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Thread: California snow

  1. #11

    Default Re: California snow

    https://cdec.water.ca.gov/snow/misc/rainOnSnow.html


    https://cdec.water.ca.gov/snow/pix/snowmelt.gif

    "According to the Corps of Engineers' Snow Hydrology manual, where Mr is the melt, in inches of water, Tr is the mean rain temperature (F), and Pr is the inches of rainfall. Therefore, it would take about 10 inches of rain at 48F to melt one inch of snow water content. [Note: not 1 inch of snow, but 1 inch of snow-water-content.]
    Much of work to develop and verify this equation was done at the Central Sierra Snow Laboratory located at Soda Springs near Donner Summit. Considerable work remains to refine the physical mechanisms of how the rain water migrates through the pack.

    Only after prolonged, warm rainfall will snowmelt be a major contributor to runoff. This did occur in February, 1986 and during the first week of 1997."
    There's not a day that goes by that I don't wonder how dreary this world would be if elk were bald and birds had no feathers.
    - Hank Patterson

  2. #12
    Join Date
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    SF Bay area California
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    Default Re: California snow

    Myt1, you are correct, Because I am on call at night I watch the National Weather Service sensors pretty regularly and they go down depending on rain melt or higher temperatures and they go up when it snows.

    I am sure that Bigfly is correct that the ski areas do not ever report a lower snowpack but I do not ever look at them to gauge snowpack because they make their own snow even when there is no snow anywhere else all they need is low temperatures.

    Like Bigfly I also call bs when the weather man says to expect the storm to dump up to 7' of snow. That would equate to 8.4" of rain and we just don't normally get storms that big out here. Standard rain to snow conversion is 1" of rain = 10" of snow.

    According to the CDEC current rainfall (Northern Sierras average) from the start of the rain season Oct 1st until now is 32.3 inches. Given that we really did not get good snowfall at the lower elevations (below 7000') until mid-january we have had roughly 15" of rain in the form of snow which would translate to 150" of snow if the sensors did not record snow melt. Of course most of the sensors are way below that number and many are less than half of that amount as seen in my previous posting. We only see those kind of big numbers at a few of the really high elevations where it stays colder longer.

    You can also see from the pics I captured the other day, lots more snow at the higher elevations than there is down near the town of Truckee and below on the Truckee River. In the pictures (taken during a snow storm) down near the Floriston exit which is just below the Little Truckee River inflow you can still see the scrub and the rocks on the hillside (not to impressive). Like fishing and real estate its location, location, location.

    Regards,

    Tim C.

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  4. #13
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    Default Re: California snow

    20170221_161527 by James Landis, on Flickr

    2017 was the last big winter....we will see how it goes this year.


    T corfey

    Thanks for getting my back. (Call me to fish sometime...) You would think a first hand acct would be enough.
    Like my post about the 96-97 rain event. Three feet of snow here in town in two days, and then 6" of warm rain from Hawaii to bare ground in 24hrs.... Those that live up here study this stuff, it's not about opinion.
    It's survival.......
    If we get serious snow above 7000ft we can still have a drought.
    It's when we get a serious pack at 6000ft and lower are we out of danger of drought..
    So, a foot in town is squat. Most of the pack is above town.....that's why I post about winter from the town, not the crest of the Sierras.
    On the summit we can get 28 feet in a winter...seven feet isn't worth a report hardly.
    After reading the last post it sounded like I harshed Yikes about his comment about snow fall.
    Not so, lots of people see resort reports and believe it. I used to. But since I work in resort snow it becomes clear there are better sources of info........
    The other morning driving the blower after the storm, the wind blown snow was higher than the cab roof. If I give you a report, you can take it to the bank. Neither blowing it up, or putting it down, I'm trying to be accurate.
    As far as making snow,that doesn't count towards the snow total.....barely covers the ground til Dec., just so folks can go play. Heck, we scrape snow from the parking lot (farming) to keep resort going till winter begins.

    20170221_162923 by James Landis, on Flickr

    Jim
    Last edited by Bigfly; 02-12-2019 at 03:10 PM.
    The bar isn't set by the fish we catch, but by the one's we don't.

    Bigfly

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  6. #14
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    Oct 2014
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    Default Re: California snow

    So if there were any doubters, I just checked the NOHRSC snow monitors in the Sierras. Over the last 24 hours we had a rain event, the snow pack monitors are showing a loss of snow depth between 2" to 12" across the Sierras today.

    Good news is the weather man is predicting a cooling trend starting in the morning with the precipitation getting back to snow around 10am and continuing through the afternoon. so there is still hope...

    Regards,

    Tim C.

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  8. #15

    Default Re: California snow

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigfly View Post
    You would think a first hand acct would be enough...
    After reading the last post it sounded like I harshed Yikes about his comment about snow fall.
    Not so, lots of people see resort reports and believe it. I used to. But since I work in resort snow it becomes clear there are better sources of info...
    Don't worry, I don't feel harshed. I did not understand that the resorts would need to exaggerate their snowpack, especially when webcams and social media can allow people to quickly verify for themselves. I appreciate the local insight.

    On the other hand, we are both reviewing available information from two different perspectives:

    Yours is looking out the window to see if you will need to plow, or if the snow or runoff will affect your fishing today.

    My perspective is from hundreds of miles away, and for a longer-term purpose: I'm wondering if it is going to be a good fishing season this summer. I am posting from the same data sensors that California's water managers look at to make their decisions about when to release impounded water into the tailwaters that I fish. Right now it is saying the main regions of the Sierras already have enough snow water equivalent to essentially equal or exceed our April 1st average.

    My larger point is not to question the validity of your local observations; my larger point is that the data indicates water managers will likely make this a great year for fishing.
    Last edited by yikes; 02-17-2019 at 11:31 AM.
    There's not a day that goes by that I don't wonder how dreary this world would be if elk were bald and birds had no feathers.
    - Hank Patterson

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  10. #16
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    Default Re: California snow

    20190226_100834 by James Landis, on Flickr

    OK.....so now we are starting to accumulate some snow......
    The pole in front of my truck is 8ft. The bank is about 16ft.
    This is what we expect from a normal winter, but it's still not an outrageous dump yet.
    I think this is a bit like those in the lower 48 states, think Eagles are so cool........in AK they are considered about as interesting as pigeons are down here........
    To flatlander's it seems a lot of snow, but to Mnt folk, we are just getting started. Expecting another 20" tonight.
    I'll keep ya posted.

    Jim
    The bar isn't set by the fish we catch, but by the one's we don't.

    Bigfly

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  12. #17
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    Default Re: California snow

    The Eagles are great.

    I love Nick Foles!
    -Rick Allen

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