Rod tip replacement?

[yikes]

Yesterday afternoon on a business trip detour to the Kings River, I assembled my rod and worked my way through 200+ yards of brush and trees to get to the river's edge. I point the rod behind me, so as not to break it if I trip. I felt it snag on branches behind me, but wasn't worried, because I hadn't strung it up yet.

After picking my spot, I went to rig up, and saw that I was missing the tip section of the rod. It had come off somewhere along the way. Clearly, I had not put it on as tightly as I'd thought. In any case, after 90 minute of "needle-in-a-haystack" searching among all the sticks and branches along the entire route, I gave up and headed home. I figured I could buy a replacement tip from Fenwick.

I called Fenwick today, and they said they don't offer replacement tips. All I can do is buy a new rod. I don't know if a replacement section is a technical issue (e.g., must be custom-fit at time of assembly), or if it is merely a business practice (we don't stock replacement tips).


I realize that at $190+ tax, I don't have too much to cry about, and maybe this is my opportunity for an upgrade. But it feels like a shame to throw out the rest of the rod due to lack of a replacement tip section.
Before I go shopping, I wanted to ask:
- Is it normal for rod companies to not offer a replacement tip section, or is this unique to Fenwick?
- If I had broken my tip section instead of lost it, what would a rod company do to repair or replace it?

 

[kevind62]

I've never had to do this. But if a rod has any sort of warranty (long or short) for repairs or damage it would seem practical that rod makers would have spare parts or the ability to make certain parts as a "one-off" for this purpose. They can't say that they can't make a specific part of a rod and guarantee the fit. The ferrules on the rods are standard sized. They're not made individually for each rod. And being the tip of the rod this means you only have to make one fit. Pretty simple. Seems like a sales tactic to me. I would write them back. If they still balk I would write one more time and let them know I won't be recommending their products to anyone from now on and would let them know I will be giving them negative reviews on social media in the fly fishing forums, online sporting goods stores, and such. I think there is more than enough data available to figure out which parts of the rod fails the most, whether its from a defect, abuse, or accident (closing the tailgate of the truck on the rod). It would be feasible for a company to make the most vulnerable sections in excess of say 1% -5% of their normal product run. I know that mass producers probably do each section in lots. Just for argument sake say 1000 pieces per lot. There wouldn't be any reason not to make 1010 tip sections, 1000 each of the middle two sections and 1010 butt sections. Set the extras aside to stock as "replacement parts". They use this manufacturing philosophy for car parts and a myriad of other manufactured parts. Things break and wear out. That's why you can go the the dealership or auto parts store and get a new fuel pump or battery or whatever. They don't say "I'm sorry, we don't make extra windshield wiper blades. You'll have to but a whole new car. We no longer carry the model you have but we have this new and improved upgraded model for a few thousand $$ more."

 

[bigal36]

I had a similar experience with my g. loomis 10' 3wt Pro. I was shocked when they said the tip couldn't be replaced...since is was no longer a rod in their line-up. They did offer me a prox4 (not a 10') with a small deductible or a NRX (in a 10') minus the cost of the prox4, plus deductible.

Bottom line - I went with the NRX, my out of pocket on a $775 rod was around $500.

 

[Rip Tide]

I've done that as well. Lost the tip in the brush on the hike it.
That was the last time that I didn't either rig at the car before the walk or carry all the sections in hand.
I'll put on a fly even if I think that I'll likely change it when I hit the river.

I did find mine and it was a $20 rod anyway, but it was a lesson learned.

 

[ejammer]

Same thing happened to me with a lost tip. Assembled the rod off the trail deep in the Adirondacks woods amongst a forest floor covered in thick green ferns and a beautiful Brookie stream. Lifted rod and the tip caught on a branch and went flying. Douglas DXF mint green rod tip was gone lost in the fern field. Got 2 replacecements the next day( $60 total), one being my insurance policy. Lessons learned. I find it hard to believe they have no tips left. Has this rod been discontinued for a long time?

 

[jd138]

Oh my woes of broken rod tips; I'm right there with you. I broke four Orvis rods, all at the tip section. Two were fishing, one was from a wipe out while hiking upriver, and most recently, in a screen door. Rod warranties and polices are quite varied, even within manufacturer lines. My first two Orvis rods were replaced/repaired. The first time (Frequent Flyer) it was replaced with the only cost to me being my shipment to them. The second time (same rod) I paid $60 for the repair. By the third break, Orvis moved to a newer Frequent Flyer and discontinued ALL warranty support for the previous model. I confirmed this with their CS who also wrote to me, "maybe you should just hang it on the wall". Silly enough, I then bought one of their cheapies and sure enough, with the slightest impact from a door that shut too quick behind me, the tip snapped like a dry twig. Not knocking Orvis, I'm sure their higher end stuff is great, but that was it for me. I then shopped for a new rod based on the expectation I would be in need of a repair / new tip. I narrowed it down to Echo ($17 rod tips, even their cheapest rod is included) and Redington (very straight forward and inexpensive repair policy).

 

[ikankecil]

I've broken three rod tips (Sage RPLXi 10wt, Orvis Helios 5wt, Powell Tiboron 6wt). Sage and Orvis each replaced the tip under warranty, I had an independent shop replace the Powell tip as Powell went Asian-bass-rod. NONE of those three rods after the fix ever really fishing the way they did with the original tip.

 

[dakotakid]

A screen door snapped off the end of one of my St. Croix fly rods. I had two options for repair:
1) Send the rod back and pay $50 for repair plus shipping, or
2) Using my rod model and serial numbers, I could order a replacement tip for $30 and not have to send them anything.

At that time, their website listed for which rods they had spare tips. Got the replacement in two days. Great service!

Their website still indicates they have replacement tips for many rod models manufactured after 2001, but it doesn't indicate pricing or which models. But they also still have the tip replacement plans with optional upgrades to other models. So from my one experience, I highly recommend St. Croix service because broken tips do happen.

 

[silver creek]

Yesterday afternoon on a business trip detour to the Kings River, I assembled my rod and worked my way through 200+ yards of brush and trees to get to the river's edge. I point the rod behind me, so as not to break it if I trip. I felt it snag on branches behind me, but wasn't worried, because I hadn't strung it up yet.

After picking my spot, I went to rig up, and saw that I was missing the tip section of the rod. It had come off somewhere along the way. Clearly, I had not put it on as tightly as I'd thought. In any case, after 90 minute of "needle-in-a-haystack" searching among all the sticks and branches along the entire route, I gave up and headed home. I figured I could buy a replacement tip from Fenwick.

There is a cure for that!

I wrote about how to avoid losing a rod tip back in 2014 in this post:

How to make a fly reel heavier? - Page 3

What I do when walking through woods to the stream is to thread the rod, add the fly and wrap the tippet back down and around the rod a couple of times. Then hook the fly to a guide foot. Carry the rod with the butt facing forward.

When you carry the rod butt forward, the rod tip cannot stab the ground breaking the tip. With the tippet wound around the rod, there is no space between the tippet and rod to hook a branch. You can work you way through thick branches this way. There is also no way to lose the rod tip because the rod is strung up.

When you walk along the river bank, carry the rod butt forward on the side that is AWAY from the river. This prevents the rod from swinging across the river in front of you and spooking fish next to the river bank. Never allow the rod to swing over the river in the direction you are walking, and the rod will never spook fish.

PS - if you don't want to add a fly, just wrap the tippet and leader down the rod and hold the tippet with the same hand that is carrying the rod.

 

[reels]

In general, I think most manufacturer's these days have a policy around rod breakage repair/replacement (tip or other). If they don't, I'd be cautious in purchasing from them. Even with "lower to mid-end" rods this is true. For example; Echo's lower-end models can be repaired (and I can confirm Echo has good warranty service on rods). Sure it may cost a few bucks to use the warranty service, but that's better than shelling out for a new rod (unless you need an excuse for a new rod).

While I only buy blanks these days, I've learned to research this aspect of any blank/rod purchase so there are no surprises if a breakage occurs.

... and of course always have a back-up rod or 10.

 

[yikes]

I find it hard to believe they have no tips left. Has this rod been discontinued for a long time?

Actually, the rod is still being sold. It's just that their customer service line says they do not sell rod tip sections alone. You an only replace the entire rod. Here's an excerpt from their website:

"What if I accidentally broke my rod or it's out of the warranty time period?
Everyone has broken a rod by accident, but Fenwick isn't going to penalize you for it. We're going to give you a sweet deal on a replacement rod and get you back on the water."​

Oddly, when the rod is under warranty, they reserve the option to repair or replace, which implies they may have spare parts.

 

[silver creek]

Actually, the rod is still being sold. It's just that their customer service line says they do not sell rod tip sections alone. You an only replace the entire rod. Here's an excerpt from their website:

"What if I accidentally broke my rod or it's out of the warranty time period?
Everyone has broken a rod by accident, but Fenwick isn't going to penalize you for it. We're going to give you a sweet deal on a replacement rod and get you back on the water."​

Oddly, when the rod is under warranty, they reserve the option to repair or replace, which implies they may have spare parts.

Obviously, since the rod is still being sold, they have spare parts for the warranty repairs.

I guess you could "game" the system and buy a new rod on a "sweet deal," then "lose" the tip on that new rod during the warranty period. You did not hear that from me.......

 

[kevind62]

I was delving through some other threads and came across one on a new manufacturer. Moonshine Rods. I checked them out online. They're a new company. Their rods look pretty nice and the sales pitch sounds good as you'd expect someone trying to break in to the business. But to get to the point of this thread, they offer several rods that come with two tip ends. ???? How cool is that. They're philosophy is accidents happen. This is probably the most frequently lost or broken part of a fly rod ( or any type of fishing rod for that matter ).

Now, this can mean one of several things. First off, they're rods can be so terrible that they go ahead and give you the spare part hoping that by the time you need a third one they'll either be gone or you'll have lost their contact info. They come with a "No fault LIFETIME Warranty" (that's how it's worded on their site).

Or, the other guys selling these mid/low range rods are totally ripping us off.

Or their rods are comparable to others in this bracket and they're just smart business folks using a viable selling tool.

The rods look nice online. I'd like to hold on in my hand just to see how it feels. The description of the action sounds comparable to a higher end rod. More flex at the tip and stiff at the butt. Most mid/low end rods are more linear in their flex. Advantages and disadvantages in this. The quality would seem to be sufficient. The higher priced ones they offer are Made In The USA. The "more affordable" ones are made in Korea. Korea, Taiwan, and Japan are all Grade "A" on quality. I try to stay away from Made in China as much as possible due to their substandard low QA. Which nowadays is hard to do. Every time you pick something up in the store it says "Made in China". My current work assignment is in China and it's the same over there. Everything you pick up says Made in China. What's this world coming to????? :faint:

 

[trout trekker]

Well you could look at it this way, buy another one ( the price point you listed makes it sound like an Aetos and they seem to be discounted fairly often. ) and you'll have three lower replacement sections for it, should some other unforseen diaster strike.

Ever notice that rod shootouts point out that the entire Fenwick rod is replaced under warranty, rather than a having a section replaced?

Recognizing that some fly shops choose to carry current Fenwick models, they are not pro shop rods. Expecting the policies and practices of a pro shop line to be extended to a mass market rod isn't realistic. While it may not seem like a good way to conduct a c.s. program, they do offer a warranty. Try to buy a spare tip for a Cabela's rod, White River Rod and a few other branded rods. They simply haven't included your loosing a section of your rod into their model. Fenwick didn't make that rod, a contracted rod shop in another country did. Fenwick orders whole units, not parts, that's how the rods come in, so they can't sell you what they don't have. But they can replace a broken rod with a new rod and that's the promise they made to you with the warranty, nothing else.

I've checked into this with several companies now, ( not Fenwick specifically ), but if you see a rod that's built offshore aimed at the mass market ( big boxes, etc. ) that offers a warranty that replaces broken rods, but doesn't specify section replacement ( as some top shelf brands do ), they'll more than likely not be able to sell you a tip section. We want affordable gear, it's part of the price we pay.

Dave

 

[el jefe]

Well you could look at it this way, buy another one ( the price point you listed makes it sound like an Aetos and they seem to be discounted fairly often. ) and you'll have three lower replacement sections for it, should some other unforseen diaster strike.

Ever notice that rod shootouts point out that the entire Fenwick rod is replaced under warranty, rather than a having a section replaced?

Recognizing that some fly shops choose to carry current Fenwick models, they are not pro shop rods. Expecting the policies and practices of a pro shop line to be extended to a mass market rod isn't realistic. While it may not seem like a good way to conduct a c.s. program, they do offer a warranty. Try to buy a spare tip for a Cabela's rod, White River Rod and a few other branded rods. They simply haven't included your loosing a section of your rod into their model. Fenwick didn't make that rod, a contracted rod shop in another country did. Fenwick orders whole units, not parts, that's how the rods come in, so they can't sell you what they don't have. But they can replace a broken rod with a new rod and that's the promise they made to you with the warranty, nothing else.

I've checked into this with several companies now, ( not Fenwick specifically ), but if you see a rod that's built offshore aimed at the mass market ( big boxes, etc. ) that offers a warranty that replaces broken rods, but doesn't specify section replacement ( as some top shelf brands do ), they'll more than likely not be able to sell you a tip section. We want affordable gear, it's part of the price we pay.

Dave

He nailed it.

In addition, of the higher end shops that do replace sections, they often have to make the section; they don't just have spares sitting around. And the ferrule fit varies by manufacturer. Sage and Scott, among others, want to re-fit the ferrule, which is one reason they ask you to send in the whole rod when you only break a section. The following video shows ferrule fitting at the Scott factory. Though the video shows an internal ferrule, the principles are the same with sleeve ferrules. Pick it up at about the 3:30 mark.

YouTube

There are some companies out there that have precision fit ferrules, but they are more the exception. For an example, Swift Fly Fishing, maker of Epic fly rods, does have a standard ferrule:

The Epic Difference - Blanks and Ferrule Tech'

-
The Swift Fly Fishing Company

 

[falcon53]

I broke 6 in off the tip of a Sage One 9ft 6wt (still don't know how it happened). After calling Sage they instructed me to "break off" 6 in above the female ferrule and only mail this piece in for tip section replacement. This made shipping easy compared to shipping entire sections. They know the rod model and only need to size the new tip section ferrule to match the "Broken off piece". Cost was 70.00. I was happy to get the repair.

 

[silver creek]

I was delving through some other threads and came across one on a new manufacturer. Moonshine Rods. I checked them out online. They're a new company. Their rods look pretty nice and the sales pitch sounds good as you'd expect someone trying to break in to the business. But to get to the point of this thread, they offer several rods that come with two tip ends. ???? How cool is that. They're philosophy is accidents happen. This is probably the most frequently lost or broken part of a fly rod ( or any type of fishing rod for that matter ).

The Gary Borger Light Touch rods came with 2 tips (see image below). These are the rods I use in Wisconsin for my small stream fishing. There were medium action rods that came in a 7.5 ft 3 wt, the 8.0 ft 4 wt and a 8.5 ft 5 wt rods. I was able to cast the rods during the design period and I bought all three rods when they became available.

Does anyone else use these rods? Have you ever lost or broken a tip? So far, I have not.

 

[tcorfey]

Hi Silver, I have two of the Gary Borger Light Touch rods a 5wt in 8' and another 5wt in 8.5' they are very nice rods and I have caught lots of fish with them.

I have fished them all over CA, I like the insurance of having a spare tip with me but, I have not broken a tip yet and they are several years old.

Regards,

Tim C.

 

[Rip Tide]

I have a rod right here in front of me that came with 2 tips
It's bamboo and was built in 1938
There's no warranty of course.
Back then you were expected to take personal responsibility for your own actions

 

[bentley]

I've broken tips on a $150 Redington and $800 Orvis rod. Both companies replaced for a small fee without quibble. I'll always take this into account when buying a rod.