One of my favorite guys to fish with is a electrical engineer.
Heading down a river doing recon he's telling me to write down odometer readings and milage markers and I'm telling him just remember the big tree. lol
Changing Rods
- Thread starter Txbart
- Start date
One of my favorite guys to fish with is a electrical engineer.
Heading down a river doing recon he's telling me to write down odometer readings and milage markers and I'm telling him just remember the big tree. lol
Mr Engineer- See if this makes sense: if you have a curve in your backcast, you cannot load the rod on the forward cast until your stroke has straightened that curve... only when your rod is pulling against a straight flyline can its weight be acted upon.
Our joints and opposing musculature lead to curved backcasts. You must recognize and correct for this with your backcast stroke until you are throwing straight backcasts. At that point, you will feel load in any flyrod, with any line
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Our joints and opposing musculature lead to curved backcasts. You must recognize and correct for this with your backcast stroke until you are throwing straight backcasts. At that point, you will feel load in any flyrod, with any line
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tcorfey
Well-known member
Rest assured that Recon in 6wt is a very good rod. I have one and I can cast anything from a 4wt to an 8wt line with it. What I use it for is mostly unweighted streamers so I use a Salmon Steelhead line taper in 6wt. My line is from Rio but several manufacturers make a line for this purpose.
If you put in some time on your timing and technique and let the rod do the work, don't try to force it, you will be fine.
You could try this exercise. Let out about 15 of of line and perform a side armed cast for your forward and back cast. make sure the rod and especially the tip has a flat trajectory. Now you can see the rod and the line during the cast. Vary your speed and timing to see how it affects the rod, then slowly increase the amount of line you have out. Notice any changes? After you understand the speed and timing you need to make the rod work for you, switch back to an overhead cast and try to repeat what you just learned. Remember the rod tip must always follow a straight path and don't allow your line to become slack during the stroke or when in transition from backward to forward cast but, you must allow the fly to finish it's backward trajectory before you start your forward cast. You need to time it so the forward cast begins just at the point where they fly reaches it's maximum distance behind you and do not creep forward in anticipation, you need to make decisive movements. Start slow, accelerate, stop, wait, accelerate the opposite direction, stop, wait, etc...
Hope that helps...
If you put in some time on your timing and technique and let the rod do the work, don't try to force it, you will be fine.
You could try this exercise. Let out about 15 of of line and perform a side armed cast for your forward and back cast. make sure the rod and especially the tip has a flat trajectory. Now you can see the rod and the line during the cast. Vary your speed and timing to see how it affects the rod, then slowly increase the amount of line you have out. Notice any changes? After you understand the speed and timing you need to make the rod work for you, switch back to an overhead cast and try to repeat what you just learned. Remember the rod tip must always follow a straight path and don't allow your line to become slack during the stroke or when in transition from backward to forward cast but, you must allow the fly to finish it's backward trajectory before you start your forward cast. You need to time it so the forward cast begins just at the point where they fly reaches it's maximum distance behind you and do not creep forward in anticipation, you need to make decisive movements. Start slow, accelerate, stop, wait, accelerate the opposite direction, stop, wait, etc...
Hope that helps...
I should just stick with it. You’ve been fishing / casting 10 months and appear to have made good headway with your 5w. The 6w will feel different and take a little while to tune into (especially when you are not used to trying different weight rods, models, makes).... the 6w is obviously a different weight and the characteristics of the model will make a huge difference... it won’t feel the same as your 5w, principally because it isn’t... and it never will feel the same. But stick with practicing with it and you’ll get more familiar with its characteristics and more confident with it.
in time and with more experience you’ll decide whether the characteristics of that 6w are for you or not...
in time and with more experience you’ll decide whether the characteristics of that 6w are for you or not...
half fast
Well-known member
I'll be joining you in a few weeks! I'm about to become a retired engineer after 36 years practicing in the defense industry.
Want a suggestion from another over-analytic geek? Get off the lawn and go fishing. With the added elements of actual fishing distracting you, you'll possibly stop overthinking the cast and it will begin to come to you naturally. At the very least it will put some fun back into it.
I know changing lines won’t shorten my learning curve but it seems logical that Clearwater and Recon rods are so different that they should require different lines. I talked to my latest instructor, who is also an Orvis Fly Fishing manager, he suggested I try Bank Shot, 23.5’ head. Chatted with Orvis Outfitter this morning, he suggested Pro Power Taper, 50’ compound head. I said a 50’ head will not change things for me if part of my issue with the Hydros Trout is the 49.5’ head. He said the double taper in the Power Taper behaves completely different than the taper on the Hydros. I think Bank Shot may not be as versatile as I want. Sounds Power Taper will do what a want and be a discriminator for my rods, 5wt for smaller fish/flies and 6wt for bigger flies/fish and longer casts.
I looked at Rio Creek that was recommenced on this thread. Sounds like the same type line as Orvis Bank Shot.
I looked at Rio Creek that was recommenced on this thread. Sounds like the same type line as Orvis Bank Shot.
jayr
Well-known member
Before you go buy another line see below:
My question would be, and maybe you have already answered it so forgive my asking again, what is your intended target species?
Size of stream or river you intend to spend the most time?
What rig are you primarily going to throw with it? Dry, dry dropper, streamer, double indicator, etc. ?
I plan to fish trout in the fall, winter and spring. Stockers while in Texas variety when I travel to the northwest. Most of summer is spent in Texas so that will be bass time. I like a dries, dry/dropper or stimulator/dropper. The only streamer type fly I have thrown is woolly buggers and clowsers but I want to expand. My sons like indicators, I have some in my vest but have yet to use them.
I plan to use my Clearwater 5wt for most of my trout fishing and my Recon 6wt for “bigger” fishing which includes bass, bigger trout and bigger water.
I plan to use my Clearwater 5wt for most of my trout fishing and my Recon 6wt for “bigger” fishing which includes bass, bigger trout and bigger water.
Last edited:
jayr
Well-known member
I have the discontinued Recon 906. For dries and dry dropper I have SA Mastery MPX and it does well. For throwing double nymph indicator rigs I have the AirFlo nymph line designed by Kelly Galloup and it absolutely hammers them. I get a lot of distance and those AirFlo lines are super slick. I would also think for dries and dry droppers the AirFlo lines Super Dri Elite and River and Stream would do very well.
I have gotten away from Rio lines due to issues I, and others I have talked to have had. My two go to line companies are AirFlo and SA.
I have gotten away from Rio lines due to issues I, and others I have talked to have had. My two go to line companies are AirFlo and SA.
Unknownflyman
Well-known member
If you do that, you will get really good fairly quickly, you will be keeping an eye on not ingraining bad habits into your casting stroke. Its easy to do, even over time Ive picked up some bad habits being lazy, and when my casting starts coming apart a bit, I have to re group and focus, get everything working again.
rangerrich99
Well-known member
Most likely the problem is that you're inexperienced. You just need to keep practicing.
Many years ago when I was still new to ff, I bought a 3 wt., and then the following week I tried to go fishing with it. Well, the day was mostly a disaster. Lots of tailing loops, I couldn't cast farther than about 2o feet, and half the time the leader wouldn't lay out straight, etc.
It wasn't until the very end of the day, about a half hour before sunset, after what was probably several hundred if not a thousand casts, that I finally got some good casts in. The reason? I was tired. I was so tired that I was pretty much just going through the motions, literally. But that's what I was doing wrong all day. I was trying to muscle the rod, and what it needed was a very light touch instead. Once I got tired, and I was just using enough muscle to lift the line on the back cast, then pausing for a second or two before gently pushing forward into the front cast, the rod did what it was made to do and it cast the line beautifully.
After that it still took several weeks of practice before I could consistently cast my 3 wt. adequately. But I did figure it out.
Right now you're trying to cast the 6 wt. as if it were a 5 wt., and it's not working. Keep practicing, learn just how firm you have to be with each rod and you'll cast both rods equally well. It's just going to take some time and effort.
Good luck.
Many years ago when I was still new to ff, I bought a 3 wt., and then the following week I tried to go fishing with it. Well, the day was mostly a disaster. Lots of tailing loops, I couldn't cast farther than about 2o feet, and half the time the leader wouldn't lay out straight, etc.
It wasn't until the very end of the day, about a half hour before sunset, after what was probably several hundred if not a thousand casts, that I finally got some good casts in. The reason? I was tired. I was so tired that I was pretty much just going through the motions, literally. But that's what I was doing wrong all day. I was trying to muscle the rod, and what it needed was a very light touch instead. Once I got tired, and I was just using enough muscle to lift the line on the back cast, then pausing for a second or two before gently pushing forward into the front cast, the rod did what it was made to do and it cast the line beautifully.
After that it still took several weeks of practice before I could consistently cast my 3 wt. adequately. But I did figure it out.
Right now you're trying to cast the 6 wt. as if it were a 5 wt., and it's not working. Keep practicing, learn just how firm you have to be with each rod and you'll cast both rods equally well. It's just going to take some time and effort.
Good luck.
rob bishline
Well-known member
All good advice above . One thing I’ll mention is the importance of the leader . You might have already taken it in account but I didn’t see it mentioned.
I remember taking a friend fishing once who had done a little fly fishing but had never thrown any streamers.
We spent part of the morning throwing smaller flies and I noticed his casting looked really good from downstream.. nice tight loops and good distance.
We switched to streamers and it became obvious he was really struggling.
I looked at his set up and his leader and tippet were way too light for the streamers we were throwing.
I set his Clearwater 9’ 6wt. With the appropriate streamer leader and he couldn’t believe the difference.
his casting and distance improved dramatically.
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I remember taking a friend fishing once who had done a little fly fishing but had never thrown any streamers.
We spent part of the morning throwing smaller flies and I noticed his casting looked really good from downstream.. nice tight loops and good distance.
We switched to streamers and it became obvious he was really struggling.
I looked at his set up and his leader and tippet were way too light for the streamers we were throwing.
I set his Clearwater 9’ 6wt. With the appropriate streamer leader and he couldn’t believe the difference.
his casting and distance improved dramatically.
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Chadflys
Well-known member
Without getting all technical. It seems you’ve got a pretty good feel with your 5wt. It you put it away and spend same amount of time with the 6 that you did with the 5 you’ll have a pretty good feel with the 6. Assuming appropriate line on each rod. At that point you will spend a little time to adjust back to the 5 and vise versa... Its just time and experience that with help you adjust faster. I’m like you and analyze everything. I’ve gone through the exact same thing and I’ve only been doing it 3 months.
silver creek
Well-known member
Txbart,
I suggest you try what Tim Corfey as suggested above.
He has gone back to the basics of learning to cast. Specifically, he is suggesting you try this exercise with the 6 wt rod so that you develop the muscle memory for the casting the 6 wt rod.
The next step is to learn the timing for the forward and back casts with that 6 wt rod.
I’m not sure if anyone recommended this but if you know someone more experienced with FF have them cast the rod or if you are near a fly shop have them cast the rod. That would rule out the rod or you. The fly shop may have a 7 wt line you can try.
I built a Sage Method 8wt. It’s a very fast rod. I ended up overlining it with 9wt Rio Outbound Short. It softened the rod enough to cast easily and with large flies. Compared to my Sage Pulse 7wt with 7wt line the 8wt is a much different rod requiring a different timing of my stroke. Both rods wake up when I have 40’ of line out.
My 2 cents
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I built a Sage Method 8wt. It’s a very fast rod. I ended up overlining it with 9wt Rio Outbound Short. It softened the rod enough to cast easily and with large flies. Compared to my Sage Pulse 7wt with 7wt line the 8wt is a much different rod requiring a different timing of my stroke. Both rods wake up when I have 40’ of line out.
My 2 cents
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I’ve fly fished for almost 45 years. I catch almost all of my trout inside of 40 feet. Being able to cast an entire line is a wonderful skill, but being able to cast accurately at 25-45 feet will certainly lead to more trout. I can’t speak to steelhead, salt water and the like, but the vast majority of your trout fishing will be closer than 50 feet. So, I would concentrate on accuracy if your primary target species is trout.
Chadflys
Well-known member
I agree. There are sever holes where I fish I can’t any closer than 50-55 ft.