Do We Have Any Mid Belly Casters Here?

Ard

Forum Member
Staff member
Messages
26,183
Reaction score
16,363
Location
Wasilla / Skwentna, Alaska
Or long belly...…. Scandi Longs accepted also :)

If you're here feel free to mention what rods you are casting with also. I sometimes feel alone in the Spey forums...….
 

huronfly

Well-known member
Messages
968
Reaction score
376
Location
Ontario, Canada
Hey Ard, I just started dabbling into some mid belly casting last year... I am using an airflo delta II 7/8 multitip with an Anglers Roost 14' 5/6 IM8 blank. I built this rod to be used with a mid belly line to minimize or eliminate the stripping of running line to prevent iced up guides when temps fall below freezing. The 15' replacement tips still allow me to reach down to dormant winter fish, and unlike my buddy throwing Skagit in winter, so far there has been no need to clear ice out of the guides for me! What kind of setup(s) are you using??

 

randyflycaster

Well-known member
Messages
834
Reaction score
19
I have a Meiser 15'6" trout spey rod. I cast a Ballistic Vector with a 49 foot head. Also, on that rod, I cast 27 foot Skagit and Rages heads, with 5 foot cheaters.

Randy
 

dillon

Well-known member
Messages
2,943
Reaction score
2,244
Location
Portland and Maupin, Oregon
Freshwater Fly Line | 2
I have been using bellied lines exclusively for floating line applications the last three summer run seasons. I have a Delta II Spey and the cortland short, long and mid bellies shown in the above link. Prior to using these I used an Air flo Scandi head and long nylon tapered leader (17'). I continue to use a long leader of about 15 ft with the bellied lines. I fell the long leader provies for a better anchor. Im using mainly touch and go casts, the single spey and snake roll. Very little, if any, fly line lands on the water on the touch. Prior to using these lines I used an Air Flo Scandi. i can cast the Scandi further, but the bellied lines cast far enough and I feel that I have better line control with the bellied lines. I also like the traditional feel of a full fly line in my hands, rather than dealing with a thin running line.

I still use Skagit heads when using sink tips in the late fall and winter when the water drops under the mid 40's. Iv'e got a trip coming up next week when I might try a sink tip on a bellied line. I'll be fishing with a guide one day when I will have to go from dawn to dark and if the sun is out and/or Im not getting any surface action, I may resort to a tip. The young guide recommends tips and leech patterns, but I'm trying to convert him. He loves to see my surface grabs, but still keeps dredging...
 

lonigan

Active member
Messages
36
Reaction score
29
50' windcutter on a 12ft 5/6wt anglers roost IM6 here. casts pretty effortless when my timing is down. before that it was cheap unispey knockoff from the auction site 55 or 60 ft i think. wouldn't know what to do with them short thingies................................

tim
 

flytie09

Well-known member
Messages
7,254
Reaction score
10,083
Location
PA
Your not alone. No long or Mid belly lines...but I use a few Scandi/Scandi hybrids.

Airflo Scandi Short, Rio Scandi Short, Beulah Elixir V2, Airflo Rage Floating and Intermediate lines for my various switch rods.

Bamboo, glass and graphite rods are all in the mix in 6-9 WT and 10.5' - 13' lengths.

Skagit isn't a dirty word in my house and I'll use them too depending on conditions and the chickens I'm chucking.
 

Ard

Forum Member
Staff member
Messages
26,183
Reaction score
16,363
Location
Wasilla / Skwentna, Alaska
Oh good, some general discussion :) I'll work through the replies then dump yesterday on you...……..

Danny, I didn't know you had built that rod, nice. You are right on point with the line stripping thing and I'm sure you recognize other benefits also.

Hey Randy, I knew about your line preferences and was just looking to poke some of you guys into a chat about them.

You too Dililon, I was just looking to get you guys engaged and will explain why below.

Tim, I had forgotten about you, it's been a while since you've been talking here...………..

FT09, I knew you were a versatile type but you've been quiet in these threads for a while so I started this just to get you guys online.

The rods I'm using to close out the season are; Sage One 13'6" - X 14' and a 13' Hardy Marksman 2T. They all work with the same 540 and 600 grain lines and I'm liking the 45 foot Scandi's I get from S. Godshall down south.

So what prompted this thread? Yesterday at about noon I headed to the river with a pretty simple plan, figure on walk and wade but take the boat since I can. You all know that there are days that we just weren't meant to go fishing right? So I get about 5 or 6 miles from home and realize that my Plano Soft Sider bag that holds all those plastic boxes filled with flies wasn't in the back of the truck. Call it a premonition of sorts because the thought came from nowhere, poof! You don't have flies!

So I turn around, not easy with the trailer and boat but I find a place and spin the rig and head for home. Into the drive and out to the end where I've built a big key hole type turn around area and next thing you know I'm back at the front door and pointed back toward the road...……….. Grab the flies and all is well, back on the way to the river. I check the dash clock; 12:24 PM, not too much time lost.

Next thing I know there is a dog, a big tall, tan hound dog type who simply walks out onto the road and stops! This is a 55 MPH road and I'm doing about 50, It's been a while since I've had to make an emergency stop while pulling a trailer but here comes one. I did the get on the brakes while hoping he would keep walking but no, he stopped so I end up locked up. I stop, he walks on. I'm flashing my lights at an oncoming pickup so they will notice old Eeyore the dog ambles across the road then stops and looks at me sitting there, I like to think he was saying thanks buddy...…….. A ways up the road I pull over to check things like the gas tank in the boat which thankfully is strapped down very well and all is well. My gear only had slid halfway up the truck bed so I was happy I wouldn't have to crawl into the bed just to get my stuff.

Onward to the river. Once I had parked I went on with the plan. Leave the boat trailered - rig a rod and walk up river with Boss. This was to be a good thing, I'd get to fish and Boss would get his walk all at the same time. There were a couple catches though. First was I assembled my rod and when I reached into the tackle bag for that snazzy new Sage Spectrum Max whit the 540 Super Scandi on it...….. It wasn't there! Alright, there's a Hardy Uniqua large arbor so all is not lost but the Hardy has a new Rio Skagit Max 550 on it with 11 feet of Z-9, not what I had planned on at all but hey, it's a reel. Next catch is with all the rain the shoreline is water and the sand and silt is like glue and the glue is about 4" deep. Now that sounds like fun doesn't it? Walking about half a mile or so through 4" thick muck covered by another 4" of water? Oh yeah this is getting good now...…..

Boss is almost 14 and he's having some trouble wading the muck so we hit the land. There is a half assed trail that moose made and foot fishermen follow along this river and it ain't pretty. Strewn with downed alder trees and brush I can honestly say that walking there sucks as bad as trying to muck your way upstream. When I finally got half way to where I really wanted to be I said to Boss, "This is why we use a boat Bud". Now came trying to fish.

I was out of my element with the short head and long sinktip. I can definitely see how it will work on really swift water for down stream casts but this water moves about 3.5 to 4.5 MPH in the average flow and I had a hard time. I spent the time practicing how to get good cast turn overs with it. It will fly across the river and pull a load of running line behind it but once it landed I was like a fish outta water myself. So I turned the casts to sharply quartered down and across then just did the cross channel thing. By the time we worked down to the launch area I hadn't had a touch.

If I'd had other line choices I may have put the boat in and headed up river to places where I always seem to get a few fish but after all the omens I'd had cast before me that day I decided to go sit on the tailgate and enjoy the mild (54*) weather of the late afternoon. First thing I did yesterday evening when I got settled at home was to put 2 reels in my bag, one with a 45 S. Scandi and a 55 mid belly.

You guys who like your longer lines know exactly how I felt out there I hope. I'm a tinkerer, I like my goofy leader system with the mini heads. I like the mending, the strategizing as I make my way along and down a section of water and somehow I always seem to catch something even though I'm doing things differently. When I think back; forgotten flies - the hound - the reel - the muck and difficult path...….. I probably will turn around after the second omen next time:)

Today I'm going to clean the shop up and tomorrow I believe I'll head to Talkeetna and see how the water is up that way.
 

flytie09

Well-known member
Messages
7,254
Reaction score
10,083
Location
PA
Quite the adventure there Ard. There is something to be said for those that simplify and stick to one method / rod / line system that works.

Unfortunately I'm not in that boat yet. I carry enough stuff with me on my steelhead trips than one person should ever need...... more leaders, lines and flies than I can count. But I've developed a system for me to try to help keep these various line packages organized.

- Color coding my leaders...both polyleaders and T tips.
- A storage system for my shooting heads.... 325 grain Scandis up to 600 grain Skagits.
- Backup to the backup rods and reels

But my fishing adventures are along an 8 mile stretch, with plenty of fly shops around, traveling by car and walking along well trodden trails. Not the AK bush.

Many a well planned trip has resulted in an a **** moment I'm sure.

Thanks for sharing....

ft09
 

Ard

Forum Member
Staff member
Messages
26,183
Reaction score
16,363
Location
Wasilla / Skwentna, Alaska
That's a lot of organization skill there.

It really was unusual because I do my best to keep things simple. The thing with all the flies being in that Plano bag is because I'm almost always traveling by boat. If I start dividing things up then I know I'll be headed for trouble. The reel thing, that was the result of too much Reel Love. I've had that thing in my hands more than mounted to a rod and simply failed to put it back in the tackle tote. I have a 2 O clock appointment to make today so everything gets a break. I do believe I'll head north tomorrow morning though. What has been holding me back beside the 170 mile round trip is the launch there is a nightmare. Once you get out of the launch the river can be scary also and I'm traveling alone there. Getting back into the launch is easy because you can come in on step for the large part but getting out is tricky. My sources tell me the fishing is good but I always wonder if I'd catch a bigger one at my home river..............
 

Unknownflyman

Well-known member
Messages
4,393
Reaction score
3,116
Location
The North
New spey section??? And people conversing? Very nice.

I bought a 13’ Sage pulse and I cast a Rio scandi with leader the rig is 60 feet.

I have my eye on a older Sage Z axis 13’ 6” and a fall favorite line which I cast at the spey clave which I really liked. It sounds like he wants to sell and get something else.

I still have my 12’9” echo but it’s just to soft for me after casting Sage rods, still it’s a good skagit rod and throws a full skagit and 10’ of T- 14 a good distance.

Probably my favorite in the long class was a 15’ green blank Sage 10Wt and I hate to say it but I preferred a long 1000 grain skagit over a 77’ long belly Rio.

Long belly’s are so much work.
 

eastfly66

Well-known member
Messages
4,771
Reaction score
1,931
Location
MA
New spey section??? And people conversing? Very nice.

I bought a 13’ Sage pulse and I cast a Rio scandi with leader the rig is 60 feet.

I have my eye on a older Sage Z axis 13’ 6” and a fall favorite line which I cast at the spey clave which I really liked. It sounds like he wants to sell and get something else..
I have and just fished the Z axis 7136 this last trip and love it. What's your opinion on the Pulse ? I'm thinking about a Pulse switch ?
 

lake flyer

Well-known member
Messages
809
Reaction score
479
Location
Northern Michigan
Hey Ard, my go-to rod is an ARE 13’ 7-8wt , that if I have a little backcast room, I line with an old Windcutter VersiTip. For most situations the intermediate tip works just fine. I use Pflueger 1498 reels and carry an extra spool with a Skagit 480 if I find a deep hole that needs a deeper presentation with a weighted fly or am backed up against the bank with little backcast room. Switching back and forth between lines really takes some adjusting in casting each.
 

flav

Well-known member
Messages
2,110
Reaction score
1,889
Location
oregon
I fished a couple different versions of 65 foot midspeys for years. I mostly fish a scandi these days, but still break out the longer heads a couple times a season.

I also fish the rio single hand spey on my favorite 9 foot 4 weight, it's 35 foot head qualifies as a midbelly if you do the math.
 

Unknownflyman

Well-known member
Messages
4,393
Reaction score
3,116
Location
The North
I have and just fished the Z axis 7136 this last trip and love it. What's your opinion on the Pulse ? I'm thinking about a Pulse switch ?
Well my pulse is a 13’ spey don’t know anything about the switch version but I like mine a lot. It’s not as nice as my X but good performance and feel. I knocked out 100’ plus casts all night long in Sweden. I picked up mine used for $270 delivered. It was brand new the guy either didn’t use it or took really good care of it.

My medium and small river rod is my switch 11’ sage x, for me it doesn’t get any better.
 

Ard

Forum Member
Staff member
Messages
26,183
Reaction score
16,363
Location
Wasilla / Skwentna, Alaska
I fished a couple different versions of 65 foot midspeys for years. I mostly fish a scandi these days, but still break out the longer heads a couple times a season.

I also fish the rio single hand spey on my favorite 9 foot 4 weight, it's 35 foot head qualifies as a midbelly if you do the math.
I still have a sixty five foot Rio Mid Spey and a 70 foot Partridge Ian Gordon line too, both are for 15 foot rods and they seem Scandi like on the longer rods. Almost all my fishing now happens with the 45 foot Super Scandi lines from S. Godshall. I really like the way they work and they allow me to fish at 70 foot with good control.

You guys are up and on here late, especially you Steve. I'm going to shut down soon because I'm going pretty far north of home tomorrow and need to get up early for that. I do hope the weather gives me a break :)
 

eastfly66

Well-known member
Messages
4,771
Reaction score
1,931
Location
MA
My medium and small river rod is my switch 11’ sage x, for me it doesn’t get any better.
I haven't completely figured out if the switch is right for me yet, can you define your idea of medium and small river and what you throw with it ?
Thanxs
Paul

** Sorry for the highjacking , as to the topic , I was going to get a mid belly either Ballistic or Rio but after some careful thought I decided to hold until I have my mechanics more consistent with what I have rather than complicate things.
 

coug

Well-known member
Messages
1,357
Reaction score
847
Location
Snake, Clearwater and tribs
This time of year I use a 54' line on my 8142 or 8152, and a 63' line on the 8152. The Gaelforce lines have no problem with 15' polys, but I usually use mono.
 

Unknownflyman

Well-known member
Messages
4,393
Reaction score
3,116
Location
The North
I haven't completely figured out if the switch is right for me yet, can you define your idea of medium and small river and what you throw with it ?
Thanxs
Paul

** Sorry for the highjacking , as to the topic , I was going to get a mid belly either Ballistic or Rio but after some careful thought I decided to hold until I have my mechanics more consistent with what I have rather than complicate things.
I wish I could define that for you but I can’t. I fish many areas with a 13’ where I think it works better even with overhanging branches and most guys are using 11’ range rods and I also use a switch where many prefer a spey.


What I can tell you is I don’t define river size by rod length. Unless it’s a creek but I refuse to fish steelhead in those waters where easy exploitation occurs.

I determine rig size and line by the size of the D loop I can get away with. Many times I wish certain stretches of my rivers could have just a bit more room for a larger D loop and I can fish a longer rod and line but the D loop is always in the woods.

Managing overhead branches and D loop clearance can be done but it’s just too frustrating for meditative fishing.

At that point I shorten the line or rod or both.
 

randyflycaster

Well-known member
Messages
834
Reaction score
19
According to Simon Gawesworth, with a 60 foot belly line you'll need about 12 feet of back cast room, which comes out to about a fifth the length of the belly.

Also, for mid-belly lines I like Bob Meiser's ratio of belly length to rod length to be about 4 to 1, so for a 60 foot belly line, I would want at least a 15 foot rod,

Randy
 
Last edited:
Top