A well balanced quiver

Petrus

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Over the years I’ve spent a lot of money on rods. Some buys have reflected a change in preference, but for a large part I’m not sure. Maybe I was just chasing the rainbow. It resulted in too many rods, some just collecting dust in the closet. When the closet was full, the least used rods got banned to the attic.

I was actually relieved when I found out that some rods did not make it during a move back from France a while ago. It gave me room to re-think my approach.

I used to think that rods made of cane were beautiful and expensive, but inferior. Over the years, I´v come to appreciate softer tapers, and that was my initial key word for cane. I’v since found cane can be both fast or slow. Some fishermen fish only cane, some only glass, but most people I meet fish only graphite. I think I will end up with a mix. But I´m not sure what constitues a god mix. Cane up to 8’6 #5, graphite above, or cane for short casts and graphite for long? Is there a god demarcation dictated by materials, and between cane and graphite in particular, or is it desided by tapers?
 
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LePetomane

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Good point for discussion. I think the answer is a moving target and rests with the particular angler. For me it is pretty clear. When fishing from a drift boat using weighted nymphs or the rare streamer I only use graphite. I think that for me it is better suited for that type of fishing. Wade fishing dries or dry/dropper combination, that is a different story. For me that is where bamboo excels. I feel I can cast more accurately when targeting rising fish with the cane rods I own. I also think that bamboo protects lighter tippets better than graphite.

My wife just returned from a trip to western Montana. I always give here a hard time because she likes drift boat fishing and I do not. I call her the Drift Boat Queen. Interestingly, she didn't spend one second in a drift boat. All wade fishing with streamers or weighted nymphs. Not a single dry. Her beautiful bamboo by Dave Norling stayed in the tube the whole time. She took 4 fish over 20 inches one day. The Norling would have handled those easily.

So for me it is different strokes for different folks.
 

Petrus

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What‘s special about drift boat fishing? Quick casts, quick change of direction, precision and need for a long rod to keep tip high course you are sitting?

I stay on my feet while fishing, and for trout it’s single dries most of the time. Seem like the homeland of cane. But I often hike to mountain lakes where wind is a constant companion.
 
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proheli

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Quiver is an interesting word. If all you do is fish blue lines, then your single 804 or 763 is the only rod you might need or want. A quiver of one.
 
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Hayden Creek

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Sitting in a drift boat while casting? No one I know of.
Even when floating I fish whatever rod feels right at the time. My quiver is pretty well balanced. A few graphite, a few glass, and a couple of cane. All have been fished out of a drift boat.
All about the situation in front of me, whether I am floating or walking.
 

zjory

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Quiver is an interesting word. If all you do is fish blue lines, then your single 804 or 763 is the only rod you need. A quiver of one.
All I do is fish blue lines. I wouldn't want to do it without my 622, 763 and 844. Having said that, I could certainly do it with just the 763 or 884.
 

LOC

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Good point for discussion. I think the answer is a moving target and rests with the particular angler.
So for me it is different strokes for different folks.
This is how I see it myself.
I like having a variety of materials, lengths, tapers and configurations.

Also for myself it's not always going to be about having the perfect rod for the situation.
I'll often do the exact opposite and fish a rod way out of it's comfort zone.

Some of my most memorably moments occur not being comfortable. YMMV. :)
 

LePetomane

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What‘s special about drift boat fishing? Quick casts, quick change of direction, precision and need for a long rod to keep tip high course you are sitting?
Personally I would rather walk/wade but on some big western rivers a drift boat may be the only way to get to some areas. The Montana section of the Bighorn has four access areas in a span of 20 miles. Practically speaking, a drift boat is the only way to get to most of the river. It is a project. Arranging for a shuttle so your truck/trailer will be at the take-out, preparing the boat, etc. A lot of work.
 

Hayden Creek

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Definitely more work but at least locally it is your only opportunity to fish alot of the water. The upper Juan is only floatable for a few weeks every year. Miles of water through private access. But they can't stop you from fishing through.
 

Petrus

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Access to streams is made easy by regulation in Norway, but the right to fish is not, at least not always. If you have the right to fish, the only reasons for doing it from a boat is terrain, lack of reach or personal preference.

All I do is fish blue lines. I wouldn't want to do it without my 622, 763 and 844. Having said that, I could certainly do it with just the 763 or 884.
Thanks for sharing Your views. I migth a stretch your words, but my interpretation is:
A well balanced minimum quiver for blue lines consists of rods for lines # 2-4, getting longer as the line weigth increases. At least two rods. As far as material goes, anything that float your (drift) boat.

When I started fly fishing in the early eighties a five weight was considered a do it all rod. I saved up for a 9 feet Hardy. Made of glass. Did all my fishing with it for years, but put it away when I got graphite. Strung it up again a couple of years back. It is lousy for distance, at least in my hands, but ok at everything else.

In addition to a well balanced quiver for blue lines, I definitely need a rod for long casts for trout and grayling. I’v read somewhere that you loose approximately 10 percent distance with a cane, compared to graphite. Still, I have high hopes for distance on an 8’6 #4 hollowbuilt I have on order. Time will tell.

“Also for myself it's not always going to be about having the perfect rod for the situation.
I'll often do the exact opposite and fish a rod way out of it's comfort zone.”


This! It’s simply less fun if it’s easy!
 
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rsagebrush

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Although the last time I was in a driftboat it was in Virginia in Dec. of 2013 (wow) fishing for Musky, those flies and 10 wts wear me out I went with a baitcaster, it was more fun for me, like target shooting. Basically I don't miss drifboat fishing but then again I can access most areas in this part of the US by foot and bicycle. Out west or on bigger water I generally use my Watermaster which has paid for itself many times over, I just get a shuttle.

I used all three materials previously in drifboats, didn't make much difference as far as I could tell, just have a good boatman he can pretty much put you where you should be or he's not worth the money and most of them are pretty good at it. I mean really you don't need to cast all that far anyways using a boat and it's rather silly to do so.

Blue lining is mostly bamboo, fiberglass and some graphite (8' 2wt Superfine 4pce). Still on that type of water I prefer bamboo in 3 and 4wt. Actually this is my favorite type of water. It's a hassle free way to fish and the scenery is usually quite nice too. My next favorite is medium sized water and I still prefer bamboo, it feels so nice and organic ;).

But I always throw a fixed line rod into the backpack.
 

thomasw

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Interesting discussion in this thread.

For me I have used and still use graphite, bamboo and glass, and I think it is about the individual rod's characteristics/taper traits and secondarily about its material constituency. Though graphite is generally viewed as a faster, stiffer material, I will assert that a graphite rod can be designed in so many ways; it depends so much on its taper design as implemented on the material. The same can be seen in glass and bamboo designs to some extent, too. For fishing floating flies, one can really pick the rod characteristics for a given environs and go fish with a rod that fits the bill whether it be made of bamboo, graphite or glass. I recall Tom Morgan writing that "... a good rod is a good rod is a good rod. What you are really looking at are attributes and characteristics.... I have really strong convictions that you need to make a rod that is going to fish for Trout in the 20 to 55 foot range. If it doesn't really bend or flex for that, then you have got the wrong rod. So with any one of the materials (glass, graphite or bamboo, etc.) the characteristics of the rod should still be the same."

I hope this contributes to this thread in a thought provoking way...
 

Meuniere

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There's an evolution that you experience, and different directions that take you, and eventually, even if you can fish every rod ever made pretty well, you make a selective, purely personal call. I much, much prefer medium-action rods, and always have, I've been doing this for 45+ years, so I grew up with them. For me, simply put: Bamboo for smaller stuff, graphite for bigger things, and honestly, glass can cover the whole spectrum without a worry. And I am learning bamboo can handle damn near anything, really, but you HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF IT.

Accuracy is available in any format, so personal preference and the test of time really decide things. I think the "quiver" can be whatever you want, if you know yourself well when on the water.
 

rsagebrush

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Bamboo is very tuff stuff more so than graphite or fiberglass, just don't put it away wet and you'll do fine. The tips can take a set though I always shake my rod out at the end of the day and that suffices quite well, besides minor sets are traditional.

Bamboo can be made very fast, try a Dickerson Guide model or a Parabolic 15 or even a Leonard 49 DF.
 

Petrus

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Mighty expensive rods!

We are moving out of the quiver for small waters.

For big waters I would like a long casting rod in # 4 or 5. I would certainly like to have that rod in cane, or perhaps translucent glass for funky style. But, this is one place in a well balanced quiver where function might dictate a stiff graphite.

But it might depend on why one casts shorter with a cane than a graphite. Is it because it’s harder to keep a tight loop with the cane? If so, I’m not sure the 10 percent loss in distance is independent of skill and distance, since air resistance is squared by velocity (I admit l’m wading in deep water here. My teacher in school was less than impressed by my physics skills, and I’v since forgotten most of the skills I tried to impress him with). If I remember correctly the person who came up with the 10 percent is a very good caster, casting 100-110 feet (with a cane).


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rsagebrush

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Marvin Hedge hit 161 feet with a bamboo single hand rod. Not that this really matters when one is actually fly fishing.
It's the operator not the rod. I don't think I would like mending at that distance.

John Tarantino cast 227 feet with a 2 handed Powell Bamboo.

Steve Rajeff 243 feet with graphite.

I think Lefty Kreh could cast a whole line without a rod at all.

Of course casting is not fishing which I think many people get a bit muddled about.

I have no trouble reaching fishing distances with a bamboo fly rod.

So I guess if one is in competion casting graphite may be the way to go then, but then again this forum is about fly fishing is it not.
 
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Petrus

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He, he, at 161 feet it´s difficult to set the hook for sure.
On Marvin, I found this:

"In 1938, after a visit by the American casting legend Marvin Hedge at Hardy's, the company introduced "Tournament" lines of 43 and 53 yards length, respectively, named "Marvin K. Hedge Taper". These lines were manufactured by the "SA Jones Line Company" of Norwich, NY, and stocked in 11 sizes, numbers 10, 12, 14, 16, 18, 20, 22, 26, 70, 75, 80, from "Fly Weight" to "Heavyweight Distance Tournament". They were only catalogued for one year, as the outbreak of WW II precluded any further importation from the United States."

In one particular mountain lake I’m fishing regularly, there is shallow water perhaps 20 meter out. Large trouts are up feeding there when the conditions are right. Marvin Hedge and a bunch of other good fly fishermen could reach them with any of my cane rods, I might just about reach them if the wind is rigth and I use a stiff graphite. I’v got access to a boat on that lake, and could easily reach them if I used it. But I don’t.
 
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Petrus

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Quiver is an interesting word. If all you do is fish blue lines, then your single 804 or 763 is the only rod you might need or want. A quiver of one.
As some people collect bamboo for their history, I wanted to avoid the word “collection”.
Quiver turned out to be an unfortunate alternative
 
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