Need Your Advice;

[transporti686]

Hi, I am new here and I send you greetings from Slovakia. I have Greys GR50 14ft #9/10 spey fly rod with skagit compact shooting head for hucho hucho fishing with streamers, but I want to buy another spey fly rod 12 -13ft #6 or #7 for fishing on river Dunaj, Vah and Hron for smaller fishes. I dont know to decide which type of fly rod to buy. If skagit, scandi or traditional spey? Primarly I want to swing streamers, but sometimes I want to swing wet flies. Am I able to fish with one rod and when yes, what type of spey rod to buy, please? Many thanks for your advices.

 

[Ard]

I'm moving a post here so it gets some views and attention.

Hello transporti, now you have your own thread

Will you be buying in Europe / Slovakia or are you considering American brand rods?

Next question, what is the budget, amount you are willing to spend?

I can make suggestions but it would be good to know those things first.

 

[transporti686]

Hi Ard, many thanks. I want to buy it in UK. Oh, budget I spent a lot of money for #9/10 combo for hucho hucho fishing, so budget is limited I am thinking to buy Shakespeare Oracle spey 12ft #7/8 fly rod for smaller predatory fishes. I have read very good reviews for this rod and for Shakespeare Oracle Scandi 12ft9 #8, too.

 

[transporti686]

Primarly I want to swing streamers up to 8-12cm with sink tips T-11 and T-14 on 12ft oracle spey #7/8. I have a Rio Skagit Flight shooting head 475 grains, but I have no problem to buy another skagit shooting head.

 

[dennyk]

Hi transporti, I can't offer any words of wisdom with your rod purchase, just wanted to welcome you to the forum!

:welcome:

Good Luck!

Denny

 

[transporti686]

No problem Many thanks for your invitation.
I found this thread Oracle 12' Spey rod rated 7/8. Maybe, If you look at this thread, you will be able to direct me to a right way. I will be a very thankful for your help.

 

[spm]

I too wish to welcome you to the forum. Unfortunately, I can't help with your question.

steve

 

[transporti686]

I have decided to buy shakespeare oracle spey 12ft #7/8. Producer recommends to use skagit shooting head from 420 to 480 grains. They told me, that this rod is caoable to cast shooting heads and traditional spey fly lines with no problems. Price for this rod is fantastic and reviews are very good in this price level.

I send you one photo of hucho hucho from our little country. This fish is incredible on spey rod.7

 

[Ard]

Sounds like you know which rod and we are talking about correct line now?

Scandi lines are a bit longer that that Flight profile you posted but the longest I have are a 44 foot head with integrated running line (no loop to loop) and they work great.

They do have their limitations though. I think, and that's important because I say "think" not, I know,......I think that if you try loading a long sink tip of T-11 or 14 onto a size 7/8 Scandi you may have problems. The size 7/8 Scandi may have a total head weight of around 520 to 550 grains or 33.6 to 35.6 Grams.

While that may be near to the weight of your Flight head the weight distribution will be different due to the longer body of line. I have never tried a long sink tip on my Scandi lines but I suspect it would create casting problems. When you add a large fly the problems could multiply.

How deep must you get the fly for those fish?

 

[transporti686]

The Hucho Hucho was caught by swinging 16cm streamer with Airflo Skagit Compact G2 floating shooting head 600 grains and 10ft T-14 Airflo FLO sink tip on Greys GR50 14ft #9/10 spey rod. Not easy to cast big streamer, but it is possible. Presentation is not very good, but I was able to catch nice fish.

I think, that RIO Flight is second generation RIOs skagit shooing head. From internet I know, that T14 sink tip on #7/8 spey rod may be a problem, but my friend is able to cast 10ft T14 sink tip and 10cm streamer with Greys GR70 12ft6 #7 spey rod with 450 grains RIO skagit floating shooting head, not RIO Flight. I want to use snake roll cast, because I found, that snake roll is able to load rod deeply and is better for casting streamers than single spey cast. Producer told me, that shakespeare oracle spey rod is good for skagit shooting head, because action of rod is more parabolic then tip action.

 

[Ard]

How deep the water?

Also, your Hucho looks a lot like a trout like Loch Leaven type. What does Hucho translate to in your country to mine?

 

[transporti686]

Approx 2 m deep. In Slovakia Hucho Hucho is Hlavátka Podunajská, Danube Salmon. Hucho - Wikipedia

Hucho was artificially added to some passages of rivers in Slovakia and they did find new habitats.

 

[Ard]

Roughly 6 feet then, perhaps the articles I linked you to via PM could be of interest? I fish in depths from 3 to 6 feet normally using Scandi lines and the leader mini head combination outlined in Getting It Down, I get deep enough to move fish but seldom snag and lose flies unless hidden tree limbs catch my swing. Even with the short sink heads there are still limits on size and weight of the flies used with the Scandi lines.

The only way I have found to comfortably Spey cast large and heavy flies is by using an 875 grain / 56.7 gram Mid Spey line with an all monofilament leader. I hand tie beginning with 50 pound - 40 - 30 - 25 - 20 - 15 and scale the leader to match rod length.

On that kind of leader with that heavy of line I can throw super heavy and large flies out to very long distances if needed using traditional Spey casts.

The problem arises with either Scandi or Mid Spey lines when we try to stay in the lighter rod and line weights such as 7/8 weight rod and 525 to 600 grain lines. With smaller lighter flies and shorter sink heads these will cast very well but when we seek to tie a fly and tip that should be attached to a much heavier line the casting becomes difficult and the fishing a labor not a pleasure.

 

[Unknownflyman]

Interesting, Danube salmon, Looks kind of like an Atlantic and a big brown. Looking at that river, I`d totally fish the long Scandinavian line I love.

 

[transporti686]

Many thanks, Ard.
Unknownflyman: The river from video is small river. Our target is medium large to large river, large and deep passages of river, 2 to 3 m deep. Hucho love lagoons.

 

[transporti686]

Hi for all. Afterall, I bought Shakespeare Oracle Spey 12ft aftma 7/8 fly rod. I kindly ask you to help me with scandi shooting head for this rod. Could I use 39ft, 520grains, 34g Scandi shooting head for this rod, or it will be too much, please? Line recommendation for this rod is: spey 44ft, 520grains, 34g, shooting head 36ft, 463grains, 30g, skagit 23ft, 475grains, 30g.

Many thanks for your advice. Greetings from Slovakia.

 

[flytie09]

Shakespeare missed the mark when it came to marketing these rods. For whatever reason they have came out with 4 different series for the Oracle. The Spey, The Switch, The Scandi and The EXP Salmon. Selecting the proper line can be tricky and I see very little on published grain windows for these rods.

I don't own the Oracle Spey rod....but I do have one of the Oracle Switch rods. I use it with both Skagit and Scandi lines depending on the situation.

I use the 50 grain less rule of thumb when selecting a Scandi vs a Skagit shooting head for my rod when I'm out on the water. I see published grain windows of 400-480 gr for Skagit shooting heads for the 12' 7/8 Oracle Spey. So you're looking at 350 - 430 grain Scandi shooting heads. I would opt for the heavier 430 gr Scandi as a 350 gr seems too light to me.

If you can find a fly shop near you to try the rod with various lines that would be ideal. I realize this isn't a reality in most places...but my suggestion at least gets you in the ballpark as a starting point.

Good luck to you.......let us know what your final selection is and some pics of those Hucho Huchos.

 

[transporti686]

flytie09> Many thanks for your reply. Shakespeare recommends 26-30g shooting head for this rod. I saw recommendation of 470 to 510gr for skagit head. I have 480gr 6,5m Airflo skagit FIST at home. I will try it with this rod. I wanted to use another scandi head, but today morning I bought 417gr 10,5m Guideline PT RTG F/H/S1 scandi head at good price. It seems light to me, but I will try it. I will let myself be suprised

 

[transporti686]

Second Hucho Hucho from last year. Not very big, but fighting fish.