fly line are outside the rod tip, it is important to switch to a line that is heavier. For example, if you were using a rod designed for a four-weight line and had to cast most of the time at targets less than 20 feet, placing a five- or even a six-weight line on the rod would let you load the rod, and casting would be much easier.

    This same principle applies when you are bass fishing in the southern swamps. Often, you are casting in small, winding creeks, or where there is a lot of brush immediately behind you. This also holds true when fishing the backcountry of Florida for snook, where you are close to the target and backcast area is limited. If you are using a rod designed to throw an eight-weight line and you’re fishing at 30 to 40 feet from the target area and the backcast area is less than that, a nine-weight line will permit you to cast much better because the heavier line will load up the rod and let it flex.

    Heavily weighted lines, like the Wet Cel III or Uniform Sink +, can and should often be used in one to two sizes heavier than the rod calls for because, for some reason, a line one size heavier seems to improve distance casting. Try one and you’ll see what I mean.

    Use shooting TAPERS for greater distance
    Finally, consider shooting tapers (also called “heads”), which are generally used to obtain greater distance. When casting with normal line, if you cast well, you never hold just 30 feet of line outside the rod tip to get distance. Instead, you false cast with considerably more than 30 feet of line outside. When using a shooting head, try using one that’s a size heavier than you usually do and you’ll be pleasantly surprised at the distance you gain.

    So don’t limit yourself to the standard guidelines given by rod manufacturers. Experiment with different line weights for special fishing conditions. You will be pleased with the results.

    Link to source:

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  7. #45

    Default Re: Fast actioned rods and over weighted lines

    First, let me admit that I did not read all of the posts on this thread. I have a bad habit of breezing things.

    Second, FWIW, I almost never overline rods with one exception: a 9wt Orvis Hydros with a 10wt WF line. It's a cannon. Otherwise, I believe it's rod dependent. As scientific as people try to make fly casting, it's still all about feel and casting style to the person holding the rod. There are scientific guidelines concerning line weights with tolerances and what I consider somewhat fuzzy guidelines for line ratings for rods, but you could fool around with any number of lines for a rod until you find the one that makes the rod sing. Likely, a song only you can hear, tho.

    Let me add that are some rods that, no matter what lines you try, just don't have a song because they are just bad rods. I've run across a few that did not work for me, but that didn't make them bad rods. But, I add this disclaimer due to something I read in "Fishing Bamboo" by John Gierach.
    Last edited by axle27; 05-24-2018 at 11:53 AM.
    It's not the heat, it's the stupidity.
    What manner of jackassery will I be subjected to today?

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  9. #46

    Default Re: Fast actioned rods and over weighted lines

    Quote Originally Posted by myt1 View Post
    A few months ago I posed the question: How do you know if someone exclusively fishes dry flies? Answer: Don't worry, they will tell you.

    To that, I would like to add the corollary: How do you know if someone casts dry flies with a really stiff rod and a true weight line fly line, sixty feet into a gale force wind, and catches monster fish? Yup, the same answer as above.
    Well, I don't know about the big wind, but "yup" that largely describes my style of fly fishing. One hour ago I canceled a dry fly float on a big river for this Saturday because of predicted upstream 15 - 20 mph winds with rain. I would not describe my NRX#5 I planed on fishing as "stiff" but surly capable of presenting a floating Hendrickson pattern at 60'...and turning over a 15+' leader too.

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