Does the Forum need a Traditionalist Sub-Forum?

[Classtime]

I'm new here, but I see there are sub-forums for many of the "new" techniques. But I do not recognize a sub-forum for traditional or classic techniques. I think there is a need for a Classic and Vintage Fly Fishing Sub-Forum. (There is a Vintage Tackle Sub Forum but not one for using such tackle in a traditional fashion) Of course it would be enjoyable discussing over and over what C&V (Classic and Vintage) FlyFishing is or should be and I am sure that would come up. But more than likely it would not include EN or Skagit, or Switch, or whatever else some of us are unfamiliar and/or uncomfortable with.

 

[flytie09]

Perhaps. Might save me from getting into arguments about best Euro lines, mop material, gummi worm or jig hooks.

 

[Ard]

You may not have to wait for the poll to time out to see a new node added here. Personally I stay away from discussions that veer into methods I don't use and that alone limits my input to the forum anymore.

 

[Ard]

It's done

 

[redietz]

There are all too many subforums here, which are widely ignored. Everything gets dumped into the "General" category even when there are clearly subforums that are better suited.

Plus, when you ghettoize a given topic, people who may not be familiar with don't get exposed to things that might be potentially interesting.

 

[flav]

There are all too many subforums here, which are widely ignored. Everything gets dumped into the "General" category even when there are clearly subforums that are better suited.

Plus, when you ghettoize a given topic, people who may not be familiar with don't get exposed to things that might be potentially interesting.

I totally agree. Way too many sub forums that seldom see use and even more old sticky threads cluttering up the website.

 

[Classtime]

Without a traditional sub forum, many threads are derailed with with bobbers, bead heads, and scented sprays?

 

[Meuniere]

Well, it will be fun anyway, because most of us won't quite agree on what IS traditional, but most of us will agree on what is NOT.

And, really, scented sprays? I know nothing about this, I thought they died out with certain hygiene products....

 

[trev]

I don't recognize that there are any "sub forums", because whatever is posted anywhere shows up in "What's New" and that is the only page I really look at regularly. For any given searched subject, the search engines raid all the "sub forums" just as if they were all in one room.
Because of this great feature, I have no objection if others want to ghettoize themselves, they are only pretending that others can't see and join in. It does seem divisive at first glance, though.
I also don't believe there are any great longstanding "traditions" in fly fishing, there is not even a universal or commonly accepted definition of "fly fishing". The technology of rods, lines and tying materials changes constantly and the "sport" evolves to take advantage of it.
By Tradition many/most of us might not even be fly fishing, as up to the mid 20th century it was almost reserved to Professionals (doctors, lawyers, etc.) and the Gentry. (or maybe I'm wrong and all the rest of you are old money gentry)
By longstanding traditions only endangered or extinct birds could be used to tie the flies and we'd all have to be Club members. 150 years ago the Dry Fly Tradition would have surprised most fly fishers. 75 years ago the Sinking Line Tradition could not have existed. And so on with most of the so called Traditions. I recall seeing methods of fishing flies with bobbers in the late '50s or early '60s which is about the time frame when most of the great traditions seem to have become established. And split shot were added to fishing lines long before the invention of plastic allowed high density sinking lines or the construction of special tapers.
Who, besides myself, regularly uses a Level Line?

 

[trev]

And, really, scented sprays?

I think the old tradition of spitting tobacco juice on the wet fly to sink it, makes scented spray a classic tradition. Both the saliva and the tobacco have strong scents.

 

[redietz]

By Tradition many/most of us might not even be fly fishing, as up to the mid 20th century it was almost reserved to Professionals (doctors, lawyers, etc.) and the Gentry. (or maybe I'm wrong and all the rest of you are old money gentry)

That's actually not true. You only get that impression because the people who wrote about it (and got published) were professionals and the gentry. The Yorkshire farmers who developed the North Country wet flies, the Japanese peasants who developed Tenkara, the Italians who developed Valsesiana, the Spaniards who first bred Coq de Leone chickens, etc were all pretty pretty low in the social order. And they were all probably better fly fishers than the gentry who wrote about fly fishing. Those who speak of the Way do not know the Way; those who know the Way do not speak of it.

 

[trev]

That's actually not true. You only get that impression because the people who wrote about it (and got published) were professionals and the gentry. The Yorkshire farmers who developed the North Country wet flies, the Japanese peasants who developed Tenkara, the Italians who developed Valsesiana, the Spaniards who first bred Coq de Leone chickens, etc were all pretty pretty low in the social order. And they were all probably better fly fishers than the gentry who wrote about fly fishing. Those who speak of the Way do not know the Way; those who know the Way do not speak of it.

Did those peasantry folks have great pretensions of Tradition? Or were they out to catch and kill as many fish with as little effort as possible?
I believe that what I said is largely true in all the places you mention, because the peasants would have had little disposable time for recreational fishing. Or disposable income for purchase of rods lines etc. It may not be entirely true. Peasants were in effect property weren't they? Attached to the land and sold/traded/ceded with it? Weren't Farmers among the gentle clasess, as landowners/lessees, with peasants working for them?
Again my understanding is that Tenkara was developed by Professional commercial fishers supplying a market in their localities with the goal to kill as many marketable fish as possible.

 

[flytie09]

Perhaps we need a “Let’s argue about Fly Fishing” sub-forum.. That will definitely get the most action.

I do agree that there are waaaaaaay too many sub-forums here and most are unnecessary.

I find it funny that a forum operated by a shop selling vintage tackle… has its most topical subjects that are light years from it.

 

[redietz]

Again my understanding is that Tenkara was developed by Professional commercial fishers supplying a market in their localities with the goal to kill as many marketable fish as possible.

Catching and keeping as many fish as possible was the traditional goal of all fly anglers until recently. Catch and release is a late 20th century concept. Even the well heeled kept as many as they could and gave the excess to the hotel they were staying at, or donated them to the local poor. The only difference between them and people like James Bailey or Jim Leisenring (two of my fly fishing heroes) were that the latter sold them to hotels rather than gave them away.

 

[Acheron]

Perhaps. Might save me from getting into arguments about best Euro lines, mop material, gummi worm or jig hooks.

The purple gummi bears are the best, everyone knows that!

 

[Bigfly]

What about a forum for curmudgeons....?
Gotta be 50 to log on....
Then, maybe a sub for pups...
....that way oldsters won't have to learn anything new, and youth won't have to listen to whining about change.
Maybe as Ard suggsted, a bobber forum for a place to discuss a more productive style of catching as opposed to predominantly stylistic forms....?
Since I have my doctorate in bobbercating (30,000 hrs.) would be happy to moderate, so Ard won't be required to expose himself.
I can pull duty elsewhere....if needed...
As I have an equal amount of time floating bugs, as well as swinging.
I believe in versatility......and that the water should inform us how to fish....

Jim

 

[johan851]

There are all too many subforums here, which are widely ignored. Everything gets dumped into the "General" category even when there are clearly subforums that are better suited.

Very much agree. And it's a bit self-defeating, as the long list of subforums actually makes it harder to find the relevant spot to post.

 

[Ard]

There are all too many subforums here, which are widely ignored. Everything gets dumped into the "General" category even when there are clearly subforums that are better suited.

Plus, when you ghettoize a given topic, people who may not be familiar with don't get exposed to things that might be potentially interesting.

I have removed 15 sub forum categories as of this time. Categories that get regular posts have been left stand. I hope this makes this a little less busy.

 

[johan851]

I have removed 15 sub forum categories as of this time. Categories that get regular posts have been left stand. I hope this makes this a little less busy.

Progress! I think that helps.