Euro Nymphing with Regular Tackle?

[haziz]

While buying new and more gear is a talent I excel at, I would like to dip my toe in the water first before committing several hundred dollars on what is fairly specialized gear.

How do I go about seeing if I like, or wish to pursue Euro nymphing with some of my current gear?

Any advise or input, or directions to websites or other information sources with detailed instructions would be appreciated.

While I would appreciate generic instructions, let’s go over some of my current gear.

Rod:
I don’t have any 10 or 11 foot rods, but do have several 9 foot rods (or close). I will exclude my favorite 7ft 6” rod as inherently handicapped.
Which of these rods is closest to workable with Euro-nymphing:

8ft 9” Sage Circa 3wt
9ft Reddington Classic Trout (CT) 4wt
8ft 6” Orvis Helios 2 (mid flex) 5wt
9ft Orvis Access (tip flex) 5wt

How does the rod’s action affect suitability? If I am understanding this right specialist Euro nymphing rods have a flexible tip but a more substantial butt section.

Reel:
I have several Scientific Angler 3-5 wt, 5-7 and 7-9 weight reels that I can use.

Line:
Will probably use the tail end of a 3wt (originally WF) line that I got horribly tangled up and had to cut most of off. Should I get or use a different line?

Leader/Tippet:
I am open to buying and using specialized leader and tippet material. There seems to be various ready made ones as well as recipes for making one. Any advice or input?

Ideas, advice and feedback welcome.

Thanks.

 

[dillon]

I have never used a "Euro Nymph" set up but have talked to those that have, and teach it. Of course you will need sparsely tied flies with tungsten bead heads to start with. Then buy or make one of those very long light leaders. As far as the rod goes the Euros only cast the leader, so play around with the rods you have and see which one works best. I'd suggest the most full flexing one you have. When I nymph fished, I made short casts utilizing the fly line, but the held it up off the water during the drift. This allowed me to feel the strikes better. But, I wasn't Euro Nymphing, was I?

 

[el jefe]

This is an interesting question. I have tried both, and generally prefer using "regular" tackle.

I took a Euro-nymphing class from a guy who learned and fished with Devin Olsen and Lance Egan. He said he nymphed that style with everything from a 7'6" 3-weight, through the the typical 10'+ nypmhing rod. Some of those, obviously, have a more "traditional" action. The first video I ever saw on Euro-nymphing was some guy name Vladi--don't know if he was the Vladi, but he was a Vladi--and he used a 9' 5-weight. Saw a video with another Vladi--maybe the same one--where he was using a 8' 2-weight, if memory serves. So it seems like a specialty rod isn't necessary, though it certainly affords reach over more conventional fly rods.

I had a Sage ESN, and the reach was great, and the fish feel was great, but I really struggled to put the flies where I wanted to with that noodly tip. Maybe the competition guys are good at it, but I'm not. I also hate being locked into a one-trick pony rod, when I'm fishing up in the mountains and a long hike from the truck to be able to change tackle. So one day, while fishing a small river in SW Colorado, I was fishing my G2 884, and the fishing was slow, so I just looped on my Euro-leader, and had an epiphany. I had much more control over where my flies were going, and I like the "senstivity" better. Everybody keeps saying how "sensitive" the Euro rods are, which ostensibly helps the angler distinguish between the bottom and a fish, but to me that noodly tip was too sensitive, and everything felt like like the bottom, or a take, take your pick. It was sensitive, alright, but there was no differentiation.

I looked at one Euro-nymph rod shootout, and given what I think about those rods, I look for the worst finisher in that test, which is probably the closest to the best regular rod, but has the length to do the Euro stuff. Funny enough, one rod they absolutely destroyed was praised by another shop's review, in a different part of the country. So I don't what that even means. A buddy of mine who has a ESN 3100 and a Radian 1004 put away the ESN after acquiring the Radian. He says the Radian fishes like a regular rod, and actually thinks it's a better Euro rod than the ESN.

I wonder if we won't look back in 10 years at this period of Euro-rod popularity, and wonder why we ever liked those things, and how wrong we got the approach. To me, the length is the only advantage to the current Euro rods. You know what would be a great Euro rod? A 10' Scott GS in a 3- or 4-weight, that has the same action as its stablemates. Now that would be a great trout rod, able to fish any technique in a wide range of waters.

So back to the question, I think Euro-nymphing is not only possible with regular tackle, but in my case it's preferred.

 

[stater61]

Go to troutbitten.com you should find the answers you seek.

 

[mrnotherone]

I've practised this style a lot over recent seasons, with increasing success. I have a specialist rod for the purpose. However, I won't carry two rods and frequently have a shorter more 'all around' rod. My go to river rod is a 9ft Helios 2 mid flex 4wt. It doesn't matter, use what ever you are carrying. It's more about learning the technique that the rod. Get a long tapered leader, keep it on a cast carrier or spare spool and you're good to go. I carry a very small, very light extra reel with an 8 metre Hends tapered leader tied directly to backing. I can switch to it quickly.

Long, light nymph rods are great, but plenty of anglers use tight line nymph techniques with regular tackle. One thing I would say, if you plan to hold line off the water with a raised rod for any length of time, chose the lightest rod and reel you can.

 

[jonbo]

I hear really good reports about the Orvis Recon 3 wt 10 ft as doing a good job at fishing a tight line nymph set up well, and also traditional casting with a wf line if you're out there and want to fish styles. I've seen several informal rave reviews amongst my fishing buddies. (I haven't fished it myself).

My Echo 3wt 10 ft is pretty good that way, but tip-heavy. It tight-lines nicely, will also traditional fish ok. It might be a poor man's version. I had to buy the extension outfit for it, use the butt weights but not the length (to 11') extensions, to get it to balance. But it does well for me at 10'.

I never had much luck fishing a "traditional" style of fishing rod euro-style as I couldn't control at all the little bit of casting you have to do. The made-for-it euro rod does much better at tossing that tight-lining leader about with a decent amount of control. Those guys who can "euro" with any rod, I think they're much better casters than I am. For me, a very average caster, I need a whole "euro" set up.

 

[Greyling]

Don't know your fishing conditions, but I would go with Sage Circa. IMO it will present the flies correctly, you will have the sensitivity and will be able to switch to dries, if needed.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[bonefish41]

Guys...don't know much about... as the song goes but is it a variation of the Michigan chuck and duck and/or indicator/bobber style...long light 8 and under tippet leader with weights either mini sliding sash weight or string of split shot...on nymphs 18-20 in size bounces on the bottom and you strike when it stops...with lots of false points...when I'm forced to these methods I can use my regular 9' rod but the guide usually hands me a wet noodle 10' rod...mainly very forgiving with a fall big salmon or steelhead on 6 lb tippet...

 

[yikes]

Haziz, you could try it with any of those rods to get a feel for the concept, and I would encourage you to do so.
What might not be able to replicate with your current rods:
1. The length of time of your drift (the longer the rod, the more time you have to keep the line tight)
2. The balance of the setup - - you might fatigue a little earlier in the day than if you had a specialized euro-rig.

 

[Greyling]

I use for nymphing Hends Camou French Nymph Leaders 900cm Hends Camou French Nymph Leaders (900cm) - Competitive Angler

I attach at the end of the leader 1 ft. bicolor mono (sighter) and tippet ring. For tippet I use Japanese fluorocarbon (Sunline, Varivas or Seaguar). The leader is attached to my fly line, so if there is a hatch I can quickly remove it and put a dry fly leader.

RIO also have Euro nymph leader, but haven't tried it yet, though I'm sure its OK. You can tie your own with Maxima Chameleon, a lot of recipes on internet.

 

[reels]

I'm no expert, but have been euro nymphing for a few years and have built about a 1/2 dozen "euro sticks" in the past year.

In terms of rods for euro nymphing, they typically have the following characteristics:
- At least 10' in length. I prefer 10' 6" or longer unless strictly targeting smaller water.
- Fairly fast action; stiff usually about 2/3 up the blank. A few are now doing more a mid-flex, but I find these difficult to control in windy situations.
- Supple tip to protect very light leaders/tippet.
- Minimal damper; you need to get "contact" with line immediately to detect strikes.
- Generally 3wt or less. I've yet to see a high performance euro stick 4wt or greater.
- Those developed strictly for euro nymphing may have the stripping guide placed closer to the handle for "limp line" applications.

That said, you can certainly euro nymph with any rod, but in my experience you may struggle with the technique if not using an appropriate rod as it may hamper accuracy, line control, distance, etc..

In terms of reels, the major thing is that your reel balances out your rod. Ideally you want the balance point at the front of the grip where you hand is. Otherwise the technique will cause more fatigue (you are effectively high-sticking all day long; don't do a shoulder workout for 2 days previous or you will be hurting). The necessary weight of the reel will largely depend on the rod; 10' and longer generally need at least a 5oz (rigged) reel to balance in my experience.

For line, I'd recommend some of that specialized euro nymphing line they make for beginners. I personally use the "mono rig" but it comes with it's own set of complications and therefore the specialized line is easier to start with.

For leaders and tippets just google; there's a ton of info out there today.

Also I will just add that heavily weight tungsten nymphs are not required unless you are fishing competition. If you need to fish small unweighted nymphs, just use sinkers... I fish down to size 30 nymphs with euro techniques; BB sinkers are my friend.

Finally; if possible I find it most efficient to fish with 2 pre-rigged rods; one setup for euro and the other for a floating indicator... Fish the slow water with the floating setup and then floss the faster water with euro rig. If 2 rods aren't realistic I will use euro techniques with my floating setup by just holding the floating indicator above teh water surface and watching it for strike movement; it's possible, but not as efficient without the euro setup.

Good luck man, euro nymphing was a game changer for me!

 

[clouserguyky]

Your 9' 4 and 5 weights will work splendidly, just without the reach of the competition style rods. The extra ength is really helpful. I personally use 9'6" and 10' 5 weight rods to euro nymph, but I've had success with 9' rods too. I tie my own french style/french inspired leaders that generally have butt sections of 20# mono up to 40' long, and those 5 weights cast them like a dream. Even with a single #18 tungsten nymph.

What you lose most in a traditional rod as opposed to a competition style rod is sensitivity. These 5 weights will handle 6x and even 7x no problem (not that they are honestly necessary most of the time.) What you lose with a competition style rod as opposed to a traditional rod is versatility. I never tightline ALL DAY. I usually fish streamers at dawn, nymph throughout the day using indicators or tightline approaches, then finish up with streamers again or dries. A good 9-10' 5 weight can do all of those things well, but a competition rod ONLY nymphs well. Does it nymph better than a 5 weight? Yes, for euro techniques. But some water types call for suspenders. And when I start seeing those olive and golden snouts breaking the surface, I really want to be able to cast a WF fly line, 12' leader, and dry. Or if a storm rolls in, I might even spool up a 150 grain sinking line and rip streamers through the deep holes.

So if I was a competitive angler bound by FIPS rules, I'd have a competition rod. As it is, I like my long 5 weights!

 

[reels]

What you lose most in a traditional rod as opposed to a competition style rod is sensitivity. These 5 weights will handle 6x and even 7x no problem (not that they are honestly necessary most of the time.) What you lose with a competition style rod as opposed to a traditional rod is versatility. I never tightline ALL DAY.

Definitely good points.
I tried to make the switch to a single 10' 5wt rod that could "do it all" last year, but I felt the benefit I gained from a euro specific rod was worth it if planning to euro nymph at least 1/2 the day.

I'm curious; when you switch from suspension rig to tight-lining are you using the same setup (line/leader/etc.), or are you re-rigging for the switch?

Also for what it's worth, I do find it possible (though less efficient) to fish dry/suspension/streamers with most of my euro rods in smaller to medium waters without much change. I just use a "fling cast" or a single false cast. It's a different story in bigger water where multiple false casts are needed to reach the target.

 

[clouserguyky]

Definitely good points.
I tried to make the switch to a single 10' 5wt rod that could "do it all" last year, but I felt the benefit I gained from a euro specific rod was worth it if planning to euro nymph at least 1/2 the day.

I'm curious; when you switch from suspension rig to tight-lining are you using the same setup (line/leader/etc.), or are you re-rigging for the switch?

Also for what it's worth, I do find it possible (though less efficient) to fish dry/suspension/streamers with most of my euro rods in smaller to medium waters without much change. I just use a "fling cast" or a single false cast. It's a different story in bigger water where multiple false casts are needed to reach the target.

I think you're thinking well if you spend 1/2 a day or more tightlining. For me it can be up in the air what I'm doing. I definitely have days where I do tightline a significant portion of the day, usually I find large portions of my day where other techniques are more effective. Typically I use the same set up when switching between tightline techniques and suspension techniques. Honestly, my preference is to stick with my eurostyle leader, even when fishing suspenders or streamers in close. This lets me fish those techniques out to about 30-40 feet with minimal sag and drag. The only time I'll switch to fly line and a traditional leader when I'm fishing on foot are if I'm fishing suspenders at distance, fishing dries, or fishing streamers with sinking leaders or sink tips. A good 9'6"-10' 4 or 5 weight is the most versatile for these techniques on my waters. Out of a boat, I pretty much always fish a more traditional set up.

 

[jonbo]

Some of you guys must be much better casters than I am. I wasn't able to do anything with that super long mono euro-style leader until I got a dedicated euro-style rod. Now it's no problem. My 10' Echo 3 wt manipulates the mono easily, yet still casts a wf line adequately, although not great. From what I understand an Orvis Recon(?) is even more versatile as is a Sage of some model that someone mentioned up-thread. But I'm here to tell you, if you're just a mediocre caster as I'm afraid I must be, you might have trouble controlling that 25' - 40' of Max Cham leader with a regular old 5 wt or even 4 wt rod while you're tight-lining.