Nymph vs Switch vs Micro spey, trout spey etc

[jangles]

Can I get an answer as to what exactly is the difference between a 10' Nymph rod and a 10' Switch , spey ,trout spey micro spey rod. Good Lord the list goes on and on .

And what action is preferred on them as a whole ? TIA
Ron

 

[ottosmagic13]

One is 10' the other is 120"


Curious myself. I'm guessing it's flex and taper.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[flytie09]

Marketing. The presence of a larger lower handle distinguishing a 2 hand rod in my eyes. You go to the UK and ask for a switch rod and you will get strange looks.

I would say as far as actions..... that a medium action rod would be preferred for say a beginner. Two hand casting is a different set of motions and slower than a traditional single hand casting. Timing is easier with a softer rod.

As you advance and get timing down.... you might want to go with a faster action.

You wouldn’t necessarily want to learn to drive a car for the first time with a Ferrari.

 

[flav]

In a nutshell...

A nymphing rod has a single handed handle. It also has a rather stiff action with a soft tip, designed more to lob weighted nymphs a short distance and then be held high to keep a tight line.

Trout speys have a soft, full flexing action with a long upper and lower handle. They're designed to cast with water anchored casts, not overhead.

Micro speys are basically single handed rods, usually 9 feet or less, outfitted with a standard single handed upper grip and a bottom grip.

Switch rods bridge the gap. They're stiffer than a spey, but slower than a single hander so they can be cast either overhead (although few do) or with water anchored casts. A switch handle also lies in between, longer than a micro, but shorter than a spey.

The terms switch, micro, and trout spey are thrown around pretty loosely, though, and it can be hard to tell what's what just by what someone calls it. I'd worry less about labels and find a rod designed to do what you want it to do.

 

[coug]

No idea on the nymph rod. My two cents on the others. I agree with flytie, most of it is marketing. The term switch rod was coined by Bob Meiser, you can read about it here: MEIZ
He developed switch rods as two-handed overhand casting rods as an alternative to double hauling single hand rods all day. As explained in the link, people figured out you could also do anchored casts (spey casts) so you could "switch" between two-handed overhead and more traditional anchored spey casts. Years ago I thought it meant switching between single-hand and two-hand casts and said so in a room of very accomplished two-hand casters from my home waters in the Pacific Northwest, and was quickly corrected and directed to the link! I bought a 11'4" 4wt two-handed rod from Burkheimer a few years ago, and Kerry Burkheimer emphasized it was a spey rod, and not a switch rod, meaning it was for anchored casts, not two-handed overhead. I know that some brands now market switch as single- or two-hand, but that is more recent. I've also seen other attempts to distinguish switch from traditional. Think about it as a marketing tool. "I am curious about two-handed casting, but am afraid I (will not like it, will not learn how to do it, etc), so I can buy a "switch" rod that I can still cast single handed."

Micro- and trout-spey are marketing terms. I think micro was first used by Winston, but am not sure. It is just line weight. Anyway, that is my two cents.

Action is an entirely different thread and is completely personal preference! There can be big differences between Meiser, Anderson, Burkheimer, Bruce&Walker, Gaelforce, etc, but each of them make incredible rods that are a joy to cast. Meiser and Anderson have both been making two-handed rods in weights appropriate for trout for years, and both have outstanding reputations for their rods and service.

 

[el jefe]

I would love to hear from anyone who uses their trout spey to Euro nymph. I know the action between a typical Euro nymph (or tight line) rod and trout spey is supposedly different, but I'm not terribly fond of the Euro nymph action to do Euro nymph techniques. I wonder if trout spey rods can be used to tight line. Anyone?

 

[eastfly66]

Interesting thoughts and question you guys are on. I have a ONE 3110 & a ESN 3110. I'll take them out and swap reels around and see how it goes. It might be a while before I have a chance, the local rivers are flowing 3 or 4 time above normal and I'm up to my wazoo with work. Maybe I'll run a mic down the blank and see how they compare but don't expect anything to scientific out of me.

If your hunch is right and the trout spey cn pull dual duty I'll have an ESN up for sale

 

[flav]

I built a 10 foot 3 weight and an 11 foot 4 weight and nymphed with both. The 3 weight was a noodle and not a good nympher, but the 4 weight was a much higher modulus blank and it is an awesome nymphing rod. I haven't tight lined with it much, my local rivers favor long casts and indicators, but when I did it worked well. It's nice to be able to drift a nymph through pocket water at your feet, and be able to effortlessly cover that seam 60 feet away that you can't wade to with the same rod.

 

[eastfly66]

I just remembered this too.....I know a couple guys that are big time into the euro nymph thing and they are good at it too. They use a 7 wt switch rod when steelheading but they don't swing like I do with the 2 hander, they euro nymph with it..I'm pretty sure they are now using the new T&T Contact #6 that was designed as a "steelhead" nymphing rod at 10' 4".

I hope the rain stops soon, you guys really got me curious about this question.

 

[proheli]

I called Sage about two weeks ago and went over the difference between their Spey and Switch rods, because I am interested in a two hander to help take the stress off of my right rotator cuff. For throwing bigger streamers, but also for some inshore sight fishing here in the Tampa Bay, because apparently you can single hand the switch rods, just not all day long. We were talking just about the Xs as it comes in Switch and Spey, and the new Igniter in TH only comes in Spey.

So then, essentially the Switch rod has the same taper philosophy as the single hand Xs. With its length, like the 5110, 5wt 11’0”, or 6110, 6wt 11’0”, It’s long and strong enough to keep the head in the water and Spey cast, but for all the other stuff you can overhand cast too, yes you might lose some accuracy, but the X is the X and you can easily single hand it, just not all day. You can watch a guy on YouTube single hand the X Switch and it’s really nifty.

So, the Spey rods. Simply, longer and deeper flexing down into the strength of the blank, the middle of the blank, the Spey rod to can generate maximum power, and do the awesome things Spey rods do. The Sage Speys are basically 12’6-15’

So the Spey is deeper and a little softer flexing. I think he said more medium flex on the Spey, but because of that Spey is only good for Spey casting and not overhand.

This is just from Sage, I don’t know if the other manufacturers parallel this philosophy.

Micro Spey and Trout Spey were just the smaller sizes 2-5wts or whatever, but still Spey philosophy on the blank. Deeper flexing to really get into the power of the blank as you drag the line through the water.

 

[Bigfly]

I carry two Xs that are 6wt 11ft. One has a Skagit line, the other a Rio switch line, 2 lines up.
They allow me to fish a dry, high stick nymphing, or bobber with a lot of weight, as well as swing it!.
Most everyone I introduce to these sticks, they soon go find their own.
It is a little heavy for those who don't fish enough to be in shape for a big stick. Check out the 5wt in that case, it's a bit lighter.

If you tend to raise your elbow when casting you will pay a price (because you are waving the rod, not loading it)........but if you get your cast on, you can cover more water in more ways than any other rod I fish, and much easier too.
I always say, I have no idea how I got along without one all these years.
For our water, when I take a customer's 9ft rod for a drive, I find an instant urge to switch!

I have been in lust with my ESN 3wt 11ft (Discontinued) for dry fly fishing too....if you decide to go that way.
Ran into a young guy who noticed I had the ESN. He proudly showed me his new 10'6" and said he loved it....then he noticed I had a dry tied on mine. I let him test drive it, and he threw a tight looped 70ft cast with ease, and blew his own mind.
Never take my word for anything!!
Don't be afraid to try new stuff.....fishing out of habit is not how we grow.

As far as I'm concerned, it's not marketing..........I have used the ESN for a few years to high stick, I have the 9'9" sage dedicated nymphing rod, as well as Method streamer rod, a bunch of prime dry fly rods, several micro spey, full spey, and switch sticks. They are ALL different sticks for different tasks....There are fast and slow models in almost all the rod sizes and uses. Find the one you like and go get'em.

Had a couple guys out the other day, who had taken my advice and bought two 4wt 11ft Echo euro rods.(A hundred bucks each he said...)
He had a 4wt line on them and I cast it for a while....asked him if he had another line, and so we put a 6wt line on....it worked great. I kinda rocked their world when I used a two handed snap-T cast on a Nymphing stick, with a dry fly.
Many ways to do this magic thing we do......

Jim

 

[proheli]

I carry two Xs that are 6wt 11ft. One has a Skagit line, the other a Rio switch line, 2 lines up.

As far as I'm concerned, it's not marketing..

Bigfly, and yours are both Switch rods right? The X-Switch 6110-4?

 

[huronfly]

I would love to hear from anyone who uses their trout spey to Euro nymph. I know the action between a typical Euro nymph (or tight line) rod and trout spey is supposedly different, but I'm not terribly fond of the Euro nymph action to do Euro nymph techniques. I wonder if trout spey rods can be used to tight line. Anyone?

Ive tried to use my trout spey to euro nymph but I did not like it at all. The extra length is great, but I found the lower handle of the rod would catch fly line too often and hinder casting and stripping. Also, the rod I built was made to be fished using spey style casts, so this blank was definitely a more moderate action rod to fulfill that purpose, and as a result was a little slower at tightening up on subtle strikes. I think if you plan on euro nymphing keep the rod singlehanded and fast action. A rod designed to spey cast won't be a great nymphing rod, and a euro nymphing rod wouldn't be your best bet for spey casting. Sure you could do it, but ideally you would have two different rods.

 

[Bigfly]

Bigfly, and yours are both Switch rods right? The X-Switch 6110-4?

Yes, I love my 6110....too bad they stopped selling the 11ftr....why do they always discontinue the good ones....

Jim

 

[el jefe]

Ive tried to use my trout spey to euro nymph but I did not like it at all. The extra length is great, but I found the lower handle of the rod would catch fly line too often and hinder casting and stripping. Also, the rod I built was made to be fished using spey style casts, so this blank was definitely a more moderate action rod to fulfill that purpose, and as a result was a little slower at tightening up on subtle strikes. I think if you plan on euro nymphing keep the rod singlehanded and fast action. A rod designed to spey cast won't be a great nymphing rod, and a euro nymphing rod wouldn't be your best bet for spey casting. Sure you could do it, but ideally you would have two different rods.

Without actually experiencing it, it would seem like the trout spey, with its extended handle, would be convenient for Euro nymphing, bracing the rod against your forearm. But real world experience is the best guide.

And then there's this, using a Euro nymph rod to spey cast. The rod in use is a Redington Hydrogen 3100, Redington's Euro nymph offering.

 

[eastfly66]

I have to say at one point I wondered if the ESN and One Trout Spey are the same blank ...I don't think this is the case or I at least want to believe that as I paid some good coin for them

That being said I have not had the time to run to the river with both but couldn't wait so I took the ESN 3110 out in the yard just now with a SA Scandi Lite 270 grain which is for my IMX 41111 and I would say if you own a ESN nymph rod you also own a Sage ESN Single Hand Trout Spey. My guess would be the 250 grain Rio Scandi would be a little better but I had no problem throwing nice loops with plenty of power to carry a bead head bugger out to 60'. The battery is dead on my mic so maybe tomorrow I can see how they compare. Oh, those were "spey cast" ..snap T ...snake roll.

If I had to go out on a limb I would say they have more in common than difference .....If I knew I would have bought one or the other and asked for a second handle ...2 hand and lower .. but I want to see how it goes on the river before I start thinking I paid 600 bucks for 6" of cork