Streamer Question/Survey

[weiliwen]

I recently saw an SBS for a streamer called "Nation's Silvertip." It's named after Bill Nation, a famous BC guide of yore. Although it uses no bucktail, it got me started on a "streamer of consciousness" internet search, if you'll forgive the pun. I saw lots of older streamers, many if not most using bucktail. Indeed, the word "bucktail' was seemingly used as a synonym for streamer.

Nowadays, however, I note that most modern streamers, even if they previously might have used bucktail, now use synthetics - Congo Hair, etc. If any of you tie these flies, do you still use bucktail, or have you also moved to synthetics for the same purpose?

 

[flytire]

i use natural hairs for all of my "bucktail" and "hairwing" fly patterns

i do not tie the big ugly flies using gongo this and ep fibers that

 

[mcnerney]

I don't tie streamers using bucktail anymore, with the one exception. I tie streamers (using bucktail) for my neighbor who goes to Alaska every year. He was kind enough to help me plow my driveway following my heart surgery so this is a way to pay back his generosity and kindness. Recently, I bought a bunch of ducktail off one of the forum members, now I'm set for the next 20 years. LOL!

 

[bigjim5589]

I tie some rather large streamers and also prefer the natural materials & tie a lot with bucktail, as I tie both flies & jigs. I currently have about 300 bucktails in my supplies.

I also like fur strips for streamers, particularly rabbit. I've started using some synthetics, mainly because they're available & length with natural materials can be a problem when tying big flies for saltwater species, Muskie, Pike or Peacock Bass. Primarily they're used to gain the necessary length, and I'm still usually combining them with natural materials.

However, I've yet to find any synthetic that replaces the natural, as they just do not have the same movement.

I also haven't jumped on the bandwagon for patterns such as Kelly Galloup & some others have developed. Some patterns I may tie are basically similar, but IMO, most of those patterns are more complex than they need to be & simple patterns still work as well.

BTW, not a knock on Mr. Galloup either, or any other tyer. I'm sure his patterns catch plenty of fish, and they seem to have a good following. The names given to them are certainly catchy! :icon_roll IMO, he's not only an excellent fly tyer but a marketing genius as well! :worthy:

 

[hambone111]

I am a purist on only the Clouser Minnow. I dont make any material subs on that pattern.

I think a lot of patterns that have come out in the last 2-4 years are based around very specific materials and how they all work in the build of the fly, so a lot of modern synthetics don't sub in and out of recipes well when copying patterns. at least in my experience.

I stick within the 3-5" length rule for all my patterns and don't tie anything articulated just for reference, almost all smallmouth river fishing.

bucktail is still very useful because it is naturally light weight, doesn't have a lot of water drag, and is generally stiff. if you know where to trim a bucktail you can get either a lot or no flare and anything in between depending on thread wrapping tension also. so yeah, i have a decent stock of it. and i dont really stickle over material price, as id rather have the right material than a cheep one, but bucktail is generally pretty cheep to buy and its effective when building mass and creating shape/length so i think its pretty important.

EP fibers, Faux bucktail, and the like are good for some things but if you're talking about tying a clouser with synthetics over buck-tail, idk if you would really notice a change in cast, drag, or shape.

 

[weiliwen]

By the way, sorry for mis-placing this thread, and thanks for moving it to the proper place!

I just received a buck tail from a hunter friend of mine. I butterflied it, removed the bone, scraped off fat and flesh from the skin, and now it's drying covered with non-iodized salt. Once that's done, I'll wash it as well as possible (that deer should have wiped his ass better!) and then decide what to do with it.

In the Driftless Area where I fish, those articulated monstrosities are all the rage, but I just can't get myself to use them. At the same time, I know that bigger streamers fished in deep holes can catch browns that are disproportionately large for the stream they're in, and I want some of that action. Some of the bucktail flies that imitate minnows or even small trout look like just the ticket to me.

 

[Ard]

I don't do the huge articulated flies with two hooks, but tubes, they seem to be able to meet any needs I have. I tie with a lot of Angora Goat which is similar to monkey hair, something about using monkey doesn't seem right so............ The goat hair is soft and flows with a undulating quality to it, the flies seem to always catch a fish if there are fish where I'm at. I'm now making almost all my streamers on Pro Micro Tubes and using a clear vinyl tubing I get at a rubber supply in Anchorage for extension tubing. With this tying technique I can make tiny flies if that is what I need for a small stream or use the clear extension tubing to make something 4" long with a hook right where I need it.

This would be a good example; Click to enlarge



The longer the hair the longer the hook extension. You use a jam knot to tie on a size 6 or 8 trailer hook. It takes a little practice to get your knot skills up to speed but ideally you want the knot to go up the tube and hit the smaller tube the fly is tied on. The knot leaves a long enough loop so that the hook eye is pulled into that clear tubing and the length of the shank and hook itself protrude beyond. If I don't react when I feel a fish nip at a fly like that they will hook themselves and I've not yet had anything hooked too deep down the mouth. Even for large fish like steelhead I stick to the small hooks because I leave the barb.

 

[bigjim5589]

How about something like this? Based on the Clouser Half & Half, but with a barred rabbit strip tail. It's also tied with Coyote tail hair, but bucktail will work as well. This one is about 5" long on a 1/0 hook.

Edit: Took me some time to find this other pic. Same style streamer, but tied with bucktail. It's about 6" long on a 2/0 hook.

 

[Rip Tide]

I am absolutely a purest when it comes to bucktail and I've proven their worth to myself time and time again.
Here in the northeast salt there's no better fly than the deceiver and it's variations, and the traditional northern NewEngland bucktails may look antiquated but there's a reason why there's so many of them and why they've been popular for so long.
All with real deer tail.
The Black Nose Dace and the MickyFinn were 2 of the first flies that I learned to tie and I still carry them. In fact there's one fishery where the only fly that I use is a MickyFinn. It's all you need.

Bucktails were a pure American invention. Not an import from England as were most other early flies.
As you may remember from the story of Robin Hood, hunting deer in Briton was a crime.

 

[trout trekker]

Put me in the " Uses Bucktail " column.

Dave

 

[philly]

I still like buck tail. Clousers, Buck Tail Deceivers, Hollow Fleyes, teasers, a couple of pike flies I tie up that are variations of Bob Popovics Semper Fleye. I prefer artificial materials like Mirror Image ans Senyo Lazer Dub for most of my bait fish patterns.

 

[duker]

I still like bucktail and have them in 7 different colours. As others have pointed out, there's just something about it that synthetics don't have. I especially like it for Clousers--all fish are helpless when faced with a bucktail Clouser. I do use Kraft Fur for some saltwater patterns (Gotchas, mostly) and I've tied a few Clousers with it, but they just don't seem. . .right.

Scott

 

[karstopo]

I use both. I tied up several bucktail clousers today mainly for freshwater. It’s hard to beat a bucktail clouser for versatility in either freshwater or the salt. Some of the saltwater fish will tear up bucktail pretty quickly so I’ll use a synthetic sometimes for those. I’ve used a black nosed dace tied with bucktail and those work well here in the freshwater. Bucktail deceivers are good in the salt here but so are some of the synthetic baitfish.

I like working with bucktail, yak, and other natural fibers/hair. Seems like a lot of patterns can be done with natural fibers or a synthetic or some combination. I get on kicks and I’m more on a natural fiber or feather way of thinking for the moment.

 

[duker]

Just FYI, there's a very good article in this month's Fly Tyer magazine entitled "Everything You Need to Know About Using Deer Hair".

Scott

 

[dean_mt]

Both. I'm not a purist, but I play one on the internet! Not really, I don't even do that. All you purists: God bless you, I absolutely love looking at your flies and I love that you are out there. I can do it, not very well, but I have and I appreciate it. I wanted to learn how to tie featherwings and bucktails a few winters ago and became OK at it. I just love the old patterns. I love the connections to history in the sport, it's important to me. But I'm not beholden to it.

But I'm also a 21st Century man and appreciate the unnatural fibers and materials. Many of them are easier to tie with and have better action/look in the water. It's true. Most things can be improved upon. I just don't find any reason to resist or look down my nose at new materials and new flies.

I even started tying with foam this year!!

 

[Rip Tide]

It's not about being a purist.
I've proven to myself over and over that bucktail absolutely works better on streamers such as deceivers and Clouser minnows.
It's not that I don't use synthetics. A bluefish will rip apart flies with bucktail and unless you're good with sacrificing a fly to every single fish, synthetics are the way to go.
That doesn't mean that they work better though. For whatever reason, bucktail is just superior.

 

[Rip Tide]

This coming season will be my 40th year fly fishing the salt and from day one I've used bucktails
Back then it was black nose dace and MickyFinns as they were the only streamers that I knew how to tie at the time, but over the years I've had plenty of opportunity to experiment and ponder.
I can't prove it of course, but there's no doubt in my mind that real bucktail is the superior material

 

[fr8dog]

I use everything. I mix and match to get what I want. I have pretty much every color of bucktail, EP fiber, and a batch of other hairs and feathers to make streamers that I throw.

I do appreciate the folks that tie up traditional patterns. There is some serious work out there to keep the artwork alive and it's important to the sport.

 

[bigjim5589]

I just posted this fly in the "What Have You Been Tying thread". It's a Flatwing style Deceiver, and to me makes sense that bucktail is the proper material to use in a fly like this. Bucktail gives it not only movement, but form that synthetics don't have. The bucktail naturally flares out, even when cut from the tip end of the tail, synthetics do not. Bucktail will undulate & breath when this fly is being stripped, even though some synthetics have good movement, it's still not the same or as good as what you'll get with bucktail.

It's about 6" long on a 2/0 VMC 7319 offset plastic worm hook.