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  1. #41

    Default Re: Ladies With Fly Rods

    [QUOTE=flafly14;1325326]If I went into a knitting club, I would absolutely expect to be an object of curiosity. And if I really wanted to knit, then I'd deal with it, pay my dues, learn the craft, and gain a little respect within the knitting community. Wow, what a concept![/QUOUTE]

    If you went to a knitting club!!..... outstanding, you definitely understand the points being made

  2. #42

    Default Re: Ladies With Fly Rods

    Quote Originally Posted by flafly14 View Post
    If I went into a knitting club, I would absolutely expect to be an object of curiosity. And if I really wanted to knit, then I'd deal with it, pay my dues, learn the craft, and gain a little respect within the knitting community. Wow, what a concept!
    Would you expect to be hit on, or to have your masculinity either denied or devalued ("He's not a 'manly man,' lol!")? Would you welcome being patronized, or treated as an adjunct to your wife? Would you enjoy having your fellow knitters constantly talking over, past, or down to you? Would it be fun for you if after every meeting you had to quietly arrange things so that one woman couldn't corner you alone on your way back to the car? Would it be cool if the rest of the group only took your suggestions seriously if you got a woman to voice them for you?

    There are a million ways that men make women uncomfortable and unwelcome in traditionally male cultural spaces, and I've witnessed quite a few of them live and in person among fly flingers. There's no "double standard" involved in women wanting to have opportunities to fly fish without dealing with our BS.

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  4. #43

    Default Re: Ladies With Fly Rods

    Quote Originally Posted by dylar View Post
    Would you expect to be hit on, or to have your masculinity either denied or devalued ("He's not a 'manly man,' lol!")? Would you welcome being patronized, or treated as an adjunct to your wife? Would you enjoy having your fellow knitters constantly talking over, past, or down to you? Would it be fun for you if after every meeting you had to quietly arrange things so that one woman couldn't corner you alone on your way back to the car? Would it be cool if the rest of the group only took your suggestions seriously if you got a woman to voice them for you?

    There are a million ways that men make women uncomfortable and unwelcome in traditionally male cultural spaces, and I've witnessed quite a few of them live and in person among fly flingers. There's no "double standard" involved in women wanting to have opportunities to fly fish without dealing with our BS.
    Well dude...when you're as alpha as I am, you just ALWAYS expect to be hit on by the wamyns!

    But for real if/when I go into any environment where I'm an any sort of outsider then here's how I handle it...
    1. I just shut my mouth and watch how things work. I don't typically ask for help. I'll just shut the hell up and observe. I absolutely do NOT, EVER, give suggestions as an outsider!
    2. If I can't figure something out, after google/etc, then I'll see if I can strike up a friendly conversation with someone that looks like I could connect with. After chatting a bit, then I'll come out and ask the question.
    3. Then I'll just work on whatever it is. I'll go home and study/practice to get better. I just start at the bottom and work my way up. With competence comes respect. I don't expect it be given to me. I go out and earn it.

    If women (or anyone) want to make it in really any endeavor in life then I suggest they do something similar. Don't ever go into someplace new, where you're the outsider, and cry about how they do things. Go in as a guest. Show a little respect. I don't think that's unreasonable at all.

  5. #44

    Default Re: Ladies With Fly Rods

    Quote Originally Posted by flafly14 View Post
    I don't get it and I can't be bothered to learn or listen.
    There, I fixed it for you.

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