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Old 11-10-2009, 08:05 PM
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Default Re: noel mo

I apologize if I poked a stick in anyone's eye, and I assure you I haven't taken offense to anything said. I think we're all on the same page, though- there's absolutely no reason and no sense in trashing a stream.
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:13 PM
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Default Re: noel mo

Originally Posted by jackinok View Post
That being said ,as far as the pollution issues go ,being involved in ranching and farming all my life,as well as being involved in hunting and fishing ive saw both sides of the story first hand.I understand the farmers trying to make a living from their land haveing to use the fertilizer and pesticides to make a crop.And ive seen first hand literally hundreds of bass ,crappie, and bluegill,some trophy size floating dead in a runoff lake from the misuse of them.Not to mention sick cattle aborting calves,dead wildlife and all the other terrible things.Its a real problem that has no easy,fast answers.
Jack, the excerpt I quoted above actually closely parallels the part of my commentary in the documentary on CAFO's that the title "We All Live Downstream" was taken from. It was about how my own background and sentiments straddle the issue and how I believe that ag, science, gov't, environmentalists, conservationists, and sportsmen need to pull together to find win-win solutions that are sustainable for all stakeholders whenever possible...that urban and rural citizens have a lot riding on clean water...and that the entire ecosystem fails without it - from the worms and minnows to the industrialist and investment banker...we all live downstream.

I have no problem with agri-business whatsoever. I LOVE agri-biz! But the portions of the Ozarks where pure Karst topography dominates is completely inappropriate for the types and sizes of CAFO's MDNR is permitting there. They're even ignoring their own EIS's and issuing permits against their own recommendations and regulations. It's ridiculous. So the problem isn't really "CAFO: good or bad?" The problem is "this type of CAFO on this type of land: good or bad?" And the answer is pretty obvious to anyone with even a very fundamental grasp of the science.
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Old 11-11-2009, 09:25 AM
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Default Re: noel mo

I know exactly what your saying ,ive preached the same thing here for years.That keeping the livestock carrying capacities within reason,farming barriers around ponds creeks filter the runnoff,PROPER use of fertilizers and pesticides save our land.We have many of the same problems you do ,compounded with the hundreds of acres lost to wind and sheet erosion.But until the farmers and ranchers can see on their OWN farms that they really dont lose any money in the long run,that cattle will winter over on native pastures without the need to plant wheat for grazing,that a baler/swather /rake needed to make hay for winter feed costs far more than a pasture drill with grass you can plant a good sod forming mixed pasture that will not only feed your cattle all year but improve your overall herds health and growth rate while at the same time increasing your carrying capacity,were sort of preaching to the choir.breaks my heart to see native grass going under the plow and knowing that I will never in my lifetime see it the same again,but I keep on preaching it.I truly believe that education, cold hard facts and bottom line figures are the key.but its hard to break a cycle thats been destroying our land for a hundred years. I think people are beginning to wake up though.I'm seeing lots of sons and daughters taking over farms as the older generation starts to retire,that really seem to care ,no thats not the right word those old folks really DO care,maybe its that they dont paricularly NEED the small farms as primary income to feed their families.They are more receptive to the idea of lowering stocking rates,planting fields back to native grasses and things.Maybe thats because they just dont have the time to spend that the old folks who farmed for their sole incomes had and are just trying to lighten the workload , i dont know, but I think things are looking up.Im not sure about all the regulations yall have and how they would work around here though,(we still have shootouts come election time)..a lot gov folks poking around might not go over so well!...LOL
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