MONO LINES RIGS what are the pros and cons, your thoughts?

trev

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Most states have clear solid definitions of fly fishing and they are the only correct definitions within the given state, if only fly fishing is legal on a water, or if fly fishing is prohibited on a water, the definition must clear. I have read those definitions in a few states and none that I've seen call for use of a particular line nor did they prohibit monofilament.
 

rsagebrush

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I've never encountered a regulation that prohibits 'fly fishing', I'd be interested in seeing that.
I have heard that some regulation limit the length of the leader which might be construed a limiting the length of the 'mono leader' although I don't think it would be enforced much, if at all.
I'll be fishing a small creek for natives later today using bamboo and a Mono leader, but obviously on a very short portion of it. Looks like a beautiful day here.
 

old timer

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My take on it.

What's the biggest difference between spin fishing and fly fishing?

Spin fishing using a light line and the weight of the lure casts the line.

Fly fishing uses almost weightless flies and the weight of the line casts the flies.

I'll hold back my opinion but those are the accepted definitions of the two ways to fish. Where do you think a mono line on a fly rod fits in?
 

sasquatch7

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My take on it.

What's the biggest difference between spin fishing and fly fishing?

Spin fishing using a light line and the weight of the lure casts the line.

Fly fishing uses almost weightless flies and the weight of the line casts the flies.

I'll hold back my opinion but those are the accepted definitions of the two ways to fish. Where do you think a mono line on a fly rod fits in?
I'd say it's the reel .
 

losthwy

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It's fly fishing with a mono line. Fishing a fly on a horse hair line, silk line, floating line, sinking line, etc in the last 400 years or so has always been about fly fishing. One could make a distinction between bamboo, graphite or fiberglass rods. I certainly would not. Using mono line on a fly rod doesn't make it a spinning rod any more than putting a floating line on a bait caster wouldn't make it fly fishing. My concerns lay on the side for the joy of the pursuit, and respect and appreciation of the resource.
 

old timer

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It's fly fishing with a mono line. Fishing a fly on a horse hair line, silk line, floating line, sinking line, etc in the last 400 years or so has always been about fly fishing. One could make a distinction between bamboo, graphite or fiberglass rods. I certainly would not. Using mono line on a fly rod doesn't make it a spinning rod any more than putting a floating line on a bait caster wouldn't make it fly fishing. My concerns lay on the side for the joy of the pursuit, and respect and appreciation of the resource.

All the lines you mentioned except the mono line have one thing in common. The line casts the fly. If you cast a panther Martin with a traaditional fly rod setup are you still fly fishing.

A line needs to be drawn somewhere.

Using a mono line on a fly rod was first used in Fly Fishing Competition. They had one goal and one goal only. To catch the most amount of fish in the shortest time. It didn't matter how. The number of fish caught is all that matters.

Someone not in competition doesn't have that problem. It doesn't matter how many fish they catch. How they do it should. At least I think it should. If all you want to do is catch a lot of fish. What not use bait and lures. Use any means you can. I think fly fishing is more than that. It has tradition and is an art form. It should matter how to catch the fish. At least I think it should.

I'm reminded of two hunters. They're both bear hunters. One of them always stays on the ground stalking the bear. Trying to sneak in close for a shot. The other bear hunter (?) sits in a tree over a barrel of bait. Some will read a book while they wait for a bear to come to the bait. When it does he shoots the bear without the bear knowing he was there. In some states both methods are legal. Who is the real hunter? There's hunting and there's just killing.

There's fly fishing and there's catching fish with a fly rod.

I've had my say and i'm done.
 

trev

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The line casts the fly. If you cast a panther Martin with a traaditional fly rod setup are you still fly fishing.
You seem to say that if the line casts the Panther Martin that it is fly fishing? It would not be in Mo, because the PM has no hair or feather, but a Rooster Tail is a fly. As far as I can tell Co. equates flies and artificial lures, so I guess you would be right in your state.

Using a mono line on a fly rod was first used in Fly Fishing Competition.
Joe Humphreys used mono on a fly rod and wrote about it long time before I ever heard of competitions, can you point me to these competitions taking place back in the '70s?
 

trev

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What do you think makes any piece of string into a "fly line"?
This intrigues me, is there a definition of a "fly line " that lists the characteristics required?
Following the idea that the line must drag the fly/lure/bait and not the bait dragging the line, at what weight of each is the change from fly fishing to bait casting? How much does a fly or nymph or even streamer weigh? and what is the weight ratio of line to leader required to make sure the line drags the fly? Is a 3wt line heavy enough to be a "fly line"? If my 9wt will cast trout flies and bass bugs but won't cast the largest salt water offerings, is it not a "fly line" or are they not "flies"?
If a line must be drawn somewhere, where and how would it be drawn?
If I can't cast a 3/0 Clouser Deep Minnow with a 5wt line, is that not a ''fly'', or is the line not a ''fly line'', or am I just a lousy caster??
 

sparsegraystubble

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I really don’t worry much about these issues. As old timer says, I know how I like to fish and really don’t worry about others.

But I would swear that one of the states I lived in (I think either Pennsylvania or New York) had specific language in their regulations for fly fishing only waters that specified that the artificial fly had to be cast using the weighot of the line rather than the weight of the fly. But that may be ancient history and lives on only in my long term memory.

We all have our prejudices and preferences. I have tied but never fished San Juan Worms and egg patterns. I am experimenting with a mono rig, but far prefer dries and soft hackles. These are all preferences and have no bearing at all on what others should do.

i reserve my judgmental approach for those who damage the resource (including the fish) or refuse to learn and practice courtesy while fishing. Or those who endanger others through their behavior.

Don
 

trev

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I did live in a state that specified a ''single action fly reel'' had to be used on FFO waters. Didn't mention line.

But if 30' of mono is heavier than the fly? I bought a roll of Amnesia a while back (can't recall when or why) and that stuff is defiantly not spinning line, it would unspool from a spinning reel before you could open the bail.
 

trev

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But I would swear that one of the states I lived in (I think either Pennsylvania or New York) had specific language in their regulations for fly fishing only waters that specified that the artificial fly had to be cast using the weighot of the line rather than the weight of the fly. But that may be ancient history and lives on only in my long term memory.
40 some years ago I was using Humphreys' and Fay's nymphing methods with a 9' 9wt. and I could not say if the line or the flies were making the cast, only that it wasn't a dry fly cast, so I sit here wondering how you or the state could determine that?
I know that it would not cast like a bait rod even with a few shot attached, it still took line out of the tiptop before any cast could be made.
 

boisker

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My take on it.

What's the biggest difference between spin fishing and fly fishing?

Spin fishing using a light line and the weight of the lure casts the line.

Fly fishing uses almost weightless flies and the weight of the line casts the flies.

I'll hold back my opinion but those are the accepted definitions of the two ways to fish. Where do you think a mono line on a fly rod fits in?
what about a French leader (mono line) casting a dry fly to 35’?
 

losthwy

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Joe Humphreys used mono on a fly rod and wrote about it long time before I ever heard of competitions
Glad you mention him. "Mister"Humphrey as George Daniel as refers to Joe Humphrey, his book Trout Tactics was first published in 1981. Mr Humphrey is on the short list of the names I've heard mention over the years, most frequently, in my 35 plus years fly fishing. And THE guy when it comes to fly fishing nyumping.
 

trev

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first published in 1981.
I bought a copy that week, or the next. I had already read about the California style of heavy nymphing Ted Fay made popular and combined the two styles somewhat, most streams are not well suited to the western method, imo. Humphreys convinced me away from the long leaders that I was using per Joe Brooks, then from short tapered leaders back to the Cobra, even longer than Brooks 12'+ recipes.
I never could cast it over about 30 feet, but the streams weren't that big, so 20' was plenty.
 

these go to 11

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To me fly fishing is defined by using the weight of the line to cast a light weight fly. Spin or bait fishing uses heavy lures or bait as the weight to propel the line from the cast.

It's completely fine if you use mono on a fly rod to catch fish. Even better if you enjoy it. That said, fishing a long rod with mono in order to tight line a nymph with little to no mending doesn't qualify as fly fishing to me. It was borne of competition as a means to catch more fish. That is fine, and it's still fishing. It's just not fly fishing in my eyes. I chuckle at guys who think that using this tool is somehow schooling people using traditional fly fishing gear. To me fly fishing is about the challenge and not the path of least resistance. I'd just grab a spin caster with some bait if catching fish was all it was about. It's not about catching fish.
 

boisker

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things continually evolve... 10 years ago ”euro/tightline“ was casting/lobbing heavy flies on mono, (although it should also be remembered that French leaders were always used to cast dry flies)
.... move forward to current times and you would find it just as likely about casting lightly weighted or unweighted nymphs and dries....
...so if the weight that is being cast is the weight of the a size 16 jig hook and the weight of 10lb mono... is that not far more skilled than humping out a thingamabobber and mending.... lets face it, that’s just float fishing and waiving an arm about :unsure: 😂
 

trev

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schooling people using traditional fly fishing gear.
Do you use 16' greenheart rod and gut leader? Your line is braided and you cast a gang of wets? where did all this "tradition" come from and when did it start? Because the oldest traditions in fly angling use long wooden rods, braided lines and natural leaders.
If your rod, line leader or fly use plastic/synthetic materials, your tradition can not be more than 75 years old, while some fishing traditions go back thousands of years, it shouldn't bother me but it is irksome when the "Tradition" pony is dragged out.
The graphite tradition is less than 50 years old and had it's start in competition casting -not fishing.
The plastic line tradition is a little older it goes back to 1954 (possibly) so still less than 75 years.
I'm not sure when the weight forward tradition started but believe Orvis was pushing it hard in the "70s, marketing for smaller lighter reels? I'm pretty sure it had it's roots in shooting heads, again competition casting - not fishing.
Dry fly tradition goes back to the mid 19th century about but was not popular until the 1880's or the turn of the century; so let us call it 125 year old tradition that was never fully embraced by the majority of fly rod anglers. Even into the 1950s the lines were so prone to sink that most anglers just used wet flies, where I learned to fly fish in the 1970s nearly everyone with a fly rod fished wets and laughed at old "Dry Fly Harry". Dry flies are only a recent fad in the long history of line and pole fishing. it's only been a tradition since Jason Borger pretended to be Brad Pitt.
A skilled dry fly caster should welcome the challenge of casting tiny dries with only a very long leader.
It's not about catching fish.
I guess you cut the hook off at the bend rather than just mashing down the barb?
 
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