Best knots for 6x??

Tony Blundetto

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So lately, I’ve been using a lot more 6x than 5x, and I seem to experiencing more knot failure than normal. Both at terminal knots and tippet to tippet connections. I use a double/triple surgeons knot and improved clinch knots.

Are there any knots that are more effective for thin diameter line? My knots always break on the hook set, it’s possible my issues are mechanical and not so much the knot. I very rarely have knots break when fighting fish (I only catch small fish so that helps.) I use a 4 wt rod for whatever that’s worth.

Im excited to read some replies, as I don’t know anyone in real life who likes to nerd out over knots LOL.
 

proheli

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Hm. It's been so long since I had a knot break. I just use clinch or imp clinch. It might be your tippit material is old but it could be you just need more care when tying the knot. Wet the tippit first, 5 turns, gently massage it into place. If the clinch knot really was a bad knot we'd all be screaming bloody murder. You can read the lb. strength on the packaging and easily pull that hard when you tie the knot to check its strength. If you are breaking knots on the set, that means you are possibly being needlessly harmful to the fish. Just raise the rod, or raise and move the tip downstream depending on how you like to do it. Take a full second to do it. ONE THOUSAND ONE. ONE MISS ISS IPP EE. There is a difference between a quick hook set and a fast hard one. So, chill baby.
 
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el jefe

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For tippet-to-tippet I like the blood knot. Surgeon's knots break regularly on me, blood knots rarely, if ever. I haven't used a surgeon's knot in years.

For tippet to fly, I like the non-slip mono loop. Because the knot is away from the hook eye, you don't have to trim the knot that closely, which allows for some slippage. The knots located at the eye better be tightened down very well before you trim them, and I find that harder to do the smaller the tippet diameter gets.
 

Cheeseman

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Tippet to tippet I have been using tippet rings tied with uni knots, 5-7 twists. Before that, I was using blood knots. I also like the non-slip loop know for terminal to the hook for the same reasons el jefe brings up.
 

Upstate08

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Another vote for the Orvis knot. I used the clinch knot for 20 years without a problem. I, too, started having failures when using finer tippet. The Orvis knot hasn’t failed me yet
 

sweetandsalt

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It may be older mono but most likely you are not thoroughly seating your knots thus a slip occurs causing breakage. Do not just pull knot tight, seat them by slipping your coils together with your fingers then slowly pull both standing and tag ends until full tightened...TEST: then try to break your knot.

Like most, I employ a 6 turn Blood Knot for tippets but rather than the fine Clinch, I prefer the Trileen.
 

osseous

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I use the Trilene on streamers- can't see going thru the eye of a midge 2 times with 6X tippet? One of the nice things about the Orvis knot is that it seats perfectly every time.

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thomasw

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For tippet to tippet in leader construction I use a back to back 3 or 4 turn nail knot with that tie-fast tool (it is called a nail knot splice by some which I don't quite understand -- but that's just me I think). It seats well adn it is very strong. With tippet to flies I think it is just super imperative to tie your knot well, that is, to practise your arsenal of knots until your muscle memory allows you tie them with confidence. FWIW the non-slip mono, trilene, orvis and even a nail knot all are fantastic for attaching flies with all sizes of tippet -- I've never had a failure. The cool thing about getting proficient with the nail knot in attaching flies is that you will learn how to adjust your tippet so that you don't burn through tippet (an economical aspect which it shares with orvis knot) and when tying on larger flies like hoppers etc one can tie it easily with a double pass through the hook eye. Yes, I am a fan of that tie fast tool despite being more of an old school fingers only sort guy with my knots. Hope this helps someone.
 

Tony Blundetto

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Thanks for the help everyone!

Ive been tying up a few of these at home while I watch TV for practice.
 

haziz

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Try the Orvis knot- small and strong

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I too like the Orvis knot. At least for me, and the way I tie knots, I find the Orvis knot to be stronger than a clinch knot. Again for me, I find that the "regular" clinch knot is actually stronger than the "improved" clinch knot! I still prefer the Orvis knot over both. Of course many esteemed fly fisherman have used the clinch knot over the years and for them it has been plenty strong; so this is definitely a case of YMMV, and is highly dependent on the quirks of how each of us ties their knots. Of course more practice never hurt!
 

johan851

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I too like the Orvis knot. At least for me, and the way I tie knots, I find the Orvis knot to be stronger than a clinch knot. Again for me, I find that the "regular" clinch knot is actually stronger than the "improved" clinch knot! I still prefer the Orvis knot over both. Of course many esteemed fly fisherman have used the clinch knot over the years and for them it has been plenty strong; so this is definitely a case of YMMV, and is highly dependent on the quirks of how each of us ties their knots. Of course more practice never hurt!
Herein is, I think, the most reasonable criticism of the clinch or improved clinch: it seems kind of finicky. It's not that it's a bad knot when done right, but getting it right does is not always trivial given inconsistency from person to person and the necessary tips, tricks, etc. I know that when I started out about 50% of my improved clinch knots would fail. Now, years of practice later, I'm much faster and it's probably down to 10%.

If there's an alternative that's more repeatable, especially for beginners, that's a big win. As long as knots are inherently strong enough I'd wager that consistency causes more problems for folks than a few percentage points of strength with ideally executed specimens.

I'm going to give the Orvis knot a try this year. Having done a few practice rounds it seems very easy to execute.
 

ottosmagic13

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I've been having great success with the Double Davy. Quick to tie, small, strong and, importantly, easy to verify that it's tied correctly (90* tag). I used the clinch knot prior. I use the Rapala/Kreh loop knot (non-slip loop) for streamers and/or tippet 0x and larger.

I use triple surgeons or a tippet ring with smaller diameter line to line. Larger diameter I use the Double Uni jam. I've never been good at tying blood knots. I tend to use clinch knots with the tippet rings, making sure to lubricate well and making sure the coils "cinch" nicely - if tied at home I use UV cure to further secure.
 

el jefe

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I've been having great success with the Double Davy. Quick to tie, small, strong and, importantly, easy to verify that it's tied correctly (90* tag). I used the clinch knot prior. I use the Rapala/Kreh loop knot (non-slip loop) for streamers and/or tippet 0x and larger.

I use triple surgeons or a tippet ring with smaller diameter line to line. Larger diameter I use the Double Uni jam. I've never been good at tying blood knots. I tend to use clinch knots with the tippet rings, making sure to lubricate well and making sure the coils "cinch" nicely - if tied at home I use UV cure to further secure.
It's funny how we are with knots. I can't use a surgeon's knot of any number (double, triple, quadruple, whatever) for line-to-line. Should be easy, but it's not (pun intended) for me. I can tie beautiful blood knots, even in-stream. I think that's because I practiced the blood knots...a lot...and my fingers and hands just know what to do. I am just no good at getting a surgeon's knot to close down cleanly and not have the line cut into itself. I just suck at it. I have begun to employ the tippet ring, though, not to replace all line-to-line connections, but just to preserve the butt portion of the leader.
 

LePetomane

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For leader to tippet I use what fly fishermen call a triple surgeons knot. It is important to not join tippets to leaders of markedly different sizes. If you do, the knot may fail. A leader that tapers to 4X will only get 4X or 5X tippet.

For tippet to fly I started using the Double Davy knot.

As an aside I asked a friend who is a surgeon what a "surgeon's knot" was. She had no idea. They just call it a knot.
 
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