Help Needed: techniques for Coho/Kings in Oregon o

scoutm

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Will be heading up to Oregon in the middle of October and will be able to get a way for one day of salmon fishing.

Will be fishing either the Alsea or the Siletz depending on river conditions and fish in the river. There will be chances for both Coho(Silvers) and Kings(Chinook).

I will only be taking a single hand fly rod...I know a two hander would be better but for one day of fishing that's not in the cards.

I'm looking for instructional videos on single handed techniques but all I'm finding is videos of guys landing fish. I'm looking for more instructional type videos.

If you know of any videos or articles please direct me to them.

Thanks.
 

fredaevans

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Oregon Fishing Reports: Alsea River Fishing Report

Siletz River

As far as flies are concerned my best go was small (and I do mean small) in BLACK or light orange, lower the water flow the smaller the fly (6 to 10 hooks). Body and 'wing' of the same colour has been best for me so far.

fae

Small edit: You will want weighted flies or a sink tip and short leader .. fish will be in the bottom 12 inches as they hold or move given a choice. Same thing applies on the upper Rogue River.
 

Ard

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Advising someone through the internet is always a challenge but I'll give it a whirl. Generally speaking fly fishing for salmon means getting the fly down. Now that doesn't have to mean a ton of weight or 15' sink tips because not all fish are in ten foot of water at all times. If you are looking at one day to fish then a guided day may be the best chance for feeling a fish. Contact some guides in the area and see what they have to say about the fishing and your date.
 

Ard

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It doesn't look like you're getting a lot of play on the question so I'll go on and maybe some Oregon guys will help out.

If you are going to go it alone then the game becomes one of knowing at what point in the river you're fishing the fish are located in at the time that you intend to be there. The fishing report page Fred offered will help in this respect. Both kings and silvers are biters provided they aren't stressed by either environmental or human pressure conditions. Finding them isn't all too difficult because both species are also rollers and floppers. By this I mean that once there is any sort of an accumulation of numbers in a run or pool they get active and show their presence by hitting the surface. Silvers also do a significant amount of leaping while moving up a river if they are in decent numbers.

Once you can visually note where there are fish showing you will want to move upstream a considerable distance from where you are seeing activity. These fish aren't surface feeding they are just showing on the surface so casting at rollers will not be a good strategy. Generally after one does the porpoise thing they will go back to the bottom and usually upstream of where you spotted them at the surface. This is why you want to move up above them. You need to get the fly down to depth and you need to have it swinging across the currents upstream of them to begin with. Once you figure you are getting that fly down and that it will be making an arc at a proper distance then you start a slow process of moving down toward where you last saw a fish at the surface.

This is the cast & step thing, I like to make three or four casts and swings along the same track before I move down and when you do move down you want only to move a couple feet at a time. This process will have the fly making the same sweeping passes at the same depth and speed in intervals of tow feet of change. If an angler gets impatient and moves too much at once that angler may very well miss a chance by having the fly pass downstream of some salmon while his line and leader butt cross right over their heads.

If everything works out just right a salmon's take of a fly can range from a decent tap that stops the fly to an aggressive hit. In either case it's best not to overreact by striking upward with the rod out of surprise. The fish I catch generally have themselves hooked to some extent and once I can confirm that there is really one there I point the rod straight at the source of tension and pull firmly on the line. Firm means firm and pull doesn't mean to jerk on the line hard. These things have hard bony jaws and a good hard jerk can pop a knot when we least want that to happen.

If you get to this point you'll figure out what happens next in no time :)
 

fredaevans

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Good comments in the above post, especially this one: "By this I mean that once there is any sort of an accumulation of numbers in a run or pool they get active and show their presence by hitting the surface. Silvers also do a significant amount of leaping while moving up a river if they are in decent numbers."

As for 'jumpers' this happens for two primary reasons (so I'm told): Males trying to drive other males out of the pool and females are trying to break up their egg sacks for spawning.

I've found two great places to watch this happen on the Rogue, one on the upper river (place you'd not suspect) and the two others just below Grants Pass.

One of the GP's is a major regional park with a over river bridge just below the spawning water so you're above and looking down on the fish. Total hoot there!
 

dillon

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I have not fly fished for salmon in many years as steelheading in Oregon in the fall is much more appealing. Back in those salmon fishing days I used a 9ft 9wt and a 2 or 300 grain Jim Teeny line and swung small bright flies. Those river are fairly small in the fall, unless the rains have kicked in, so a Spey rod would probably not be appropriate or needed. I'd look for fast pocket water where fish are moving. I'd avoid pools and riffles where they are holding because they can draw a crowdand fish are easily lined and foul hooked. I'd opt for the Siletz because it's a bit bigger. It used to get a good summer run of wild steelhead and had a fly only section in the upper reaches, but I'm not sure what the current situation is. I'm also not sure if those rivers have a Chum run, but they can be fun on the fly rod.

Fly fishing for chinook in tidewater has gained popularity in recent years. Although a prom is needed it sounds more fun and sporting to me. The fish are bright and sassy (up river fish are usually dark) and chances of foul hooking are slim. Joel, the owner of Royal Treatment fly shop in West Linn, Or. is versed in this fishery and would be worth a call if that interests you. Have a great time trip, it's a beautiful time of year to be here, for sure.
 
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scoutm

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Thanks for the replies.

I grew up on the two rivers so know them or at least the 30 years ago versions of them.

I've been looking at the water levels and the weather forecasts and looks like it will be low water fishing which isn't ideal but will make getting to the bottom easier. With any luck a storm come through and pull some fresh fish in but not looking promising.

Sounds like I need to invest in a sink tip line though...any recommendation on fly patterns?
 

Ard

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My choice of flies for kings is always the same, the AK. Assassin. Remember, I'm in Alaska not Oregon but I have mailed the flies to fellows as far south as BC. who claim they catch fish down there. There are postings here and on my own website for the pattern with recipe included. I believe they are in the Flies For Alaska and Flies For Spey Fishing here on the forum. It doesn't seem to matter whether they are tied on standard hooks or on tubes, they always seem to work. On my own site there is a recipe for a standard hook version all the way at the bottom of the Flies & Rivers blog page in the Let's Check Our Fly Boxes post.

I'll do a search here and link any threads I find. For whatever reason the same fly works year after year here so I don't experiment.

This thread, scroll down to a bright pink fly; Flies for Alaska Salmon Fishing

This Post; The AK. Assassin fly | Fishing with Ard Stetts

The second link shows both standard tie and tube variation, they are simple to make and can be done sparse or heavy depending on water levels.

For silvers........... they can be funny, sometimes all you need is a fly, any fly while other times they have lockjaw and you are changing again and again trying to crack the code. My standard or go to pattern is similar to the Assassin but I call it the Pinky Purple.

Pinky Purple Shank step X step; https://www.theflyfishingforum.com/forums/blogs/ard/457-tying-shanks.html
 
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Red Owl

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I have done very limited fishing for both but from the little I've done, I started out for Chinook because they are larger. For me they tended to run straight. If they jumped, it was like a porpoise straight away whereas the Coho tend to twist around in mid-air, so although the coho are smaller, some prefer them on sporting qualities. I think in many rivers the coho run up much faster so you have to hit the water just right, at the right time.
This sporting aspect seems to be why most folks tend to end up after steel head. They are "pure chrome" iridescent and good fighters even if smaller in size- just use the right tackle.
Finally, something that ought to be discussed more, there are areas that should only be fished with a drift boat. The water may be too deep and rough for wading or the access impossible to reach on foot. So that can change everything.
One example is the Snake in Wyoming/Idaho. IMHO those who catch a lot of fish use a drift boat. You hit one good spot and then are off to the next area. After the whole day- you have done well but if you wade, it takes a while to drive into an area, time to suit up and wade out in the river, if that area isn't hot you could catch very little.
 

fredaevans

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+1 to the comment above; ditto the upper Rogue River here in Oregon. Some great bank access but usually it can get pretty crowed especially on the week ends.

My 'cure' for that was just to walk a few hundred yards down stream and had the place to my self. Trash the water with a spey line and hope for the best ...
:rolleyes:
 

scoutm

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I got back last night from my trip up to Oregon and although the day on the water didn't result in fish we had a great time. Due to low water levels fish were stacked up in the tide water area but the day before we were set to fish we had a nice storm and the Siletz came 18" and the fish moved into the river and were on the move and not interested our bait. Regardless we had a great time and the river was beautiful.




After we got off the water we ran over to the coast for dinner and caught a really nice evening.



The real reason for the trip was a complete success. I acquired my grandparent's house a few years ago and we've started to remodel it. In the time I was there, we were able to get all the cabinets hung, the flooring completed, a new mantel hung and one of the bathroom's shower's ready to tile...I am so sore it's unbelievable.







And here's the real reason for getting the house. There use to be summer steelhead in the creek and they watershed conservation group is working to reestablish them. Last summer they put a logjam on my property to create some better spawning beds.

 
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Ard

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Having that stream right out back will make this a dream house! Silvers can be tough customers sometimes but sooner or later you'll hit things right.
 
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