Exercise: Try casting... with no rod

[mjkirshner]

I was watching a Lefty Kreh instructional clip on YouTube, and some of the people who wrote comments mentioned seeing Lefty casting almost an entire length of fly line with only his hand. That seems the stuff of legend, and I would think that if it were really possible, there would be some video or photographic evidence... and I can't find any. However, it got me thinking that a proper casting motion may be able to throw a short length of line even without a rod, and it might make a good casting exercise. So, I grabbed a reel with some 5-wt line on it, went out and laid about 10 feet of line (plus a 9' leader) on the grass. Holding the reel in my casting hand, with my elbow tight against my side, I pulled it back in a side-arm casting motion, rotating my body, and stopping where I would normally stop a back-cast (think of pull-starting a lawnmower)... and the line came back in a clean looking loop and laid out straight on the grass behind me. Then I "cast" the reel forward, like throwing a baseball (without releasing it, though), and the line went forward in a nice tight loop and laid out straight in front. I stripped off some more line and tried again... and it worked. I found that I can throw about 20 feet of line plus the leader, as long as I keep a straight casting stroke. If I arc the reel outward on either the forward or back cast, the line curves and falls in a loose arc next to me. It takes more energy than casting a rod, but it really magnifies any error. If you do not keep a straight line in the stroke, the line won't lay out straight. But when you get the stroke right, it actually looks ridiculous, seeing 20 feet of fly line looping nicely off the reel and laying out in a perfect straight line, with no fly rod. I still don't know if Lefty Kreh could really throw 100 feet of fly line with no rod, but I think this exercise is going to help me cast with a rod.

 

[napawino]

What is used to deliver the line isn't important . It's all about how well it's delivered. Rod's just make it easier.

 

[huronfly]

I've seen a video of another fella doing this same thing, cast an entire fly line with no rod... Ill try to find it.

Edit- he was not casting an entire line, just 30 feet, but made it look easy

 

[timmah]

I've seen a video of another fella doing this same thing, cast an entire fly line with no rod... Ill try to find it.

Edit- he was not casting an entire line, just 30 feet, but made it look easy

This one? https://youtu.be/q0fES1sfBRE

 

[huronfly]

This one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TL0VqSRjpFk

 

[bloomagoo]

Okay, it can be done, but look how hard he's working to get that 30 ft cast. It really underscores the value of the rod as a tool to deliver the fly line with a minimum of effort and far greater accuracy.

 

[cpowell]

https://youtu.be/2cRe3-cSgIg

 

[pnc]

Not sure if , Lefty Kreh ever did so. But I'm sure he could.
Did not look at click on stuff. Seen it done enough. Do it at exhibitions.

Really quite simple...... not hard to do. Trick or tricks are to grease hand line passes through. And dbl haul. All about line speed.

Most people are so riveted to line hand they don't notice hauling. Or maybe they can't see over those in front of them. Not sure what is seen in videos.

........ pc

---------- Post added at 08:13 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:03 AM ----------

Sorry just realized....... this is ok for f'n around (funnin). Not good for practicing casting with rod. It will destroy your timing. Unless you can seperate the two in your mind.

...... pc

---------- Post added at 08:43 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:13 AM ----------

Another thought.... if this is meant to add difficulty to practice. My way of doing so is to use longer rods. Aside from what fishing I do. I'll practice with whatever rod I expect to use on next club outing. At times half of which is longer rod before switching to rod going to be used.
Most practice I do is Hula-hoop. West side of Florida is windy. Just changing angles creates different situations. Only go longer for nit picking cast.

....... pc

 

[ottosmagic13]

I tend to "test" newly tied leaders by holding the fly line end loop between my thumb and fore finger and "casting" it to see if it lays out straight. Never tried it with a fly line.


Would be interesting to see a "hand lined" fish. Most of my catches are at sub-30 yards and that seems to be the limit of sane rodless casting. Maybe if I get bored at the bluegill hole...

 

[Hirdy]

It can be done (maybe not the whole line) but a double haul is required.

 

[pnc]

Yes whole line out of hand. Man that showed me used line from plastic spool line came on. Said it got more notice like that at demo's. There is no knot at end of line to go through guides. This also helps. Started as conversation that led to ........ C'mon I'll show you. After a few minutes. I asked if whole line was possible. Answer was ........ "Yes, but one problem". I asked what ? He let one go..... tag end landed maybe 25' away. Looked at me and said...... " You go get it, wind it back up. It's hot out here". And went back in.

The reasons he used this at demo's. Was same as mine has been since. To demonstrate the effect hauling can have (funny part is most don't notice hauling until pointed out). Once done, rod goes into whomever's hand is learning.

............. pc

---------- Post added at 01:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:02 PM ----------

Sorry forgot........... if one should find themselves near Dade City, Fl. Go to Swan's Fly Shop. The guy behind the growing pile of flies. Isn't Santa Claus , it's , Jim. A character worth meeting ! Pushing 90 now. Maybe if you ask nice ?

......... pc

 

[canoeman1947]

I had heard this story about Lefty before, then I read his autobiography. He had started a new job as director of the Metropolitan fishing tournament in Miami. His old friend Joe Brooks had told him that the saltwater fly fishing captains were pretty arrogant and he needed to do something to get their attention right off the bat. When he met with them he was introduced as the guy who was going to show them a little about casting. He said he noticed quite a few smirks from those present. He laid 85 feet of fly line out on the ground, picked it up into a backcast and then forward, laying out the whole line. He got their attention. A good friend of mine to whom I mentioned this story was one of those present. He said he had never seen anyone who could cast like Lefty.

Larry

 

[three rivers]

I was watching a Lefty Kreh instructional clip on YouTube, and some of the people who wrote comments mentioned seeing Lefty casting almost an entire length of fly line with only his hand. That seems the stuff of legend, and I would think that if it were really possible, there would be some video or photographic evidence... and I can't find any. However, it got me thinking that a proper casting motion may be able to throw a short length of line even without a rod, and it might make a good casting exercise. So, I grabbed a reel with some 5-wt line on it, went out and laid about 10 feet of line (plus a 9' leader) on the grass. Holding the reel in my casting hand, with my elbow tight against my side, I pulled it back in a side-arm casting motion, rotating my body, and stopping where I would normally stop a back-cast (think of pull-starting a lawnmower)... and the line came back in a clean looking loop and laid out straight on the grass behind me. Then I "cast" the reel forward, like throwing a baseball (without releasing it, though), and the line went forward in a nice tight loop and laid out straight in front. I stripped off some more line and tried again... and it worked. I found that I can throw about 20 feet of line plus the leader, as long as I keep a straight casting stroke. If I arc the reel outward on either the forward or back cast, the line curves and falls in a loose arc next to me. It takes more energy than casting a rod, but it really magnifies any error. If you do not keep a straight line in the stroke, the line won't lay out straight. But when you get the stroke right, it actually looks ridiculous, seeing 20 feet of fly line looping nicely off the reel and laying out in a perfect straight line, with no fly rod. I still don't know if Lefty Kreh could really throw 100 feet of fly line with no rod, but I think this exercise is going to help me cast with a rod.

I don't know whether anyone ever cast a whole line by hand - maybe they did, maybe they didn't. As a party trick it would be fun, but that's not really the point. No-one is suggesting you could or should actually fish that way. The key thing here is the motion required to cast a line by hand, even if only ten feet. Get that right, and casting with a rod becomes simple. As a youngster we did not have a large garden so practising with a full length rod was out of the question. I started casting with just the top section, holding the reel in my left hand, then tried without any rod at all. I never attempted more than about fifteen feet as there wasn't room, but I did get quite accurate.

I've since taught a few people to cast, many of whom had seen fly casting done and thought you had to wave your arm in a wide arc. Trying to correct that and impart the correct sense of motion is difficult when they are holding a rod. By removing the rod from the equation they very quickly find that waving the arm in an arc makes the line describe a similar arc in the air, but if they pull back straight and throw forward straight, the line follows. Five minutes of that and you can put the reel back on the rod, thread up the line and get them to repeat what they just did.

 

[ia_trouter]

Believe it was Wolfglen that mentioned using a pencil for a fly rod during casting clinics for new students. The bit of extra leverage made it easy. Not so much to show off, but to drive home the point that your form is everything, and any rod should be adequate for a modest distance cast.

 

[Flyfisher for men]

Believe it was Wolfglen that mentioned using a pencil for a fly rod during casting clinics for new students. The bit of extra leverage made it easy. Not so much to show off, but to drive home the point that your form is everything, and any rod should be adequate for a modest distance cast.

Bingo. A fly cast works on the very same principles as cracking a bullwhip, only you use more finesse, control, and timing to get the rod to load. Back in my day as a beginner, that realization was when the light bulb went on.

A few years ago, I bought this book: http://L.L. Bean Ultimate Book of Fly Fishing. Macauley Lord has a bit in there about flycasting without a rod just "playing around." He also double hauls with his foot in another spot.

To play around a bit myself, I cut a piece of twine a moment ago and managed to get the beginnings of J-loops with a bare hand. I tied it to a ruler and the loops began to improve and looked recognizable as what happens in a fly cast.

 

[silver creek]

I was watching a Lefty Kreh instructional clip on YouTube, and some of the people who wrote comments mentioned seeing Lefty casting almost an entire length of fly line with only his hand. That seems the stuff of legend, and I would think that if it were really possible, there would be some video or photographic evidence... and I can't find any. However, it got me thinking that a proper casting motion may be able to throw a short length of line even without a rod, and it might make a good casting exercise. So, I grabbed a reel with some 5-wt line on it, went out and laid about 10 feet of line (plus a 9' leader) on the grass. Holding the reel in my casting hand, with my elbow tight against my side, I pulled it back in a side-arm casting motion, rotating my body, and stopping where I would normally stop a back-cast (think of pull-starting a lawnmower)... and the line came back in a clean looking loop and laid out straight on the grass behind me. Then I "cast" the reel forward, like throwing a baseball (without releasing it, though), and the line went forward in a nice tight loop and laid out straight in front. I stripped off some more line and tried again... and it worked. I found that I can throw about 20 feet of line plus the leader, as long as I keep a straight casting stroke. If I arc the reel outward on either the forward or back cast, the line curves and falls in a loose arc next to me. It takes more energy than casting a rod, but it really magnifies any error. If you do not keep a straight line in the stroke, the line won't lay out straight. But when you get the stroke right, it actually looks ridiculous, seeing 20 feet of fly line looping nicely off the reel and laying out in a perfect straight line, with no fly rod. I still don't know if Lefty Kreh could really throw 100 feet of fly line with no rod, but I think this exercise is going to help me cast with a rod.

Some fly casters, who really are into casting without a rod, have ring made for the index finger of the casting hand with a line guide soldered to it. The index finger then acts as a real rod tip. Then the caster can really double haul effectively.

However, there is a tendency, when this "trick cast" is performed to assume that the casting motion or stroke of the hand is what should be performed also with a fly rod. This is a fallacious assumption.

There is a problem with thinking that casting without a rod is the same motion as casting without a rod. When you cast without a rod, the hand and casting finger move in a straight line. The finger/hand IS THE ROD TIP. Regardless of whether you are casting a short line or a longer line, the hand and finger "casting stroke" ALWAYS goes in a straight line path to produce a tight loop. What varies is the length a speed of the stroke path.

When you cast with a rod, there is a DISCONNECT between the casting stroke of the hand and the rod tip path. That disconnect is the fact that the ROD BENDS and the casting stroke of the rod hand IS NOT the path of the rod tip. Notice how the rod tip bends and comes closer to the casting hand in the image below. This shortens the "effective rod length."

The casting stroke MUST correct for this rod bending and rod shortening if the rod tip is to travel in a straight line. And rate of acceleration and the the shape of the rod stroke VARIES as the length of the fly cast varies. It is quite remarkable, when you think about it.

Therefore, what casting without a rod does not demonstrate is a proper rod stroke. What it DOES demonstrate is that, even without the mechanical advantage of a rod to magnify the fly line velocity, accelerating the fly line in a straight line path will produce a tight loop and cast the fly line.