Help with tying flies with zonker strips

[pafishslayer]

Hi guys , so I'm new to tying flies with zonker but I'm running into some issue that I'm wondering if someone can help me with.Ive tied 2 flies with zonker strips and I've followed videos and books and do it exactly the same way as they do but every time I test them in my test tank they always float , even after i try to hold them under the water. Doesn't make sense since they are suppost to be bottom flies. Wondering if someone can help . I know adding lead wire would help but at this point almost the whole shank of the hook is covered. Thanks in advance , Nick


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[ia_trouter]

They will tend to ride high in current or while stripping. They'll sink a bit better after they are in the water awhile. I would tie some with wire, or coneheads if you really want them to sink, and see what suits you. 2X heavy wire hooks couldn't hurt but it isn't going to solve it. They are not going to sink like a beaded nymph unless you weight them considerably.

 

[pafishslayer]

They will tend to ride high in current or while stripping. They'll sink a bit better after they are in the water awhile. I would tie some with wire, or coneheads if you really want them to sink, and see what suits you. 2X heavy wire hooks couldn't hurt but it isn't going to solve it. They are not going to sink like a beaded nymph unless you weight them considerably.

Thanks I appreciate the help I've only been tying and fly fishing for 6 months so I'm still learning


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[ia_trouter]

Thanks I appreciate the help I've only been tying and fly fishing for 6 months so I'm still learning


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Most of us here are learning. Not sure what you are up to but I tie them around 4" long for bass and smaller pike fishing. They are deadly stripped just over the top of weeds just below the surface. I don't weight them much usually so I can say just above the trash. They swim nicely. I don't use them for trout around here so somebody else will have to help with that application. But generally having variations in your fly weighting is handy unless you fish the exact same water always. Change the current and it's not the same fly anymore so you have to adjust on the water. There aren't too many things more important than being able to put the fly at approximately the correct depth.

 

[ejsell]

I use lead dumbbell eyes on mine sometimes. The front will bounce on the rocks with the hook and tail riding high. Looks like a small fish feeding off of the bottom.I know a few people including myself who will drown them under my boot at the edge of the stream just to make sure they are soaked through first.

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[pafishslayer]

The weird thing is I've made one with a bead head a used a bunch of lead on the body and it still floats . I just made one with the body completely with lead wire and just used a piece of zonker and some dubbing . And it's still floating . I set it in the water for a few minutes so it I would think if it was gonna sink it would of

that's how much .25 lead I put on there

my hope was to use it how you said for small pike and bass , but I can't even get it down a foot


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---------- Post added at 07:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:38 PM ----------

I use lead dumbbell eyes on mine sometimes. The front will bounce on the rocks with the hook and tail riding high. Looks like a small fish feeding off of the bottom.I know a few people including myself who will drown them under my boot at the edge of the stream just to make sure they are soaked through first.

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That's a smart idea soaking them completely thru by standing on it . Thanks for the help


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[ia_trouter]

Got any spin fishing split shot laying around? Throw some on there and play until you see how much it takes to drag that much rabbit down. You've got enough zonker there to tie a number of trout flies. (as you should for a pike fly). I can't say I've seen it but I think rabbits probably float pretty well. The same things that keep them warm make their hide float. You may not need to get down quite as far as you think if you are fishing for pike in the weeds. When they are active they will launch out of the water trying to eat a zonker. Keep working with it because it is worth the effort. And tie a chartreuse or yellow version. Money back guaranteed for pike. Other colors work of course but I am certain I have caught 1000+ pike on those two colors. There seems to be a trend developing for me.

 

[pafishslayer]

Got any spin fishing split shot laying around? Throw some on there and play until you see how much it takes to drag that much rabbit down. You've got enough zonker there to tie a number of trout flies. (as you should for a pike fly). I can't say I've seen it but I think rabbits probably float pretty well. The same things that keep them warm make their hide float. You may not need to get down quite as far as you think if you are fishing for pike in the weeds. When they are active they will launch out of the water trying to eat a zonker. Keep working with it because it is worth the effort. And tie a chartreuse or yellow version. Money back guaranteed for pike.

Thanks dude I really appreciate the help , yeah they must float really well lol. , I'll try the split shot. When your fishing it over weeds , are you fishing a sinking line or floating?


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[ia_trouter]

Thanks dude I really appreciate the help , yeah they must float really well lol. , I'll try the split shot. When your fishing it over weeds , are you fishing a sinking line or floating?


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Typically a floating line, but a sink tip can be used in the right situation. Most places I fish for pike the weeds are almost to the surface by mid June. When chasing larger fish off a weed breakline a sinking line will get the fly down much better. It's going to depend on the water conditions. If you get too crazy weighting the fly pretty soon you aren't fly casting. But whatever works.

And I am going to try ejsells barbell idea. You can tie an oversized barbell on a hook much more secure than a cone head. An oversized conehead that weighs as much as a barbell will just ride off the hook eye without adhesive and/or building up thread.

 

[pafishslayer]

I know I've said it a bunch But thanks


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[ia_trouter]

I know I've said it a bunch But thanks


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No problem at all. I wish I knew half as much about trout fishing. You have fun. Small to medium pike are a good fish to target if you are new. They aren't picky about a perfect fly when they are feeding like they often do on an overcast day or early evening. Spring is even better. when larger fish are much more likely to be shallow. Sometimes you get lucky but when pike fishing in August expect the fish to run smaller. They are a cool water species and the big ones don't typically sit in four feet water when it's hot or bright.

 

[silver creek]

Hi guys , so I'm new to tying flies with zonker but I'm running into some issue that I'm wondering if someone can help me with.Ive tied 2 flies with zonker strips and I've followed videos and books and do it exactly the same way as they do but every time I test them in my test tank they always float , even after i try to hold them under the water. Doesn't make sense since they are suppost to be bottom flies. Wondering if someone can help . I know adding lead wire would help but at this point almost the whole shank of the hook is covered. Thanks in advance , Nick

They float because AIR is trapped in the fur.

Take your fly and soak it in the stream, mash it up in you hand so the water gets INTO the fur and the tanned leather, then tie it on the hook. It will then sink on the first cast.

The other thing you can do is to use Gehrke's Xink, which is a sinkant. A sinkant is a surfactant (surface active agent). Surfactants destroy water's surface tension and surface tension is what supports the fly and keeps water from getting into the fur of the zonker.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jDfTycS3fg

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jDfTycS3fg[/ame]

 

[pafishslayer]

They float because AIR is trapped in the fur.

Take your fly and soak it in the stream, mash it up in you hand so the water gets INTO the fur and the tanned leather, then tie it on the hook. It will then sink on the first cast.

The other thing you can do is to use Gehrke's Xink, which is a sinkant. A sinkant is a surfactant (surface active agent). Surfactants destroy water's surface tension and surface tension is what supports the fly and keeps water from getting into the fur of the zonker.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jDfTycS3fg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jDfTycS3fg

Thanks for the suggestions !


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[hokiehunter07]

The other thing I haven't seen listed in inspecting your zonkers before you buy them. In addition to water trapped in the hair, the "leather" of the strips is very buoyant. If you buy strips that have a very thick leather layer they're aren't going to sink as well as those with a thinner layer. You can combat this a bit by really cinching down the leather with your thread, but that doesn't work as that well.

Add weight and in other places use the buoyancy to your advantage. I tie small strips like claws on crawfish flies. the buoyancy of the strips make the claws float a bit and wiggle in the current. Looks like a crawfish defending itself.

Hokie.

 

[ia_trouter]

That's a good point Hokey. You can also make the strips a little thinner with a razor blade, or buy lower priced zonker next time which is usually sparser. I don't think it is the bulk of a good quality zonker strip that attracts pike. I think it is the long profile that swims and gives the appearance of a leech or worm. I'd just tie up a few heavily weighted versions for when he really wants to sink them and be done with it. He'll probably forget all about this thread if he finds some good pike water and drags them just over and through the weeds. There are occasions when pike do sit near the bottom, they will actually scavenge in the hard times of winter. But actively feeding moderate sized pike are generally hovering in the shade of the weeds waiting for a victim to swim above them. Much like a LM Bass when they are active in the shallows. I'm sure I sound like Mister know-it-all by now but I had a bad pike addiction and chased these guys exclusively for over 20 years. They are pretty predictable in the right water and weather.

 

[pafishslayer]

I bought the only zonker the store had lol. I believe it was natures spirit


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